# Anarchists Wanted to Attack NATO, Republican Convention: Feds **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 2, 2012, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627 "2012-05-02T13:00:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/1 "2012-05-02T13:00:57Z")
[Anarchists Wanted to Attack NATO, Republican Convention: Feds](http://news.yahoo.com/anarchists-wanted-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds-154657678--abc-news-topstories.html) ABC NewsBy JASON RYAN | ABC News – 20 hrs ago A gang of anarchists arrested for allegedly plotting to blow up a Cleveland, Ohio bridge also talked about attacking an upcoming NATO summit in Chicago and this summer’s Republican National Convention in Florida, according to authorities. Douglas Wright, 26, Brandon Baxter, 20, and Anthony Hayne, 35, all self-described anarchists, have been charged with conspiracy and attempted use of explosive materials to damage physical property affecting interstate commerce. Two other men Conner Stevens, 20 and Joshua Stafford, 23 were also arrested and may face similar charges. \ * * * Why is it, Anarchists (fundamentally no Government Philosophy) only target Republicans (my perception)? If ones fundamental Philosophy is No Government, wouldn’t Democrats be equally targeted? Is Anarchist just a smoke screen for Militant Liberal? This isnt about Republican bashing, it is about what the real definition of Anarchist is and why they targeting seems to be one sided. For Reference, the American Heritage Online Dictionary definition [American Heritigate](http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/anarchism) an·ar·chism NOUN: 1. The theory or doctrine that all forms of government are oppressive and undesirable and should be abolished. 2. Active resistance and terrorism against the state, as used by some anarchists. 3. Rejection of all forms of coercive control and authority: “He was inclined to anarchism; he hated system and organization and uniformity” (Bertrand Russell) (Colored text my emphasis) Just to emphasize, Im looking for a lively discussion, not just partisan knee jerk bashing. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/2 "2012-05-02T13:05:04Z")
> [@dngnb8](#): > > [Anarchists Wanted to Attack NATO, Republican Convention: Feds](http://news.yahoo.com/anarchists-wanted-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds-154657678--abc-news-topstories.html) > > ABC NewsBy JASON RYAN | ABC News – 20 hrs ago > > A gang of anarchists arrested for allegedly plotting to blow up a Cleveland, Ohio bridge also talked about attacking an upcoming NATO summit in Chicago and this summer’s Republican National Convention in Florida, according to authorities. > > Douglas Wright, 26, Brandon Baxter, 20, and Anthony Hayne, 35, all self-described anarchists, have been charged with conspiracy and attempted use of explosive materials to damage physical property affecting interstate commerce. Two other men Conner Stevens, 20 and Joshua Stafford, 23 were also arrested and may face similar charges. \ > > * * * > > Why is it, Anarchists (fundamentally no Government Philosophy) only target Republicans (my perception)? > > If ones fundamental Philosophy is No Government, wouldn’t Democrats be equally targeted? > > Is Anarchist just a smoke screen for Militant Liberal? > > This isnt about Republican bashing, it is about what the real definition of Anarchist is and why they targeting seems to be one sided. > > For Reference, the American Heritage Online Dictionary definition > > [American Heritigate](http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/anarchism) > > an·ar·chism > > NOUN: > > 1. The theory or doctrine that all forms of government are oppressive and undesirable and should be abolished. > 2. Active resistance and terrorism against the state, as used by some anarchists. > 3. Rejection of all forms of coercive control and authority: “He was inclined to anarchism; he hated system and organization and uniformity” (Bertrand Russell) > > (Colored text my emphasis) > > Just to emphasize, Im looking for a lively discussion, not just partisan knee jerk bashing. Other than the partisan knee-jerk bashing that supports your position, right? ---
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/3 "2012-05-02T13:23:14Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Other than the partisan knee-jerk bashing that supports your position, right? Im not a Republican. Let me clarify some things 1. I am Fiscally Conservative (neither dems or reps are today) 2. I am Pro Choice 3. I believe same sex couples should have the same rights as opposite sex couples Im not an anarchist, but I think we have way too much Government in our lives. EDIT: Additionally, I moderate a political forum and one of the participants on that board was a self proclaimed Anarchist, but his discussion truly presented as very Liberal. He was arrested for planning to attack the RNC ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/4 "2012-05-02T13:31:45Z")
> [@dngnb8](#): > > Why is it, Anarchists (fundamentally no Government Philosophy) only target Republicans (my perception)? Because your perception is so badly skewed that you somehow got the idea into your head that an inaminate object (i.e. a bridge in Cleveland) is “Republican”. (Obviously the answer to this question can only be directed at the parenthetical tag end, as the rest of it is contra-factual and thus not amenable to causal inquiry – it would be like asking “Why is the sky purple with green polka dots?”.) Why your perceptions are so skewed is another question, beyond the scope of this inquiry and probably beyond the rules of non-Pit discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/5 "2012-05-02T13:35:49Z")
