# An ode to joy - I can now rest in peace, I\`ve had a thread closed. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 16, 2003, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153 "2003-04-16T20:02:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/61 "2003-04-17T17:00:04Z")
And the more that I think about, the more offended I am becoming at your veiled accusation that I’m homophobic and a regressive prude. If you wish to continue with this assertion, and I assume you do since you’ve made a statement since that one, that your comments were to be taken seriously, then you’ll have to find evidence of that. I’ll give you some time. You have more than 7500 posts of mine to read through. A reading you’ll find completely fruitless (only a small pun intended). Before you go to that trouble though, I suggest you pose an inquiry to my two fellow MPSIMS mods. One of which lives in Amsterdam, the other of which is a gay man and the long-term partner of one of the moderators of our General Questions forum. That simple query will save likely save you a vast spanse of time. Suffice it to say, the Straight Dope would not engage a staff member holding the proclivities with which you unjustly impugn me. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/62 "2003-04-17T17:21:07Z")
**UncleBeer** is not a homophobe. He always pats me on the ass when I’m pouring coffee at the weekly mod meeting. Seriously now, not that **Unc** needs my defense: back up your accusations, **birdgirl** , or drop them and apologise. This is the Pit, and you’re free to call **UncleBeer** a vast array of names (including jack-booted Nazi oppressor) for “censoring” explicit threads because he’s “prudish” and “Victorian”. But to suggest he’s a homophobe is something of another magnitude. Because as you will agree, very few people will be offended by someone who’s prudish. Many will be offended by someone who openly hates gay people. See the difference? [sub]So, **Unc** , does the mere fact that I live in Amsterdam qualify me as an expert on telling yer homophobes from yer non-homophobes? How does _that_ work?[/sub] 😉 ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/63 "2003-04-17T17:23:37Z")
> [@](#): > > So, Unc, does the mere fact that I live in Amsterdam qualify me as an expert on telling yer homophobes from yer non-homophobes? How does that work? No, no. Hot homophobes, but _prudes_. You libertines can always spot a prude. ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/64 "2003-04-17T17:29:07Z")
> [@](#): > > _UncleBeer_ > a regressive prude. Is that like an abbreviated regressive dinner - you start with the entrees and that’s quite enough of that young man? ---
**Author:** ![Uncommon\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Uncommon\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uncommon_Sense)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/65 "2003-04-17T17:44:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Coldfire \* > \*\ ***UncleBeer** is not a homophobe. He always pats me on the ass when I’m pouring coffee at the weekly mod meeting. > > [sub]So, **Unc** , does the mere fact that I live in Amsterdam qualify me as an expert on telling yer homophobes from yer non-homophobes? How does _that_ work?[/sub] 😉 \*\* I thought the Amsterdam thing was some sort of “liberal, drug using, free sex” sort of reference. Which would, of course, explain everything. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/66 "2003-04-17T18:01:29Z")
Public rimmings in Amsterdam? ---
**Author:** ![Avalonian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@Avalonian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Avalonian)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/67 "2003-04-17T18:08:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by UncleBeer \* > \*\*No. The issue is propriety and decorum. It’s not sex, or any specific sex act. As I’ve said, not all things are properly discussed in all places. This happens to be one of them. \*\* So, this has already been asked, but I figure you might have missed it. Why mot simply move the thread in question, rather than closing it? If MPSIMS wasn’t the place for such a thread, then why not just move it to IMHO or even the Pit? The point being, rather than shutting down the discussion, couldn’t you have just moved it away from where you thought it might offend? ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/68 "2003-04-17T19:23:25Z")
> [@](#): > > So, this has already been asked, but I figure you might have missed it. Why mot simply move the thread in question, rather than closing it? If MPSIMS wasn’t the place for such a thread, then why not just move it to IMHO or even the Pit? Well, I found it to be below the minimum standards of decorum for MPSIMS. In theory, those standards apply across the board. In practice, as can be plainly seen, the standards are somewhat subjectively interpreted (the subjective nature of our judgment is something I’ve stressed throughout this thread). Anyway, since according to my interpretation of those standards, that it was inappropriate for discussion, why would I pass it along? I’d also like to point you to a post I made back on the first page where I stated in regards to the registration agreement: > [@](#): > > By my count, there are three aspects of that where it could be said that you have run afoul. > > Your post is: > > 1. vulgar (Deficient in taste, delicacy, or refinement) > 2. obscene (Offensive to accepted standards of decency or modesty) and > 3. invasive of a person’s privacy (Discussed above in my previous post.) Again, why would I move something like that to another forum? The **only** reasonable action in such circumstances is to close the thread. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/69 "2003-04-17T20:20:56Z")
