# An apology and some clarifications **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 9, 2002, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058 "2002-05-09T11:41:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/1 "2002-05-09T11:41:26Z")
First of all, I didn’t post yesterday because I was undergoing a dental proceedure undersedation. I was briefly awake long enough to eat dinner, but that is about it, until about 6:30 this morning. Next, I’d like to apologize to those who took offense to my analogy. I think it has been explained by now so that everyone knows what I meant, so I won’t go into that, but I honestly did not intend to get anyone angry over it. I also absolutely do NOT equate leather bookbinding with anything about the Holocaust, nor do I think that human and animal lives are equal (though I see it as more of a light grey/dark grey than a black/white thing) Maybe it was delusional of me to not realize what the result would be, but in all honesty all I was trying to do was come up with an example that everyone would agree was “a bad thing”. I never meant to belittle the events of the Holocaust. As for the other things that were mentioned on that thread… I am not “fathomite” nor do I know who was. While the idea of someone defending me is nice, we really don’t need a board war. This isn’t about Fathom or the SDMB. I don’t own any human skin lampshades. Leather is not the be-all and end-all of morality for me. Nothing is black and white. Yes, I own some leather bound books that were passed down to me from my family. Their value goes beyond the leather covering. Just because I’m a vegetarian doesn’t mean that I am completely rigid and two dimensional. I don’t make any judgement against anyone who owns leather books. To me, a large part of what makes something a “sin” is thinking that something is wrong and doing it anyway. If it isn’t wrong for you, then it isn’t wrong for you. I emailed a few of you off-board, I hope that I didn’t intrude in doing so. ---
**Author:** ![Astroboy14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@Astroboy14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroboy14)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/2 "2002-05-09T11:46:37Z")
Thank you **Opal**! Although I stayed out of most of that mess, I appreciate the apology… That mess got really ugly, and I hope that this will end it, and we can all move on and leave this behind us. I hate to see people that I like sniping at each other over a careless remark! [Rodney King] Can’t we all just gt along?[/RK]😉 ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/3 "2002-05-09T12:01:34Z")
It takes some kind of guts to come back here and face the crap which has been thrown at you in the last couple of days **Opal**. We have different opinions on most issues, and we probably will always disagree on those issues, but I certainly admire your class in starting this thread, and I still have no respect whatsoever for those who sought to drag your past into this argument. You had the guts to return and post when you knew many people were going to try to prove you “wrong”; it takes balls to do that. I’ll almost certainly disagree with you many times in the future, but it’s nice to know that I’m disagreeing with a person who has enough guts to lay herself open and say “maybe I wasn’t right”.it can’t have been easy for you to come back **Opal** ; more power to you for doing so. ---
**Author:** ![flyboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/4da419/32.png) [@flyboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flyboy)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/4 "2002-05-09T12:34:01Z")
Thanks for clarifying this, **Opal**. I hate to sound like a stick in the mud, though, but I’m wondering if you’ve extended an apology to **Darwin’s Finch** or if your original attitude toward him and his post remain. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/5 "2002-05-09T12:37:11Z")
You got balls girl 🙂 Isn’t it mad how things get out of hand so quickly on a MB. I guarantee that if that had of been a RL conversation between you and Darwins Finch it would of ended very quickly with a “Ahh, fair enough. Each to his/her own” but alas it didn’t and got blown up out of all proportions. I doubt many reckoned you where fathomite. That’s definitely not your way of doing things. Anyhoo glad to see that you posted this thread. All the best. ---
**Author:** ![kellibelli](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e480ec/32.png) [@kellibelli](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kellibelli)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/6 "2002-05-09T13:01:42Z")
Nicely done Opal, lets see if everyone else is as magnanimous. Glad to see you are feeling better too K ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/7 "2002-05-09T13:13:50Z")
Well done, and happy to see it. We only flame the ones we love. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Zoff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/6de8d8/32.png) [@Zoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoff)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/8 "2002-05-09T13:19:40Z")
Thanks for starting this thread **OpalCat**. Hopefully your post will set an example and let everybody cool down. I wanted to stay way the hell away from this whole issue when it was burning hot. Now that things are back to normal, I’d like to make a suggestion about dealing with questions regarding the metes and bounds of your vegetarianism. I’m sure that you’ve dealt with a number of people who just want to attack you and that probably makes you a little defensive. But not every question is a veiled attack. I’ve known a lot of vegetarians through the years and their outlooks have been varied. The word “vegetarian” isn’t a very exact term and so clarification is often needed so people know exactly where any given vegetarian stands. I though **Darwin’s Finch’s** question, while blunt, was legitimate. Your subsequent posts, including the OP here, have clarified a lot regarding your beliefs. But we’re not inside your head and we don’t know the contours of your ethical beliefs. Just because a poster is using a definition that doesn’t exactly apply to you doesn’t mean he’s attacking you. I hope my ramble is clear and you are, of course, free to completely disregard it. I can appreciate that it must be frustrating to hear cheap shots about your beliefs because I believe a few things that elicit snide comments a lot. But I hope you will consider recalibrating what seems to be a bit of a hair trigger. ---