They want to attack NATO? I think NATO can take them. ---
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/6 "2012-05-02T13:38:31Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > Because your perception is so badly skewed that you somehow got the idea into your head that an inaminate object (i.e. a bridge in Cleveland) is “Republican”. Ah yes, the Quote what I havent said then Rebuttal the point, tool. I never said that. Please so not put words in my posts that werent said > [@](#): > > (Obviously the answer to this question can only be directed at the parenthetical tag end, as the rest of it is contra-factual and thus not amenable to causal inquiry – it would be like asking “Why is the sky purple with green polka dots?”.) So the quoted article has no bearing on my position. /fail > [@](#): > > Why your perceptions are so skewed is another question, beyond the scope of this inquiry and probably beyond the rules of non-Pit discussion. So you have many examples of the DNC being targeted? As I said these are my perceptions. Please, post links showing the DNC or the Democratic Party as being targeted by Anarchists. Im not saying this is fact, just perception ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/7 "2012-05-02T13:54:11Z")
I don’t think these guys are necessary “no government” anarchists. The only thing we know from the article is that they got their bomb making knowledge from _The Anarchist’s Cookbook_. They could very well be fringe, anti-globalists, which would perhaps make the lefty wingnuts. We had a thread recently where our own self described anarchist, **Mr. Dibble** , explained his philosophy. And he’d be easily classified as a leftist around here, even though he does’t really fit the simplistic, “no government” description of an anarchist. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/8 "2012-05-02T13:59:59Z")
> [@dngnb8](#): > > So you have many examples of the DNC being targeted? As I said these are my perceptions. Please, post links showing the DNC or the Democratic Party as being targeted by Anarchists. Im not saying this is fact, just perception [Anarchist protesters could strike 2012 Dem convention, Denver officials warn](http://blogs.westword.com/latestword/2011/03/anarchist_protesters_2012_democratic_national_convention_charlotte_denver_video.php) > [@](#): > > “Some of whom, by the way, do not come with peaceful intent,” says Morgan. “They are self-described anarchists who want to come and make mischief and draw attention to their cause.” Later, he adds that “we want to be a lot more like Denver in '08 than Chicago in '68.” [DNC Protesters Arrested, Pepper-Sprayed](http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2008/08/dnc-protesters/) > [@](#): > > Gathered at the intersection of Cleveland Place and 15th street, self described anarchists vocalized their opinions on an array of issues, from the Iraq war, to the heavy police presence in the city. ---
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/9 "2012-05-02T14:00:28Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > [Anarchist protesters could strike 2012 Dem convention, Denver officials warn](http://blogs.westword.com/latestword/2011/03/anarchist_protesters_2012_democratic_national_convention_charlotte_denver_video.php) > > [DNC Protesters Arrested, Pepper-Sprayed](http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2008/08/dnc-protesters/) This is what I was looking for. EDIT: How do these event compare with the posted article and this one [Former Midlanders face charge in RNC scheme](http://www.mywesttexas.com/news/top_stories/article_60aea951-f646-5606-b554-de6a00c16275.html) ---
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/10 "2012-05-02T14:06:39Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I don’t think these guys are necessary “no government” anarchists. The only thing we know from the article is that they got their bomb making knowledge from _The Anarchist’s Cookbook_. They could very well be fringe, anti-globalists, which would perhaps make the lefty wingnuts. > > We had a thread recently where our own self described anarchist, **Mr. Dibble** , explained his philosophy. And he’d be easily classified as a leftist around here, even though he does’t really fit the simplistic, “no government” description of an anarchist. Considering the definition of Anarchist, isnt that a contradiction? You touch on the point I think Im driving at. Are these “Anarchists” being mislabled? In the second article I link, Crowder presented more as a militant liberal then an Anarchist. (he was a poster on the board I moderate) ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/11 "2012-05-02T14:07:59Z")
Well, I think they compare in the sense that most anarchists just want to attack what they see as the levers of power, be they the WTO, NATO, RNC/DNC, or a bridge. And some aren’t really anarchists at all, they’re just trouble-makers looking for an excuse to break shit. Trying to get a universal categorization of anarchists is impossible, as has been pointed out up-thread. Just about all you can say is that they tend to be well outside the mainstream of American political thought and much more agreeable to using violent protest to draw attention to their positions. Trying to paint them all as leftists is futile and misguided, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/12 "2012-05-02T14:09:54Z")