When talking about rimming is outlawed, only outlaws will talk about rimming. > [@](#): > > Deficient in taste… We don’t do it because it tastes great, but because it is less filling. ---
**Author:** ![birdgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/51bf81/32.png) [@birdgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/birdgirl)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/70 "2003-04-17T20:27:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by elf6c \* > **Look birdgirl if you are basically going to call someone a homophobe you better be able to back it up.** > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Coldfire_ > **Seriously now, not that Unc needs my defense: back up your accusations, birdgirl, or drop them and apologise.** Oops, my bad. I did not mean to imply you are a homophobe, **UncleBeer,** and I apologize if it came across that way. I guess I was trying to make a comment from a “feminist” point of view. I thought there was a double standard going on here, because I have seen all kinds of nasty threads about women swallowing cum and a man eating out his best friend’s wife, all of which were not killed. I found it incongruous that those threads were allowed to thrive and remain, while the “rimming” thread was killed. I don’t see the difference…the only difference was that it was a man who was on the recieving end of a sex act which is not commonly known to be performed by women. (And that is what made the thread noteworthy.) It is commonly known to be performed by gay men or straight men on women. A lot of straight men are afraid to admit they engage in “ass play” (excuse the nasty term, but I don’t know what else to call it) because they equate it with being gay. I think killing the thread reinforces this “guilt” straight men might feel if they like “ass play.” (Side note: this all goes along the same lines as how lots of guys are intrigued by women being with women, and how this scenario is constantly promoted in movies etc., but the thought of guy-on-guy action brings feelings of disgust to these same men. That double standard irks me too.) But that wasn’t even my main point. I was really seriously wanting you to explain the inconsistencies between why you allow other graphic threads to remain, and not the “rimming” thread. How are the oral sex threads less graphic than the “rimming” one? Following is the question I posed in my original post to refreah your memory: > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by birdgirl_ > **Also, I would like you to explain how the “rimming” thread is any worse than the thread about the guy who gave oral sex to his best friend’s wife with his own wife’s permission (I think that was in this forum…) That was extremely graphic and involved some interesting moral issues. I enjoyed reading it and examining and contemplating certain aspects of human sexuality and the many forms it takes. There is absolutely no difference between the two threads. In fact the aforementioned thread was actually much nastier.** I would really be interested to hear your reply. It was not a rhetorical question. And I meant no disrespect to you, I would just like you to try to re-examine your somewhat Victorian attitude towards human sexuality. I just wanted to point out that “rimming” is no longer widely considered a taboo subject. Please explain in more detail why you “found it to be below the minimum standards of decorum for MPSIMS” and the other graphic threads to be OK (assuming they were in MPSIMS, which I think there were, but I may be wrong…) (Disclaimer: I just want y’all to know that I personally would never engage in the aforementioned sex act. That’s just my personal opinion. But I have no problem with others doing it and find it interesting to learn more about human sexuality…) ---
**Author:** ![Avalonian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@Avalonian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Avalonian)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/71 "2003-04-17T21:02:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by UncleBeer \* > **Well, I found it to be below the minimum standards of decorum for MPSIMS. In theory, those standards apply across the board.