# An idea for peace in the Jerusalem/Isreal **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 24, 2015, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693 "2015-08-24T05:24:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/61 "2015-08-24T08:22:37Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Right. Children. > > See, white people fight wars because of real reasons, like resources and ideology. When brown people fight, it’s because we’re children. You’re _brown?_ 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/62 "2015-08-24T08:29:23Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > You’re _brown?_ 😕 Why not? There are Jews who are Black, those who are Chinese, and even some who are white. I wouldn’t be surprised if there was at least one “Brown” Jew on the planet. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/63 "2015-08-24T08:32:18Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > You’re _brown?_ 😕 Sure. We’re a Semitic people, we speak a Semitic language, and we live in the Middle East. We’re natives. The fact that some of us have pale skin and light hair is irrelevant. Race, after all, is a social construct. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/64 "2015-08-24T08:34:09Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Why not? There are Jews who are Black, those who are Chinese, and even some who are white. I wouldn’t be surprised if there was at least one “Brown” Jew on the planet. Jews are neither white, nor black, nor Chinese, except on the most superficial cosmetic level. Jews are Jews. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/65 "2015-08-24T11:02:50Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > Yes, if it prevents bombings and terror on a daily basis then yes, we need to move. Hey, fair’s fair, right? So instead of waiting for a bunch of bombings, you and yours should up and depart before it reaches that point. So the questions I put to you are: [ol][li]For you and yours carried out all the way to the entire non-Native American population, where are you going to relocate _approximately three hundred twenty million people_ to?[/li][li]For your so-called solution to the issue in this thread (actually, it’s more than one issue, but hey, let’s go ahead and add that to the other “trivia” you’re ignoring), where are you going to relocate _almost one million_ people to?[/ol][/li] Come on. You can tell us. It’s not really both sides you want to “relocate”, now is it? Nor do you just want a particular group moved just across the city limits of Jerusalem, do you? After all, it’s not just the Jewish occupation and administration of Jerusalem that’s gotten certain other folks’ goat. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/66 "2015-08-24T11:04:43Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Jews are neither white, nor black, nor Chinese, except on the most superficial cosmetic level. Jews are Jews. Agreed. That was the point I was trying to make to a certain other poster. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/67 "2015-08-24T11:44:56Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > No Jews or Muslims are allowed to live there as permanent citizens. Any Jew or Muslim is allowed to visit there as a religious tourist any time they want. No police or military forces are allowed to operate that is either Jewish or Muslim. All police and military is run by the UN or some similar organization. If they will not stop fighting over who can occupy that piece of land it seems to be the only reasonable solution that neither can occupy it. Living there and citizenship are two different things. Either - you mean nobody lives there and everyone is forced to move to another country (in which case, try looking up the history of “ethnic cleansing” in Yugoslavia or “exchange of populations” between Greece and Turkey), or - you mean everybody who lives there loses citizenship rights and the territory is run by a government appointed by the UN (n which case, try looking up “League of Nations”+mandate+Palestine). ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/68 "2015-08-24T12:54:22Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > Two unruly children are having a fist fight. Separate them physically. Problem solved. If they cry and shout and pout about it, well, so what? Boy, that “White Man’s Burden” rests heavily on your shoulders, doesn’t it b’wana? ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/69 "2015-08-24T12:59:34Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > Ok > > So we separate any/all people that can not live side by side without bombing and terrorizing one another. > > I am sure you are going to call me stupid or naive. But in reality, no spot on the planet is that important that we should let people keep living there if it threatens peace and stability to the whole planet. …because ethnic cleansing is _always_ an effective solution to any problem with unruly natives. How good that there are Civilized People to bring the light of knowledge to these questions that locals are too simple to understand \< Blazing Saddles \> They’re such children \< /Blazing Saddles\> ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/70 "2015-08-24T13:01:49Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > They are already angry. Neither side is willing to make concessions. So pointing out that my plan will make them angry doesn’t really do much to change my mind. Take up the White Man’s burden— And reap his old reward: The blame of those ye better The hate of those ye guard— …c’mon. Your posts are meant to be some sort of meta-parody of imperialism, right? I mean…you can’t possibly be serious: you’re almost exactly quoting the poem. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/71 "2015-08-24T13:36:26Z")
👍🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/72 "2015-08-24T13:58:06Z")
