# Ancient machinery **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 6, 2008, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476 "2008-02-06T03:02:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/1 "2008-02-06T03:02:15Z")
So, I bought the Pixar Short Films DVD and on it is the teaser for their next feature, _Wall-E_. Apparently, it’s about a robot who compacts trash – a lot of trash – who longs for the stars. Along with the short scenes of Wall-E doing his work, appears, _After 700 years of doing what he was built for He’ll discover what he was meant for._ which got me thinking. 700 years is a long time for any mechanical object to exist without wearing out. The only thing I could think of that could be around from circa 1300 to today would be a tower clock. Wiki says the [Salisbury cathedral clock](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salisbury_cathedral_clock) is the oldest in Europe and dates back to 1386, but it was removed and forgotten from 1884 to 1929 which would leave it about a hundred years short. So, are there any mechanical objects (i.e. something that moves as opposed to say, a bridge that just sits there) that have been in continuous use from the early 1300s to date? ---
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/2 "2008-02-06T03:16:39Z")
I can’t think of anything that wouldn’t be “cheating,” things like deadfall traps in Egyptian pyramids (they might work once, a few thousand years after being built). I’d imagine that very simple devices like castle porticullises might survive that long, if the “pulling mechanism” were chains rather than ropes. Doors (if you’ll accept something that simple) might be another possibility. I bet there are some grain mills that date back that far, although the millstones will have been replaced repeatedly. Going seriously far out on the cheating fringe, there’s been talk of actually restoring and trying to work this thing [The Antikythera device](http://www.antikythera-mechanism.gr/), which would be another “use again after a few thousand years” case, rather than continuous use. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/3 "2008-02-06T03:21:13Z")
A water wheel (known as a _noria_) in Syria [was built over 640 years ago](http://www.medinaproject.net/syria/pages/poc.php?ID_POC=569&ID_Lang=1), and is still in use: > [@](#): > > The largest noria in Hama is called Al-Muhammadiyah constructed by the governor of Hama in 1361 AD and is one of 17 still in use in the city today. It has 120 buckets and is 27 metres in diameter. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/4 "2008-02-06T03:44:55Z")
Check back in 10,000 years. [The Clock of the Long Now.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clock_of_the_Long_Now) ---
**Author:** ![jovan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/0ea827/32.png) [@jovan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jovan)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/5 "2008-02-06T07:29:45Z")
What about musical instruments? The [organ](http://jsebestyen.org/sion.html) of the Cathedral of Notre Dame de Valere in Sion, Switzerland probably dates from around 1430 and is in working condition. Much older, and still playable are the bronze bells of [Marquis Yi of Zeng](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomb_of_Marquis_Yi_of_Zeng), from 433 BCE. However, they’ve been buried until recently. Much, much, older still are [9000 year-old flutes](http://www.archaeology.org/9911/newsbriefs/flute.html) discovered in China. Playable, but again buried for most of those 9000 years. (I’m not sure also that flutes would count as “mechanical” instruments.) ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/6 "2008-02-06T12:54:26Z")
How do you define “wearing out”? Metallurgy was fairly primitive in 1300, so if, for example, there was a clock which had been built in 1300 and was still running today, but over the 700 years since it had been originally assembled all of the parts had been replaced at one point or another, would it count? Or would you say it was only as old as the oldest part in the clock? With modern technology and materials, we could no doubt design and build a clock (or other mechanical device) which would last for 700 years. I doubt that we could get electronics to last that long, but something made out of metal or certain plastics would be possible. Some large earthmoving equipment has a design life of 70 years, so something like a clock could be made to last that long, I’m sure. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/7 "2008-02-06T15:58:18Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] How do you define “wearing out”? Metallurgy was fairly primitive in 1300, so if, for example, there was a clock which had been built in 1300 and was still running today, but over the 700 years since it had been originally assembled all of the parts had been replaced at one point or another, would it count? [/QUOTE] I have my grandfather’s axe. I’ve replace the head twice, and the handle three times, but if it was good enough for Grandad, it’s good enough for me. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Man_In_Black)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/8 "2008-02-06T17:48:53Z")
[QUOTE=Pochacco] Check back in 10,000 years. [The Clock of the Long Now.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clock_of_the_Long_Now) [/QUOTE] That is very interesting. I will have to keep up on that one. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/9 "2008-02-06T17:55:24Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] I have my grandfather’s axe. I’ve replace the head twice, and the handle three times, but if it was good enough for Grandad, it’s good enough for me. 😉 [/QUOTE] I was wondering how long it would take for that to pop up. Well done. I think that it must be understood that Wall-E has had maintenance done and parts replaced over his 700 years. The transmission on my car is about to go (although they said that last year, too) and when I get it replaced, I’m not going to be saying that I have a new car. So 700 year old mechanisms that have been repaired count for this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2008, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/10 "2008-02-06T18:03:23Z")
Well, an autonomous robot is likely to have self-repair capacity. Plus, most (if not all) 700-year-old machines are not like your car, which is really a complex group of machines, rather than one big one- that is, if a cog in your water-wheel mechanism snaps, your machine is no longer functional. On the other hand, if your transmission seizes, your brakes/starter/window winders/whatever still work. History Channel just aired a good special on this guy: [Ismail al-Jazari - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Jazari) - and a few of his hydraulic systems (mostly irrigation pumps) are still functioning today, approximately 850 years later. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2008, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-machinery/436476/11 "2008-02-07T03:49:13Z")
[QUOTE=Yllaria] I was wondering how long it would take for that to pop up. Well done. I think that it must be understood that Wall-E has had maintenance done and parts replaced over his 700 years. The transmission on my car is about to go (although they said that last year, too) and when I get it replaced, I’m not going to be saying that I have a new car. So 700 year old mechanisms that have been repaired count for this thread. [/QUOTE] I did think of Grandfather’s Axe when I was doing the original post but decided not to include it, so I’d say something that’s had a substantial number of its its parts replaced over the centuries would still qualify. And **Fear** , your noria is pretty nifty. It being wood, I imagine all of it has been renewed at one point or another.