# Ancient gay marriages - any credible evidence? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 12, 2012, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484 "2012-09-12T08:35:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484/21 "2012-09-13T20:17:45Z")
Also, IIRC it was Dustin Hoffman in the movie “Little Big Man”, he plays the sole survivor of Custer’s Last Stand; as a young man captured by plains Indians, one of the characters he runs across in the tribe is a man who wants to be a woman; and the tribe indulges that spirit. Not sure how historically accurate this is, but as I understand the movie was one of the first Hollywood productions to be sympathetic and realistic in its portrayal of American natives. I got the impression it was based on some fairly accurate protrayals of plains Indian culture. I guess the cultural logic was that every person who could contribute to the tribe was of value. However, I don’t recall that the character was “married”, just that he dressed and acted as a woman and he helped out the other women with woman tasks. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484/22 "2012-09-13T20:56:44Z")
They were Cheyenne. Not that there’s anything wrong with that. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2012, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484/23 "2012-09-15T15:53:14Z")
Another thought: Keep in mind that in many cultures, particularly in ones that allowed polygamy, marriage was not necessarily viewed as a partnership of equals. Women were typically seen as possessions or chattels; a convenience to run your household and produce heirs, which were the ancient equivalent of a pension plan. Rome seems to have been somewhat unique in the degree of rights granted to women. For example, Elizabeth I refused to marry according to some views, because she knew whoever her husband was, he would try to run the country instead of her. Letting that bitch QoS Mary’s offspring become king was a more desirable outcome. Given this view of marriage, two men seeking a “partnership” would likely consider themselves brothers or partners rather than getting married, with one as “subjected to” or underneath the other (figuratively, that is). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2012, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484/24 "2012-09-15T17:08:25Z")
QE I was a Roman? ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2012, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484/25 "2012-09-15T17:23:04Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > QE I was a Roman? No, she was an example of not tolerating marriage because it was not a partnership of equals. I suspect that applies to some extent from early times to Victorian times. ---
**Author:** ![Vaevictis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f04885/32.png) [@Vaevictis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vaevictis)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2012, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484/26 "2012-09-15T22:21:50Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > Those records passed through the hands of people who copied & re-copied them, usually Christian monks. > > They only copied the stuff they agreed with, more or less. Then how did Lucretius survive? Why’d they copy so many other pagan texts with messages contrary to that of Christianity? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-gay-marriages-any-credible-evidence/634484.md?page=1)