# Ancient Roman restaurants **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Tags:** wine\ **Created:** [August 14, 2025, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017 "2025-08-14T00:48:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/21 "2025-08-14T13:38:14Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > If you go into a village taverna, it’s entirely possible the “menu” will be “come up here so we can show you what’s in our half-dozen stew pots today, and then tell us what you want.” I’ve heard of places where you sit down, and the grandmother-type owner just serves you whatever she’s making that day. You take it or leave it! ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/22 "2025-08-14T13:41:23Z")
That is exactly what my grandmother did in West Texas. She would fix up the beans, tortillas and what every meat she had that day and serve it to the local laborers. This is most likley how it’s been done since before Rome I would imagine. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/23 "2025-08-14T14:09:31Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > The thermopolium: Interesting article. I found this section particularly interesting: > They were mainly used by those who did not have their own kitchens, often inhabitants of _[insulae](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insula_(building))_, and this sometimes led to thermopolia being scorned by the upper class. So the concept of fine dining for the upper class was not really a thing back then, it seems. I’m kind of surprised an industry of fine dining catering to the upper class did not exist, that the upper classes generally scorned these _thermopolia_ in favor of cooking in their own kitchens. But then, if you could afford a domicile with a kitchen, you could probably afford a servant or two. > [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@DrDeth](#): > > > > likely a lot healthier than todays > > Do you know how _garum_ was made back then? Or what _sapa_ is? “Healthy” is not quite how I’d put it. I’m curious, not being snarky, but what do you mean about ‘not quite healthy’ in these particular cases? Neither condiment seems very unhealthy to me, in general. In the sense of the less than antiseptic way they were made? As far as I understand, garum was very similar to modern Asian fish sauces, which are still made the same way-- by leaving a lot of anchovies or other small fish combined with a lot of salt to ferment for months. Kind of disgusting in the ‘you don’t want to know how the sausage is made’ sense, maybe, but otherwise not really different from modern fish sauce. And sapa I had to look up- turns out it’s grape syrup, which was used in a similar fashion to the way we use maple syrup. So by ‘not quite healthy’ do you mean the excessive use of salt and sugar, respectively? ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/24 "2025-08-14T14:26:04Z")
> [@solost](#): > > But then, if you could afford a domicile with a kitchen, you could probably afford a servant or two. Replace “servants” with “slaves”, and there you have the answer. The rich Romans could afford slaves who cooked and served their food and didn’t even have to think about eating out. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/25 "2025-08-14T14:38:47Z")
And on top of that, most of the working class domiciles — in big apartment blocks called _insulae_ — didn’t have kitchens because it wasn’t even permitted, due to the fire danger. (Rome burned down a lot. I mean, a _lot_.) ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/26 "2025-08-14T14:40:41Z")
> [@solost](#): > > So the concept of fine dining for the upper class was not really a thing back then, it seems. I’m kind of surprised an industry of fine dining catering to the upper class did not exist, I think this is a bit anachronistic, well into the modern era the idea of sharing a meal was synonymous with _hosting_ someone at your house. The idea of sharing a meal with someone without actually inviting them into your home, or vice versa, would be weird. IIRC when fine dining did become a thing (like two millenia later in 1700s Britain) initially it was mainly for rich men to entertain their mistresses (who obviously could not be invited into the family home for dinner in the usual manner) ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/27 "2025-08-14T14:44:53Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > Replace “servants” with “slaves”, and there you have the answer. The rich Romans could afford slaves who cooked and served their food and didn’t even have to think about eating out. Yes, you’re right, they would have been slaves, not servants. > [@griffin1977](#): > > I think this is a bit anachronistic, well into the modern era the idea of sharing a meal was synonymous with _hosting_ someone at your house. The idea of sharing a meal with someone without actually inviting them into your home, or vice versa, would be weird. > > IIRC when fine dining did become a thing (like two millenia later in 1700s Britain) initially it was mainly for rich men to entertain their mistresses (who obviously could not be invited into the family home for dinner in the usual manner) Well, OK, but didn’t upper class ancient Romans ever travel? I would have thought that fine dining establishments would exist for travelers, at least. But maybe they just brought their slaves along to cook for them on the road. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/28 "2025-08-14T14:48:24Z")
> [@solost](#): > > I’m curious, not being snarky, but what do you mean about ‘not quite healthy’ in these particular cases? Neither condiment seems very unhealthy to me, in general. If [lead acetate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead(II)_acetate#Sweetener) isn’t unhealthy, I’m not sure what is. > [@solost](#): > > Kind of disgusting in the ‘you don’t want to know how the sausage is made’ sense, maybe, but otherwise not really different from modern fish sauce. …which is a salt bomb. Which is unhealthy. Added salt in general is. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/29 "2025-08-14T14:51:15Z")