** Do they? So, the established standards of GD also apply to the Pit? The standards of MPSIMS apply to Cafe Society? GQ and IMHO have the same standards? That’s some pretty piss-poor logic there, **UncleBeer** , if you don’t mind my saying so. By that logic, no threads would ever be moved from one section to another, they would just be closed. _Obviously_, each section of the SDMB has its own standards and requirements… otherwise there’s little reason to have separate sections. So, the “same standards across the board” argument doesn’t wash with me in the least. I think we all know better, don’t you? > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by UncleBeer \* > \*\*Again, why would I move something like that to another forum? The **only** reasonable action in such circumstances is to close the thread. \*\* Well, if we look at the standards you cite from the registration agreement, there’s plenty of vulgarity and obscenity in the Pit, as well as some threads in IMHO and even occcasionally in GD… depending, of course, on one’s definition of what is vulgar aand what is obscene. So, to me, those two items (“vulgar” and “obscene”) are right out. However, the third point has more validity. Posting private info is a general no-no. I would agree that, if that were the case, it would be a valid reason for closing the thread (and perhaps a note to that effect when you closed it would have prevented this thread). However, it was implicit in the original thread (to me) that **whuckfistle** was not posting about someone else… he was posting about himself, but in a jokingly third-person manner. He has as much as said so now in this thread. Assuming that what he says now is true, does this change your mind at all? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/72 "2003-04-17T21:15:58Z")
I have to say that I think it was weird that this thread was closed, but when people said that **DirkGntly** ’s thread about going down on his friend’s wife was inappropriate, they were booed and shot down. _shrugs_ Other than that, I don’t really have a stake in this. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/73 "2003-04-17T21:31:07Z")
I’m worried about **whuckfistle** hearing “serious” tones in his head !!! Quick !! Swallow your meds, **whuck**!!! ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/74 "2003-04-17T21:31:55Z")
> [@](#): > > Assuming that what he says now is true, does this change your mind at all? No. It doesn’t. I’ve made a decision. We’ve examined it ad infinitum, ad nauseam, et cetera. We’ve nearly reached the point of ad captandum and someone even wants to discuss it _ad feminam_. It doesn’t matter what I say or do, my reasons will not be acceptable to everyone; they’ll simply be challenged on other grounds until we’re reduced to pointless minutiae and endless hypothetical iterations. Frankly, I’m not sure we’re not already past that point. This discussion has become less than useless; it’s now a distraction. Anyway, this board isn’t run by majority rule. There are a small number of members, the mods, charged with maintaining content; I happen to be one of those. Whether you like my decisions, whether you agree with them, whether my explanations of my decisions, or anything else I say or do, meets with, or doesn’t meet with your approval, you’ll have to live with them. If that sounds harsh and dismissive, I’m sorry, but really let’s consider the real import of the events. _I closed one thread about analingus._ That’s it. I see no reason for me to have had to spend anywhere near the amount of time I have today explaining that one simple decision. I’ve easily spent close to two hours explaining it. Nor should I have to spend this amount of time explaining any other. This has become ridiculous and I’m finished with it. ---
**Author:** ![birdgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/51bf81/32.png) [@birdgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/birdgirl)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/75 "2003-04-17T22:05:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by UncleBeer \* > \*\*Whether you like my decisions, whether you agree with them, whether my explanations of my decisions, or anything else I say or do, meets with, or doesn’t meet with your approval, you’ll have to live with them. \*\* Yes we can live with it, but we can also question it. Weilding all that great decision-making power you speak of also means your decisions are open for questioning. You say you spent oh-so-much time explaining your decsison. Well as far as I can tell, all you did was basically say: “I killed the thread because it was vulgar and obscene and had no place on the board. Live with it.” But you never explained WHY it is vulgar and obscene. Nor did you ever explain the double standard–that is, why the other graphic threads were OK and the “rimming” one is not. That’s the question I really want answered and I asked it nicely twice and you just ignored it. Just as I am sure you will ignore what I am saying now. I guess your reasoning will just have to remain a mystery… ---
**Author:** ![Avalonian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@Avalonian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Avalonian)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/76 "2003-04-17T22:20:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by UncleBeer \* > \*\*Anyway, this board isn’t run by majority rule. There are a small number of members, the mods, charged with maintaining content; I happen to be one of those. Whether you like my decisions, whether you agree with them, whether my explanations of my decisions, or anything else I say or do, meets with, or doesn’t meet with your approval, you’ll have to live with them. If that sounds harsh and dismissive, I’m sorry, but really let’s consider the real import of the events. _I closed one thread about analingus._ That’s it. I see no reason for me to have had to spend anywhere near the amount of time I have today explaining that one simple decision. I’ve easily spent close to two hours explaining it. Nor should I have to spend this amount of time explaining any other. This has become ridiculous and I’m finished with it. \*\* Two things, **UncleBeer** , then