# And again -- who IS Sarah Palin **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 2, 2008, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686 "2008-09-02T15:30:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/121 "2008-09-03T05:38:00Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > You didn’t answer the question. What makes her _more_ qualified than Snowe or Hutchinson? Who said she was? I didn’t see **Sarafeehna** say they weren’t more qualified. Were they even asked? I have no doubt that it was a political move, any person with as interesting and diverse a background would have been an interesting political pick for him. Do Snow e and Hutchinson have that as well? I see no one has even so much as mentioned gas prices etc and what Alaska has to offer insofar as helping in this current energy crisis. The answer is “a LOT”. And Sarah does have experience in that as well as the guts to see it through with the big oil companies. That is one of the things McCain mentioned in his introduction of Palin, and he has even softened his position on ANWR from “not ever” to (paraphrased), “I’d be open to discussion”. That is one thing she has that the other two don’t. Though not being familiar with Snowe’s and Hutchinson’s credentials, that’s all I know regarding comparisons of their various qualifications. ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/122 "2008-09-03T05:38:55Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > As for the female issue, my logic was that if you had two versions of Palin, exactly identical in every respect except for gender, and you think that the male version would never have been selected as the VP candidate, that (to me) is at the very least a _strong_ indicator that gender was a major factor in the pick. I don’t see anyone here denying that gender was a factor – or even denying that it was a significant factor. We might quibble over whether it was a “major” factor or not, but I suspect that most would agree that gender had something to do with her selection. That’s entirely different from saying that she was specifically selected because she was a woman – or worse, because she “has a vagina.” As I said earlier, if someone were to claim that Obama was fielded as a candidate because he’s black, his defenders would doubtlessly cry “Of course not!” The more honest defenders would admit that his race played a role, but they would surely object to the statement that this was why he was their chosen candidate. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/123 "2008-09-03T05:42:57Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > How, pray tell, do you make that logic work? Do you know anything at all about this ‘scandal’? > > For example, did you know that the guy she fired himself says she never once asked him to fire the trooper, or pressured him in any way? In fact, if her side of the story is correct, it’s another example of her reform-minded tendencies - she says he was fired for not doing his job properly. Why would you automatically assume she’s lying? > > Firing him for not getting rid of the trooper makes no sense anyway. For one thing, the incident happened quite a ways in the past (like a year and a half or something), before she was Governor. And at the time, she didn’t even want to report it at first because she didn’t want to wreck her brother-in-law’s career. And there’s no evidence then or since that she ever pressured anyone to have the guy fired. When the ‘scandal’ erupted, she willingly gave investigators so much access to documentation that they didn’t even need to get a subpoena. A refreshing change. > > \*\*In fact, one of the reasons it’s easy to find Republicans in Alaska willing to bad-mouth her \*\*is because she’s made a lot of enemies in her own party by breaking up exactly the kind of Republican cronyism that has gotten the Republicans so much justifiable condemnation in the rest of the country. THAT is why McCain likes her, because that’s what he wants to do in Washington. EXACTLY… Except for the “easy to find republicans to badmouth her”. I know Murky hates her (and most of we Alaskans feel the same way about him, talk about evil Rebublican good ole boy!!!). She’s got an 80% approval rating up here. I don’t know how many of my fellow Alaskans are full on pubbies though, a lot of my friends, students, and coworkers are either dems or non-partisan (like I am). ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/124 "2008-09-03T05:45:52Z")
> [@JThunder](#): > > I don’t see anyone here denying that gender was a factor – or even denying that it was a significant factor. We might quibble over whether it was a “major” factor or not, but I suspect that most would agree that gender had something to do with her selection. > > That’s entirely different from saying that she was specifically selected because she was a woman – or worse, because she “has a vagina.” As I said earlier, if someone were to claim that Obama was fielded as a candidate because he’s black, his defenders would doubtlessly cry “Of course not!” The more honest defenders would admit that his race played a role, but they would surely object to the statement that this was why he was their chosen candidate. Obama won his nomination through a democratic primary system – He wasn’t “fielded” by another player or by his party as a demographic strategy. He placed _himself_ on the field and ran _against_ his own party machine and got _elected_ by 18 million voters and (eventually) by the unanimous acclamation of his party. Palin was chosen by one guy, and she was chosen purely for cynical strategic purposes – she’s a socially conservative woman. McCain was hoping to score with both demographics. He only scored with one…the one he already had. Dumb move. ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/125 "2008-09-03T05:55:44Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I think you’re behind on the story. They’ve now got emails and phone calls directly showing her involvement in trying to pressure that dude. It’s game over now in Alaska. The only question whetehr she’ll be indicted before the election. Is there a credible cite for that? ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/126 "2008-09-03T06:06:50Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > You had me for a bit and I was happy to see an “inside” view posted here although I thought some of it was glossed over. > > However, when I hit the part I just quoted I realized this is nothing but republican talking points. > > I have not seen any rational assessment of Palin’s versus Obama’s experience in any way honestly suggest her experience comes close to trumping Obama’s. The difference is huge. Of particular note is severely overestimating what “executive” experience you get being mayor of a town of 7,000 as well as handing her experience because on paper she is head of the state Guard (see links earlier where one of her supporters, when pressed, could come up with no example of her actually having commanded the Guard to do anything). Except I’m not a republican, only an Alaskan who does have an insiders view. The information regarding her being head of the guard was something I wasn’t aware of until this afternoon, and was provided by a local LEFT talk show. But as tiny as it is, it’s still more than Obama has on foreign policy, that was my only point. Unless you count his speech in Germany I guess. I have not yet seen any experience of Obama’s that “trumps” an executive position. He’s been a junior senator for a short time. And? What are his accomplishments? In his speech in Germany he claimed to be head of a financial banking committee he wasn’t actually head of (at least not as is posted on the portion of the US website dealing with what senator is posted to what committees). My views of Obama come from his speeches alone since the media has done nothing but praise him. His claims of “I pushed through a bill that repealed welfare benefits” actually turned out to be he’d initially voted against some welfare reform, and then later, along with every other senator and congressman, he signed a milder bill into being. Not exactly “I’m responsible for this bill”, but “I was one of several hundred to sign this bill”. Someone (sorry poster I can’t remember your name, it’s been a slammed couple of weeks at work, I apologize!) posted a link to one of his websites where there were supposed to be actual concrete solutions he had for when/if he gets into office. I still saw no concrete solutions for problems, other than a couple of REALLY bad ideas, like national health care. I just saw more of the same, along with hidden between the lines information about how much we’re going to get screwed with raised taxes. I’ve been voting for over 30 years now, I’ve never had a party affiliation, I’ve been non-partisan since I was 18 and I’ve always voted for both democratic candidates and republican ones (did not vote for G. Sr. or G Bush the first go-around) and this is the first time I’ve actually been actively afraid of what a candidate could do once he got into office. I’ll take a solid man (albeit not the greatest, I’d have picked almost any of the other candidates, even Hillary…UGH over him), and a Kick Ass Alaskan woman over an unsteady, potentially damaging component any day. I apologize, I know so many people just adore him, and I can certainly see the attraction and charisma, but I’m just mind-boggled that so many people are so naively charmed by the rockstar-ness that they aren’t seeing the lack of substance. And worse, aren’t seeing the damaging beliefs as evidenced by his wife and other associates ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/127 "2008-09-03T06:06:57Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > Is there a credible cite for that? Does MSNBC count? > [@](#): > > [http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26458400/](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26458400/) > > . . . > > In interviews last month with KTUU, Monegan said Todd Palin pressured him numerous times to fire Wooten, but Todd Palin said they had had only one discussion. > > “I met with Commissioner Monegan, showed him some information about Wooten and left it at that,” Todd Palin said. > > Then, on Aug. 13, Sarah Palin called a news conference to acknowledge that the Law Department investigation had found that 14 members of her administration made more than 20 calls to Monegan and other public safety officials regarding Wooten since she became governor in 2006. > > Among the evidence was an audiotape of a telephone call in February to a state troopers lieutenant by Frank Bailey, Palin’s director of boards and commissions. In the tape, Bailey says the Palins are puzzled why Wooten remained on the job. > > “Todd and Sarah are scratching their heads, why on Earth hasn’t — why is this guy still representing the department?” Bailey said on the tape. > > Palin called the tape a “smoking gun” and said she recognized that “I do now have to tell Alaskans