# An AC-130 in World War 2 **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 28, 2012, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582 "2012-06-28T14:54:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/21 "2012-06-28T16:07:56Z")
from wiki on the A-10 Combat radius: On CAS mission: 250 nmi (288 mi, 460 km) at 1.88 hour single-engine loiter at 5,000 ft (1,500 m), 10 min combat. If it’s taking off from the UK it can’t get anywhere near it’s target. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/22 "2012-06-28T16:11:59Z")
The A-10 is _extremely_ durable. Its like a flying cast iron bathtub. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/23 "2012-06-28T16:18:00Z")
If Hitler is in the Lair, it really doesn’t matter what you send back without nukes. It won’t work. So change the date and time to some selected time when you know he is en-route on the train. _Then_ take it out with whatever overkill you want. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/24 "2012-06-28T16:23:17Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > If Hitler is in the Lair, it really doesn’t matter what you send back without nukes. It won’t work. Yes it will, Earthquake bomb dropped from 40,000 feet can penetrate 40m underground. The wolfs lair had only 2 meters of steel hardened concrete. > **[Earthquake bomb](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_quake_bomb)** > > The earthquake bomb, or seismic bomb, was a concept that was invented by the British aeronautical engineer Barnes Wallis early in World War II and subsequently developed and used during the war against strategic targets in Europe. A seismic bomb differs somewhat in concept from a traditional bomb, which usually explodes at or near the surface and destroys its target directly by explosive force; in contrast, a seismic bomb is dropped from high altitude to attain very high speed as it falls and Ea... You just need a plane that can fly higher than any 1941 interceptor and accurate aiming. Going for the least time distortion effects, I’m going to pick a B-50 superfortress (introduced in 1947) which can fly at 36,900 feet, should be comfortably clear of any interceptors in 1941. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/25 "2012-06-28T16:27:10Z")
> [@lazybratsche](#): > > An A-10 can carry some more appropriate ordinance, but it’s still extremely vulnerable to AAA. It’s not that much faster or durable than WW2 ground attack planes. Send all the ordinances you like, I suspect Hitler will be laughing even if you throw the book at him. ---
**Author:** ![lazybratsche](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ba8739/32.png) [@lazybratsche](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lazybratsche)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/26 "2012-06-28T16:31:04Z")
Durable, yes, but not invulnerable. WWII anti-air guns were pretty equivalent to what we have today – your typical 40 mm hasn’t changed at all, though today it will have better fire control systems. And in WWII, there were an awful lot of even heavier guns, the 88s and 128s. Those were powerful enough to destroy any contemporary heavy tanks. My WAG is that an A-10 can brush off small arms fire and indirect flak hits all day, survive a few hits from medium guns, but it’d still go down after a few hits from the bigger guns. It’s fast and maneuverable enough to evade incoming fire pretty effectively, but dodging only gets you so far when there are a hundred different guns shooting at you from all directions. ---
**Author:** ![lazybratsche](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ba8739/32.png) [@lazybratsche](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lazybratsche)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/27 "2012-06-28T16:33:59Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Send all the ordinances you like, I suspect Hitler will be laughing even if you throw the book at him. 😃 Excuse me, Mr Hitler, but I’m here to inform you that this area is zoned as residential, which prohibits the construction of any impenetrable doom fortresses. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/28 "2012-06-28T16:34:19Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > It’s the evening of June 21st, 1941. How would you get U. S. Air Force (the only operator of the AC-130) crews to fire on a country we aren’t at war with (yet)? ---
**Author:** ![yoyodyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a9a28c/32.png) [@yoyodyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yoyodyne)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/29 "2012-06-28T16:45:49Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > Well, there’s collateral damage and there’s using 18 kitotons to kill one bloke! Dropping an A-bomb on Munich would cause far less damage than WWII. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/30 "2012-06-28T16:49:08Z")
If your objective is to deliver a killing blow against the [Wolf’s Lair](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolf%27s_Lair)from Allied-held territory with a modern weapon, what keeps tripping you up is trying to fight your way in using some manned vehicle (tank or gunship). Why not skip (or arc) over all that, taking a page from Hitler’s own book, and use an ICBM like a Minuteman III? The _Wolfsschanze_ was relatively remote from population centers, which might ease your decision. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/31 "2012-06-28T16:52:33Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > But Hitler himself was a darn hard target. I wonder what other target on that night might have been identifiable and hyper-critical. I think killing Hitler would be a bad idea unless you got him well before he managed to take control of Germany. IIRC the allies even decided against going after Hitler because they figured he was more hindrance than help to their war effort. If you knocked him off and Germany’s very competent generals started running the war it would be a bad thing for the allies. ---