> [@solost](#): > > Well, OK, but didn’t upper class ancient Romans ever travel? I would have thought that fine dining establishments would exist for travelers, at least. But maybe they just brought their slaves along to cook for them on the road. They would never have been seen dead using an inn like the common rabble, if they could help it. Elite romans would have a network of clients and patrons around the empire (and the various client kingdoms on the periphery) and would have been hosted by them. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/30 "2025-08-14T14:54:09Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > Elite romans would have a network of clients and patrons around the empire (and the various client kingdoms on the periphery) and would have been hosted by them. Exactly. They weren’t getting put up in a luxury hotel mid-journey, they were hopping from one friendly villa or estate to the next. The houses of the wealthy would have a couple dozen bedrooms (_cubicula_) specifically to accommodate the frequency of their guests. Each day’s travel time would be limited by the distance between hosts. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/31 "2025-08-14T14:55:57Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > If [lead acetate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead(II)_acetate#Sweetener) isn’t unhealthy, I’m not sure what is. I was going to say, but lead acetate was used as a sweetening enhancer, which doesn’t seem like it would be necessary in the case of grape syrup, which would be plenty sweet naturally, I would think. But then I read your linked article: they boiled down the grape juice into syrup using lead pots. Oops. > [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@solost](#): > > > > modern fish sauce. > > …which is a salt bomb. Which is unhealthy. Added salt in general is. Eh, everything in moderation. Our bodies _need_ a certain amount of salt to function. Asian diets are generally healthy, though they do tend to overdo the salt somewhat. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/32 "2025-08-14T15:20:19Z")
> [@solost](#): > > Our bodies _need_ a certain amount of salt to function Very very little. > [@solost](#): > > Asian diets are generally healthy Depends what you mean by “Asian diet”, there, it covers a lot of territory. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/33 "2025-08-14T15:47:26Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > As you stand in the middle of that room, it’s impossible to resist the pull of the historical connection. Thanks, great post. > [@solost](#): > > Neither condiment seems very unhealthy to me, in general. It isnt, due to the salt. I mean of course for some too much salt is bad. > [@solost](#): > > As far as I understand, garum was very similar to modern Asian fish sauces, which are still made the same way- Worcestershire sauce is also kinda a fish sauce. And fairly salty. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/34 "2025-08-14T16:19:09Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Which is unhealthy. Added salt in general is. It’s unhealthy for people in 2025 (especially the urban poor who heavily rely on fast food to make up their diet) but the urban poor in imperial Rome who relied in fast food to make up their diet would definitely not be getting too much salt. Whether or not their salt intake would have been low enough to cause a health problem, they definitely would not be getting enough calories so they kind of high fat high sugar foods we associate with unhealthy fast food would have been healthy for them (if they had been available to them but they wouldn’t be) ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/35 "2025-08-14T16:27:14Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > the urban poor in imperial Rome who relied in fast food to make up their diet would definitely not be getting too much salt. Even the urban poor could (and did) buy the low grades of garum, as well as other salted foods. They had no shortage of salt in their diet. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2025, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/36 "2025-08-14T17:50:10Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Even the urban poor could (and did) buy the low grades of garum, as well as other salted foods. They had no shortage of salt in their diet. Yeah but it would have been used sparingly to add a bit of flavor to bland food, their diet might not have been unhealthily low in salt (which AFAIK is basically zero salt) but they were not getting too much salt either or even close to it. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2025, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/37 "2025-08-15T00:42:18Z")
> [@solost](#): > > Well, OK, but didn’t upper class ancient Romans ever travel? I would have thought that fine dining establishments would exist for travelers, at least. But maybe they just brought their slaves along to cook for them on the road. When they traveled, they were being hosted by someone else. Their host would then be responsible for serving them appropriate food. ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2025, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/38 "2025-08-15T06:11:23Z")
The concept of restaurants and fine dining is still absent in some cultures. The best food is a home, why would you go out? Even for the middle classes. I can’t help but mention this wonderful movie from a few years ago. It paints a fictional story based on the reality of post revolution France. Once the aristocracy had gone, where do all the chefs go? The movie is the prequel. > **[Delicious - Official Trailer](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnwtTIeaXqAsi%3DVWjxYALkhRDTU5Y%5C%5C&feature=youtu.be)** > > NOW AVAILABLE ON DIGITAL! Watch it here: https://bit.ly/WatchDeliciousFrance, 1789, just before the Revolution. A chef who has been sacked by his master find... ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2025, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/39 "2025-08-15T20:22:35Z")
> [@Francis\_Vaughan](#): > > The concept of restaurants and fine dining is still absent in some cultures. The best food is a home, why would you go out? Even for the middle classes. Rome was very large, even the upper class might stop for a quick grilled sausage and some wine in a busy day. ---
**Author:** ![md-2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@md-2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md-2000)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2025, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017/40 "2025-08-16T13:37:57Z")
Likely, they would send their servant (slave) out to get them something. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ancient-roman-restaurants/1022017.md?page=3)