that such pressure could have been perceived to exist.” But she said she never knew of the apparent pressure until this month as part of the Law Department inquiry. > > “I have only now become aware of it,” Palin said. > > Bailey was placed on administrative leave last week pending the full results of the investigation. Or how about a local Alaska paper? > [@](#): > > [http://community.adn.com/node/128963](http://community.adn.com/node/128963) > > . . . > > Palin Wednesday acknowledged a conversation was recorded when Frank Bailey, her director of boards and commissions, called a trooper station complaining about Wooten. > She says she never asked Bailey to make the call, even though she says the recording may sound like Bailey was acting on her behalf. > > . . . If you don’t believe her, she’s guilty of exactly what Monegan accuses her of. If you do believe her, she’s guilty of either utter stupidity or gross incompetence for having all this going on with so many people in her administration (not to mention her own husband) and being completely oblivious to it all, over the course of many, many months. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/128 "2008-09-03T06:11:43Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > Is there a credible cite for that? I saw it on CNN. I found [this article](http://www.pubrecord.org/nationworld/299-documents-suggest-palin-obsessed-over-retaliating-against-ex-brother-in-law.html) which has downloads for some of the documentation. The article also contradicts **Sam’s** assertion that the fired Commissioner Monegan said she never asked him to fire Wooten. ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/129 "2008-09-03T06:18:14Z")
> [@Shayna](#): > > Does MSNBC count? Or how about a local Alaska paper? What, those shills? 😛 Sam? Sarahfeena? Not to call you out specifically, but it would be interesting to hear your take(s) on the credibility/outcome and its impact. Taken in the worst light, does it change anything? What about taken in the best light? Rather than put words in your mouth, I’ll leave it to you to define what the worst light means (e.g., not worst light from a rabid Obamite’s p.o.v., but worst light from removing benefit of the doubt, giving the tie to the runner, etc.). ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/130 "2008-09-03T06:28:25Z")
**CanvasShoes** , sorry but your claim that > [@](#): > > She wasn’t for the “bridge to nowhere” she fought against it, along with most of we 650k Alaskans, and she won it won’t be built. is [untrue.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravina_Island_Bridge) > [@](#): > > In 2006, Alaska Governor Sarah Palin campaigned on a platform that included support for building the bridge using earmarked federal funds. > > In 2005 [5], Congress stripped the specific earmark allocation of federal funds for the two bridges, without changing the the amount of money allocated for use by Alaska.[6] Without the earmark from Congress, Alaska’s portion of the bill would have doubled, from $160M (40%) to $329M (82%) of the bridge’s cost.[7] Despite the bridge being on hold, the Palin administration allocated tens of millions of dollars of federal funds to begin construction of the Gravina island road to an empty beach meant to link to the bridge. > > In August 2007, Alaska’s DOT stated that it was “leaning” toward alternative ferry options, citing bridge costs, despite having already received the funds from the federal government.[8] > > The Alaskan state government cancelled the project in September 2007. > > ``` > Ketchikan desires a better way to reach the airport, but the $398 million bridge is not the answer. Despite the work of our congressional delegation, we are about $329 million short of full funding for the bridge project, and it’s clear that Congress has little interest in spending any more money on a bridge between Ketchikan and Gravina Island. Much of the public’s attitude toward Alaska bridges is based on inaccurate portrayals of the projects here. But we need to focus on what we can do, rather than fight over what has happened.[9][10] > > ``` In short she eventually came out against it because it didn’t include _enough_ pork. Also according to [this report](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/discussion/2008/08/29/DI2008082902052.html) her current approval ratings are a respectable but still more modest 65%. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/131 "2008-09-03T06:34:57Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > **CanvasShoes** , sorry but your claim that is [untrue.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravina_Island_Bridge)In short she eventually came out against it because it didn’t include _enough_ pork. > > Also according to [this report](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/discussion/2008/08/29/DI2008082902052.html) her current approval ratings are a respectable but still more modest 65%. And even that 65% number is largely because Alaska is swimming in cash, and most any Governor can maintain a high approval rating if they don’t rock the boat. I saw a poll that said 85% of Alaskans believe she lied about troopergate, though (I think the audiotape had something to do with that). ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/132 "2008-09-03T06:35:17Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > What, those shills? 