**Author:** ![Whiteknight](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whiteknight/32/4962_2.png) [@Whiteknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whiteknight)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/32 "2012-06-28T17:09:03Z")
Utmost apologies to Mr. Kobayashi for stealing his theme, but I love [these](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=15217376#post15217376) [threads](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=655836). This time the Timey-Wimey Ball is used to send back a fully-loaded, fully-manned Nimitz class carrier with a full air wing of F/A-18E/F Super Hornets and/or F/A-18C Hornets plus support aircraft like some helos, AEW&Cs, and such. Suppose it arrives in Portsmouth on June 1, 1944. How does it fare? Any difference if it’s a Ford class? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/33 "2012-06-28T17:13:01Z")
> [@Whiteknight](#): > > Utmost apologies to Mr. Kobayashi for stealing his theme, but I love [these](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=15217376#post15217376) [threads](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=655836). > > This time the Timey-Wimey Ball is used to send back a fully-loaded, fully-manned Nimitz class carrier with a full air wing of F/A-18E/F Super Hornets and/or F/A-18C Hornets plus support aircraft like some helos, AEW&Cs, and such. Suppose it arrives in Portsmouth on June 1, 1944. How does it fare? > > Any difference if it’s a Ford class? In [The Final Coundown](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Final_Countdown_%28film%29) the USS Nimitz is send back to Pearl Habour. Edit; and this thread: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=564113&highlight=Nimitz](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=564113&highlight=Nimitz) ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/34 "2012-06-28T17:31:34Z")
To be fair, the main problem the AC-130 will have is the _Luftwaffe_. Taking one back in time to some pre-airplane era would work vastly better – for example, an AC-130 could have done a _great deal_ of damage in the American Civil War. ---
**Author:** ![kombatminipig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5ac83/32.png) [@kombatminipig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kombatminipig)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/35 "2012-06-28T17:45:11Z")
Hm, I said so in my first post but I’ll ask again, why not run in at night? AAA would be firing blind. The poor German radar deployed at the time would be eaten up by the AC-130s ECM and night fighter tactics were largely undeveloped. Most modern attack aircraft have night bombing capabilities. ---
**Author:** ![Shosy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@Shosy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shosy)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/36 "2012-06-28T17:47:38Z")
> [@Whiteknight](#): > > Utmost apologies to Mr. Kobayashi for stealing his theme, but I love [these](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=15217376#post15217376) [threads](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=655836). > > This time the Timey-Wimey Ball is used to send back a fully-loaded, fully-manned Nimitz class carrier with a full air wing of F/A-18E/F Super Hornets and/or F/A-18C Hornets plus support aircraft like some helos, AEW&Cs, and such. Suppose it arrives in Portsmouth on June 1, 1944. How does it fare? > > Any difference if it’s a Ford class? One thing the nature of war has changed from bulk destruction to a more surgical strike type mission. The AC-130, nuclear weapons, etc are hold overs from that time. My point is, lets say the Nimitz suddenly shows up and Donitz sends 50% of the U-boat fleet to go sink it. Is the anti-sub warfare systems carried by the Nimitz capable of destroying so many targets, especially without supply replenishment? Probably not because it’s setup to destroy fewer larger, more sophisticated submarines. It’s a similar issue with trying to sink an Iowa class battleship with a current anti-ship weapon, they just aren’t designed to sink such a ship. A flip side has always been, say Germany had a squadron of fully loaded Eurofighters. What could that squadron do against a 1000 plane B-17 raid? (although a cold war era nuclear tipped nike missle would probably have caused a pause in the bombing). Anyway if you were going to try and stop Hitler, the easiest way with probably to go back when he’s an art student, tell him you want to buy some of his work, get him alone, blow his brains out. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/37 "2012-06-28T17:52:46Z")
> [@lazybratsche](#): > > WWII anti-air guns were pretty equivalent to what we have today – your typical 40 mm hasn’t changed at all, though today it will have better fire control systems. [You’re not just whistling Dixie](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bofors_40_mm). > [@](#): > > The Bofors 40 mm gun is an anti-aircraft autocannon designed by the Swedish defence firm Bofors Defence. It was one of the most popular medium-weight anti-aircraft systems during World War II, used by most of the western Allies as well as by the Axis powers. The cannon remains in service as of 2012, making it one of the longest-serving artillery pieces of all time. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/38 "2012-06-28T17:53:01Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > To be fair, the main problem the AC-130 will have is the _Luftwaffe_. Taking one back in time to some pre-airplane era would work vastly better – for example, an AC-130 could have done a _great deal_ of damage in the American Civil War. Not so much I expect. It’d run out of gas and/or ammo pretty quickly and that would be the end of it back then. It could certainly single-handedly have turned the tide of any one battle with ease though. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/39 "2012-06-28T18:31:27Z")
Might I offer a slight tweak to your plan? Instead of an AC-130, switch out for an MC-130 equipped with a BLU-82 (Daisy Cutter). You will need a lot of close air support to reach your target, but I think you might have a better chance at getting Hitler. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582/40 "2012-06-28T18:35:04Z")
> [@kombatminipig](#): > > Hm, I said so in my first post but I’ll ask again, why not run in at night? An AH-130 isn’t a bomber. It’s a gunship. You’d be pecking at the surface of a bunker, if you were going for an assassination run. There’s enough AA defense, they wouldn’t have to see you very well to knock you out of the sky through sheer volume of fire. No radar, but they didn’t really have radar to jam anyway. Eyeballs would be quite sufficient once you started firing and gave them a target. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ac-130-in-world-war-2/626582.md?page=3)