I take it you like Kipling? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/73 "2015-08-24T14:00:37Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > No Jews or Muslims are allowed to live there as permanent citizens. This is such a great idea, I wonder why no one has seriously considered it. I’m just sore because I didn’t think of this solution, plus I guessed the poster’s join date wrong. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/74 "2015-08-24T14:20:45Z")
So, like, why don’t we build a giant dome covering the Jerusalem/Israel? That’ll seal off the place from outside troublemakers, and force the inhabitants to find a solution to their squabbles and live peacefully. It worked in the Simpsons Movie. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/75 "2015-08-24T14:35:32Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > So we separate any/all people that can not live side by side without bombing and terrorizing one another. But physical proximity is not the issue they are fighting over. The Jews and the Muslims both believe Jerusalem is a holy city to their religion. Moving them five thousand miles away from Jerusalem and ten thousand miles away from each other is not going to change that. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/76 "2015-08-24T14:48:42Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I take it you like Kipling? I don’t know, I’ve never Kippled. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/77 "2015-08-24T14:51:56Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But physical proximity is not the issue they are fighting over. The Jews and the Muslims both believe Jerusalem is a holy city to their religion. Moving them five thousand miles away from Jerusalem and ten thousand miles away from each other is not going to change that. Ooh! I know what we do! We physically move EVERYONE out _but we tell them it’s just temporary_ while we plan a really cool sweet sixteen party for the entire city! (If they don’t want to go, we promise them lollipops–they really ARE like children, you know). Then, when they’re in Tel Aviv or Gaza or something getting fitted for their dresses and tuxes for the big Sweet Sixteen party, we BLOW UP Jerusalem and then pave it over. We could maybe put in a mall and a rec center. An _atheist_ mall and rec center! Then when everyone gets back and see that the party was a fake and that the city is now mostly a parking lot, everyone will have a good laugh and then spend the night having a lock-in at the Rec Center where we’ll shoot hoops, have marshmallows and ginger ale and pizza, maybe dance to some mad tunes. Problem solved, OP style! Alessan: that would work for you, right? Or, in the words of Kipling: Take up the White Man’s burden— Send forth the best ye breed— Go send your sons to exile To serve your captives’ need To wait in heavy harness On fluttered folk and wild— Your new-caught, sullen peoples, Half devil and half child Take up the White Man’s burden In patience to abide To veil the threat of terror And check the show of pride; ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/78 "2015-08-24T14:59:55Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > So, like, why don’t we build a giant dome covering the Jerusalem/Israel? That’ll seal off the place from outside troublemakers, and force the inhabitants to find a solution to their squabbles and live peacefully. > > It worked in the Simpsons Movie. And in Mad Max 3: “Two religions enter… One religion leaves!” ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/79 "2015-08-24T15:00:42Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > I don’t know, I’ve never Kippled. Thank you! ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2015, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693/80 "2015-08-24T15:18:22Z")
Ethnic cleansing via forced migration kills a lot of people (see the India or Iraq partitions), but one could almost imagine it being preferable to some otherwise horrible genocidal conflict. That’s not Israel-Palestine though. People and news organizations treat it’s the alpha and the omega of wars and blood feuds, but only something like 10k people have died in the conflict since 2000. 60-100k people have died in the Mexican drug wars in the same period and hardly anyone cares or comes up with impractical cock eyed solutions on the internet about it. Ditto the Syrian Civil War – 200-300k dead in just a couple years. Or a variety of African wars. I get it, though. America lost its collective shit over a paltry 3k. That’s barely more than the student body of my old high school. One wonders what the reaction would be to a real war. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-idea-for-peace-in-the-jerusalem-isreal/728693.md?page=5)