😛 > Sam? Sarahfeena? Not to call you out specifically, but it would be interesting to hear your take(s) on the credibility/outcome and its impact. > > Taken in the worst light, does it change anything? > > What about taken in the best light? > > Rather than put words in your mouth, I’ll leave it to you to define what the worst light means (e.g., not worst light from a rabid Obamite’s p.o.v., but worst light from removing benefit of the doubt, giving the tie to the runner, etc.). I know you asked other posters but, I’ll bite too. Taken in the worst light, I think it’s sad. It will heavily color people’s opinions and that’s going to help make this one of the most mudslinging, ugliest campaigns (if that’s possible) ever. Taken in best light, I’m disappointed in Sarah that she wasn’t better informed as to this issue. In a recent local news tidbit, a few weeks before the VP announcement, it was disclosed that an aide may have stepped outside his/her authority and done something on this troopergate issue, but word from the Gov’nrs aides was that this person had been put on leave pending investigation. I didn’t know that, as others have posted, there was so much other seeming ignorance on the Gov’s part. Based upon her other actions and behaviour during her time in office, I’d say, (again sadly), that she just wasn’t paying enough attention to what was going on, rather than being an active part and abusing her power. I guess we’ll all just have to wait and see. Sure am glad I didn’t try to buy that bigger condo!!! If Obama gets into office, I’d be eating top ramen and walking to work! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/133 "2008-09-03T06:39:38Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > Is there a credible cite for that? You know, you might want to actually READ THE THREAD. Back in post #59, I linked to an ABC article which cites a couple of the Alaska state Senators who are involved in the investigation. [Here’s the article, for the second time.](http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5702697&page=1) She has changed her story a couple of times regarding the pressure put to bear on Monegan, and the investigators have already stated that based on what they have already uncovered their report, due out on October 31, is not likely to be favorable toward the Governor. The Senators also make the exceedingly clear point that NO ONE from the McCain campaign contacted them regarding Ms Palin or her investigation prior to the announcement of her choice as his VP candidate. One would assume that a thorough vetting would involve speaking to state Senators who’ve been commissioned by the overwhelmingly Republican state government to investigate the governor, but then again I’m a librul Democratic Obamaniac who obviously does not understand the arcane mysteries of the Republican VP choosing process. Yes, there is a credible cite for that. There are credible cites for a lot of the stuff I and some of my librul compatriots are saying about Governor Palin. What I am NOT seeing are any blue, underlined areas going to credible cites for those apologists who are STILL insisting that this woman has any sort of credibility as a VP choice. It’s a rather glaring difference, actually. Especially since it also seems that those who have no blue underlines in their posts haven’t bothered to click on the blue underlines in other posts to see what might lie behind them, out there in the real world where real people are finding out real information to base their claims on. I’m sure someone will be along in a moment to explain why magical Republicans don’t NEED to cite sources and all that mundane stuff us libruls feel compelled to do for our own unfathomably silly reasons. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/134 "2008-09-03T06:43:32Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > And even that 65% number is largely because Alaska is swimming in cash, and most any Governor can maintain a high approval rating if they don’t rock the boat. Odd, the same channel KTUU that was quoted above as vilifying Sarah on troopergate, was the one that stated that number for approval ratings a few nights ago on the nightly news. But okay, written word trumps empty headed anchorperson. Re: Any governer? Not so, Murky was practically ran out of town on a rail thanks to his actions in govt. At least judging from the gubernatorial election 2 years ago. The man is pretty much hated by most of us, again, based upon local talk. Unless you’re talking some rightie talk show idiot like Rick Rydell who thinks “it’d be really awesome to just have a bunch of wolves and stuff out in a field and you could just go out there and kill everything standing, that’d be great” Or former Mayor of Anchorage (I believe it was Tom Fink,again on wolf control) “you can’t just let nature run wild you know”. Republicans like that you mean? Yeah, I agree with you there. But that’s just not Sarah. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/135 "2008-09-03T06:47:56Z")
> [@CanvasShoes](#): > > I didn’t know that, as others have posted, there was so much other seeming ignorance on the Gov’s part. Based upon her other actions and behaviour during her time in office, I’d say, (again sadly), that she just wasn’t paying enough attention to what was going on, rather than being an active part and abusing her power. What does it say about her abilities as an executive and an administrator if this stuff can go on under her nose – including the involvement of her own husband? That’s a pretty big pass to give Palin, that she didn’t know what her own husband was doing. I can’t imagine it would ever be believed that Hillary Clinton wasn’t aware of Bill doing something like that (or Barack Obama being unaware of Michelle doing it). > [@](#): > > I guess we’ll all just have to wait and see. Sure am glad I didn’t try to buy that bigger condo!!! If Obama gets into office, I’d be eating top ramen and walking to work! 