**Author:** ![Abe\_Babe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3ab097/32.png) [@Abe\_Babe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Abe_Babe)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/9 "2002-05-09T13:21:00Z")
> [@](#): > > _originally posted by Opalcat_ > I don’t own any human skin lampshades. Do you want some cheap? ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/10 "2002-05-09T13:43:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by OpalCat \* > \*\* > Next, I’d like to apologize to those who took offense to my analogy. I think it has been explained by now so that everyone knows what I meant, so I won’t go into that, but I honestly did not intend to get anyone angry over it. \*\* I understand that and I certainly didn’t jump to the conclusion that you were a horrible person because of what you said. I hope you understand why many of us had problems with what was said. > [@](#): > > \*\* > I also absolutely do NOT equate leather bookbinding with anything about the Holocaust, nor do I think that human and animal lives are equal (though I see it as more of a light grey/dark grey than a black/white thing) \*\* I’m a little curious. If you see it is a grey area then how can you **absolutely** not equate the two? Marc ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/11 "2002-05-09T13:45:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Astroboy14 \* > \*\* > That mess got really ugly, and I hope that this will end it, and we can all move on and leave this behind us. I hate to see people that I like sniping at each other over a careless remark! > > [Rodney King] Can’t we all just gt along?[/RK]😉 \*\* Ugly? I’ve been called worse things in threads that lasted much longer then Opals. Of course all of those actually started in the Pit not GD or the Cafe. Marc ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/12 "2002-05-09T13:56:57Z")
I did wonder about your teeth **Opal**. Hope you feel better soon. It was a real train wreck that thread. I can understand why you started it and I think it’s a fair enough issue, but boy to stay under control those vego threads need people to walk on eggsh… ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/13 "2002-05-09T14:00:22Z")
I was just an observer in that thread, but I was really curious why OpalCat completely ignored the helpful and directly relevant suggestions offered by **Anemone** and **fruitbat** while still complaining that everyone was focusing on her misunderstood morals and not answering her question. To me, that indicated that OpalCat had come in with a chip on her shoulder and was looking hoping for a little masochistic/martyristic “vindication” (maybe indicated by the revealing title of her subsequent thread) rather than a real answer to her question. I don’t mean to stir up trouble here, but I think OpalCat has a bit of a history of using this board as an outlet for her depressive cycles–flying off the handle about something, apologizing, and then getting {{{{hugs}}}} all around. I wasn’t that offended by the hysterical human lampshade analogy (though I understand why esp. European Dopers would have much stronger feelings about this), but if I were **Anemone** or **fruitbat** –or anyone else taking the trouble to try to give a helpful reply–I _would_ feel a bit used. Anyway, that’s just my interpretation of events. _Edited to remove link - CF_ ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/14 "2002-05-09T14:05:27Z")
I think the chip may have landed there when her thread got moved to the pit. She was talking about books, and perhaps making a mild complaint about marketing. All of a sudden, she is the author of a pit thread, which, as we all know is automatically a rant. So, everyone started ranting. Tris ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/15 "2002-05-09T14:08:11Z")
**Doghouse Reilly** that link was deleted from the last thread. Tut tut. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/16 "2002-05-09T14:12:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by yojimbo \* > \*\ ***Doghouse Reilly** that link was deleted from the last thread. > Tut tut. \*\* I didn’t see that–sorry if I am repeating something already asserted by someone else in the “Coldfire” thread, which I didn’t bother to read all the way through. But it still seems to me to be a valid observation. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/17 "2002-05-09T14:12:22Z")
[Eve takes out Grandmother’s silver tea set and pours everyone nice calming cups of Earl Grey, liberally dosed with morphine, so glad we are getting along again] “Scones, anyone?” ---
**Author:** ![Zoff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/6de8d8/32.png) [@Zoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoff)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/18 "2002-05-09T14:12:36Z")
> [@](#): > > I think the chip may have landed there when her thread got moved to the pit. Just as a point of clarification, the posts that really started things going badly were made before the thread was moved to the pit. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/19 "2002-05-09T14:14:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Doghouse Reilly \* > \*\*I don’t mean to stir up trouble here, but I think OpalCat has a bit of a history of using this board as an outlet for her depressive cycles–flying off the handle about something, apologizing, and then getting {{{{hugs}}}} all around. > \*\* …and, in fact, a history of using the Holocaust to illustate reletively petty analogies. Cite from the above thread: > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by OpalCat_I don’t even care about the contest > my complaint is that I was ASKED (REPEATEDLY, by MANY people) to run it > … then when I did, you’d think I was off murdering millions of jews or something. Opal, I do think that you’re sincere in your apology but this is apparantly not the first time you’ve resorted to such ignorant analogies. If, for the sake of argument, you didn’t do that anymore, you may just be able to avoid shit storms in the future. Enough is enough. Haj _Edited to remove link - CF_ ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058/20 "2002-05-09T14:15:04Z")
[Eve surreptitiously spits into Doghouse Reilly’s tea and gives him a Very Stern Look indeed] [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-apology-and-some-clarifications/108058.md?page=2)