I’m done with it too. First, nobody forced you to come in here and spend two hours explaining yourself. It was good of you to do so and I appreciate it, but don’t come back and whine about the time you spent when you spent it of your own volition. You’re being petulant when there is no need or cause to be so. Second, being a Mod gives you some power, to be sure. It also gives you some measure of responsibility and culpability. When you close a thread for reasons which are shaky (at best), you can sometimes expect to be criticized for it. That’s the nature of the job, and I say that having moderated a smaller board myself. And you can also expect to be called on it when you make a mistake, as I believe you made in this case. I guess what I’m saying is, if you’re _so_ annoyed by being called out when you make a rash decision (and yes, it still seems rash to me), then why are you still a Moderator? Owning your decisions kind of comes with the job… so my friendly advice is to stop whining about it, or just quit. Meanwhile, I’ll be watching out for the ban-stick… _whistles innocently_ ---
**Author:** ![Shaolinrabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Shaolinrabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shaolinrabbit)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2003, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/77 "2003-04-17T22:35:00Z")
Actually, if I might be so bold, I think **UncleBeer** ’s mistake was in allowing the other graphic sex threads into MPSIMS. While it might fit into any number of the categories in IMHO or MPSIMS, the safest place to put anything riske is always the Pit. Also, I see no reason why, if one were to draw a line sexually, why rimjobs couldn’t be that line. Spit or swallow probably pushed the line a tad, and who knows, maybe **UncleBeer** ’s standards are prudish to some. If there is to be a line of decorum, then it has to go somewhere, and that’s a selective decision no matter who makes it. Who knows? I’m sure there were some reports from some people complaining about each of the threads, and maybe **UncleBeer** doesn’t want to run the Porn Palace forum of the SDMB. Ultimately, though, beyond the reasoning he gave for drawing the line of decorum for MPSIMS, which is as valid as if anyone else might draw it, has it occured to anyone that he might not have wanted to shift a rimming thread into another Mod’s territory. He’s basically said as much. > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by UncleBeer_ > Anyway, since according to my interpretation of those standards, that it was inappropriate for discussion, why would I pass it along? Which I took to mean, ‘I closed the thread rather than moving it because I’m not putting it into another Mod’s forum.’ IOW, just email the mods in IMHO and the Pit, and ask them if it’s ok. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2003, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/78 "2003-04-18T00:26:34Z")
what if **(TMI)** had been put in the thread title? Would that of helped? ---
**Author:** ![Shaolinrabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Shaolinrabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shaolinrabbit)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2003, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/79 "2003-04-18T00:43:09Z")
I doubt it, **erislover** , if the problem is the standards presented in MPSIMS, then the title wouldn’t have helped. Also, what’s the word on how many of those threadstarters(Of sexually explicit threads) emailed the mods for clarification of those standards first? > [@](#): > > _Oringinally posted by Arnold Winkelried_ > Sex > Sex: The medical approach is OK, the Penthouse approach is not. If you are not sure, err on the side of caution and/or contact a staff member before you post. (Yes, I know quoting the rules makes me look like the librarian’s favorite helper) In truth, I would enjoy such a thread, and might even add to it myself. ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2003, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153/80 "2003-04-18T02:12:21Z")
If I may chime in here, **UncleBeer** and all of us are responsible for overseeing the totality of board content. One factor is “thread fads”. We’ve all seen 'em, from “Ask the” threads to just about every sexual topic du jour. We just went through one in **IMHO**. One person started a thread on oral sex. Someone else started another, slightly more “out there”. And pretty soon we had no less than six separate threads on oral sex, all on the first screen of **IMHO**. We started looking like an audition room for Deep Throat. Was the topic verboten per se? Nope. It’s just not what we’re here to specialize in. Same reason we keep a pretty tight rein on computer questions. There are plenty of other places out there that specialize in them. (Another refreshing round of platform wars, anyone?) FWIW, my reaction when reading the anulingus thread in **MPSIMS** wasn’t shocked prudery, it was rolled-eyes boredom. “Oh wonderful, here we go again; another Letters To Penthouse gig.” IMO **UncleBeer** made the right call. He explained his reasons. Some of you don’t agree with them. Okay. Them’s the breaks. But he didn’t make the decision carelessly or capriciously. Veb [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/an-ode-to-joy-i-can-now-rest-in-peace-i-ve-had-a-thread-closed/169153.md?page=5)