😃 Yeah, I’m sure after four more years of McSame, we’ll all be farting through silk. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/136 "2008-09-03T06:56:12Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > You know, you might want to actually READ THE THREAD. Back in post #59, I linked to an ABC article which cites a couple of the Alaska state Senators who are involved in the investigation. [URL=“['October Surprise' Over Palin Investigation? - ABC News](http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5702697&page=1)”]… Hey, don’t shout at me!!! :eek: Sorry I missed your post – it was Sam’s assertion that DtC was responding to, so I thought things were still up in the air to an extent. I had seen a Youtube clip that looked like a screen cap of local (Alaskan) CBS news coverage, but I couldn’t find it again. I know it’s either somewhere in here or in one of the other Palin threads, but again, based on Sam’s post, I thought for a there was a discrepancy. Reading your link, there’s also this: > [@](#): > > French says the investigation will also seek to learn how the Governor’s office obtained confidential information from her ex-brother-in-law’s personnel file. That’s quite an assertion – and with the flap over Hillary’s missing-found FBI files (which, I assume, will be used as some sort of defense to the allegations), it will be interesting to compare then-and-now quotes from Republicans over its import. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/137 "2008-09-03T07:01:21Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > Hey, don’t shout at me!!! :eek: Sorry, didn’t mean to be that snarky–it’s just that I’ve been beating my head against a wall, posting nothing BUT good links to reputable information and getting back nothing but the same tired-ass repuglican talking points, it’s the rhetorical version of “I know you are, but what am I? x infinity” Then I get a headache because this isn’t in the Pit and I can’t call a spade a spade when it needs to stop shovelling… :smack: I should just pop a pain pill and go the hell to bed… Sorry again, may I offer you a conciliatory terrorist fist jab? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/138 "2008-09-03T07:11:52Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What does it say about her abilities as an executive and an administrator if this stuff can go on under her nose – including the involvement of her own husband? That’s a pretty big pass to give Palin, that she didn’t know what her own husband was doing. I can’t imagine it would ever be believed that Hillary Clinton wasn’t aware of Bill doing something like that (or Barack Obama being unaware of Michelle doing it). What it says to me is either way, it’s no different than every other Washington politician. And I’m unhappy with that. But I’m still less unhappy with it than I would be if it were Obama. > [@](#): > > Yeah, I’m sure after four more years of McSame, we’ll all be farting through silk. 😛 Well, I certainly don’t expect that either, but at least he won’t try to break the backbone of the country like Barrack will. If Obama, as he has made quite clear through his speeches, gets his way and starts punishing those in the top earning percentages, well, sorry to be unlady-like, but shit rolls downhill. The very rich, those who financially support the country will pass the pain on April 15 etc on to the upper-middle classes. They’ll add their own pile of shit, and then pass it down to the middle-middle classes, the backbone, eventually all of the shit will end up on top of the very people that Obama _says_ he is trying to help, the very poor and so on and so forth. I certainly am not looking for silk, but I’ve worked my ass off to get where I am, FINALLY, and I’m much too old and decrepit to have to start over. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 7:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/139 "2008-09-03T07:22:14Z")
> [@CanvasShoes](#): > > I’m much too old and decrepit to have to start over. at last–a coherent campaign slogan for McCain on social change! ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2008, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686/140 "2008-09-03T07:31:17Z")
Okay **Canvas** at least now we can talk policy issues. So it sounds like you believe in trickle-down, in both forms, prosperity and shit. Thing is that giving the wealthiest the biggest breaks has been what’s been tried by the Bush administration and indeed McCain is promising to do the same except perhaps with a bigger hammer. How’s that worked for you so far? The wealthiest are actually the least likely to have their spending effected by the marginal tax rate. The middle OTOH are more likely to have spending patterns influenced by the amount left on the pay stub each month. In reality trickle-up is a more realistic model. Prosperity rises. The economic machine is powered by the many more than by the few. Trickle-down has failed. You may want to consider the wisdom of [trickle-up.](http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/dicklee/gGCNPj) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-again-who-is-sarah-palin/461686.md?page=8)