> [@dngnb8](#): > > Are these “Anarchists” being mislabled? In the second article I link, Crowder presented more as a militant liberal then an Anarchist. (he was a poster on the board I moderate) Well, it was made clear in both posts I cited that these were “self-labeled anarchists”. It’s not like there is an Anarchist membership card (which would sort of be oxymoronic, I guess). The kind of person deluded enough to want to blow up a bridge probably isn’t too rigorous in evaluating their personal political labels. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/13 "2012-05-02T14:10:37Z")
> [@dngnb8](#): > > Considering the definition of Anarchist, isnt that a contradiction? There are as many definitions of Anarchism as there are anarchists. Twice as many in Poland, and thrice among Jewish anarchists. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/14 "2012-05-02T14:19:59Z")
Anarchy should be on the extreme right of the political spectrum, so I don’t know where you’d get “militant liberal.” You must be thinking of communist activists like Che Guevara. A true, thoughtful anarchist would tend to target liberals, assuming they bought into the “Democrats are the party of big-government” theory. On the other hand, a thoughtful anarchist might care more about the Patriot Act and other Big Brother type iniatives that tend to originate from the right. Unfortunately, there’s no such thing as a thoughful anarchist. Instead, it’s just a bunch of morons lashing out at whatever they decide is “the man.” Looking for a pattern amidst the rubbish is a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/15 "2012-05-02T14:22:32Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Well, I think they compare in the sense that most anarchists just want to attack what they see as the levers of power, be they the WTO, NATO, RNC/DNC, or a bridge. And some aren’t really anarchists at all, they’re just trouble-makers looking for an excuse to break shit. I can accept this. Much like another thread about Christians vs Gays. If it wasnt their twisted view of the Bible to support their hate, they would find something else > [@](#): > > Trying to get a universal categorization of anarchists is impossible, as has been pointed out up-thread. Just about all you can say is that they tend to be well outside the mainstream of American political thought and much more agreeable to using violent protest to draw attention to their positions. Trying to paint them all as leftists is futile and misguided, IMO. Again, I wasnt trying to paint them. I just hadnt seen examples of violence against Liberal Philosophy. Also consider the current US Gov has a Democrat in office, yet they were targeting the DNC, it seemed to support the perception. > [@Jas09](#): > > Well, it was made clear in both posts I cited that these were “self-labeled anarchists”. It’s not like there is an Anarchist membership card (which would sort of be oxymoronic, I guess). > > The kind of person deluded enough to want to blow up a bridge probably isn’t too rigorous in evaluating their personal political labels. Maybe this is a good example of how Media steers perception. The media title definitely set a perception prior to reading. > [@Kobal2](#): > > There are as many definitions of Anarchism as there are anarchists. Twice as many in Poland, and thrice among Jewish anarchists. I only saw the one on the American Heritage site. [Dictionary.com](http://Dictionary.com) only had one as well. Based on other posters responses here I would lean more to people misrepresenting their belief, then additional acceptable definitions. My perception on this topic has definitely changed. ---
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/16 "2012-05-02T14:25:04Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Anarchy should be on the extreme right of the political spectrum, This was my perception as well. However, the recent articles on the matter seemed to indicate Republicans as a higher level target then Democrats. That is what was causing my confusion > [@](#): > > so I don’t know where you’d get “militant liberal.” Articles ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/17 "2012-05-02T14:29:00Z")
When did NATO become a wing of the Republican Party? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/18 "2012-05-02T14:38:42Z")
Did anybody else initially read the thread title as the headline of a want ad? I came in here thinking “Why the HELL do the Feds want to recruit anarchists to attack NATO”? This is a very interesting discussion, but not as exciting as I originally thought it would be. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/19 "2012-05-02T15:19:06Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > I came in here thinking “Why the HELL do the Feds want to recruit anarchists to attack NATO”? To get rid of them? One of history’s shortest wars… ---
**Author:** ![dngnb8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@dngnb8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dngnb8)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627/20 "2012-05-02T15:22:51Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > When did NATO become a wing of the Republican Party? :smack: [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anarchists-wanted-to-attack-nato-republican-convention-feds/620627.md?page=2)