# And from the " Slut-Shaming Is The Way We Live, Deep In The Heart of Texas " Department... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 18, 2018, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817 "2018-08-18T01:00:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/101 "2018-08-20T11:12:44Z")
I read what Starving Artist wrote and I thought: Can he really be that stupid? Can anyone? And then I realized that some idiot put that shit on the wall in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/102 "2018-08-20T11:16:43Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > As I said upthread, to me there’s nothing about that statement above the girls’ lockers that has anything to do with sex at all, so I’d like to know just how it is that you people so reflexively manage to connect it up as making sexual assault the girls’ fault. Because I can tell you that to most of the conservatives in this country you people sound ridiculous and that you’re just making shit up out of thin air simply because you don’t like wholesomeness. Okay, just curiosity here, but let’s say that you win and the saying stays up. What would you suggest as the male-focused counterpart for the other side of the hall/boy’s locker room? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/103 "2018-08-20T11:17:57Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Are you under the impression that Meryl Streep hasn’t been a victim of sexual assault? No. > [@Kimstu](#): > > And I’m somewhat baffled why you think that a former escort service worker and professional pimp like Barrows would be a less likely target of sexual harassment than a law-abiding mainstream entertainment celebrity like Schumer. Barrows has denied being a ‘worker’ in the escort business. Nor was she a ‘pimp’ in the commonly understood meaning of the word. She ran a business that set up appointments between call girls and clients. As to why she’d be less likely a target, that would be because despite her background in the the sex service industry, she’s a charming, well-educated, and dare I say it, ladylike, woman who undoubtedly travels in more polite and civilized circles than does someone like Amy Schumer. > [@Kimstu](#): > > :dubious: ISTM that buying into a worldview in which it’s assumed to be too risky or scary for ablebodied women to walk to their own cars at their own workplace after sunset does not actually constitute “having a much better time of it as they pass through life”. This is too silly to bother with. > [@Kimstu](#): > > Ostentatious acts of so-called chivalry that require women to depend on men’s offering them (real or imaginary) protection are not an adequate substitute for women’s having genuine autonomy and freedom. Perhaps you could try instead supervising the behavior of men around your workplace after dark so that they don’t assault women, rather than encouraging the women to feel that **they’re** the ones who need supervision and restricted movement for the sake of their safety. I’m at a bit of a loss to understand how I might see women to their cars in a less ‘ostentatious’ way.:rolleyes: And it isn’t our own employees that pose a potential threat, but rather any of a number of the random criminal element our society is so rife with these days. And I hardly think walking with a woman as she goes out to her car, often accompanied by friendly joking and pleasant chit-chat (and sometimes my having to break said chit-chat off and remind them of my need to get back inside) may properly be characterized as ‘supervison’, nor could their path from the door of our building to their car be reasonably described as ‘restricted’. You really need to put a little more thought into this practice of yours of attempting to insert prejudicial verbiage into posts you make to opponents. ---
**Author:** ![blob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blob/32/489_2.png) [@blob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blob)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/104 "2018-08-20T11:29:45Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > she’s a charming, well-educated, and dare I say it, ladylike, woman who undoubtedly travels in more polite and civilized circles than does someone like Amy Schumer. You mean, the circles that pay her to provide prostitutes? Yes, very nice company. Have you suggested to the young women at your work that they should pursue such activities so that they can travel in those “polite and civilized circles”? ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/105 "2018-08-20T11:55:24Z")
“Ladylike’ ‘Travels in polite and civilized circles’ Fresh steaming piles of wildly outdated misogyny. Ugh! “…IF I COULD TURN BACK TIME…” ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/106 "2018-08-20T11:55:45Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > Okay, just curiosity here, but let’s say that you win and the saying stays up. What would you suggest as the male-focused counterpart for the other side of the hall/boy’s locker room? It seems to me like it is gendered for no good reason. You can easily use some form of the golden rule to say exactly the same thing that should be (hopefully) uncontroversial. i.e. “treat others as you wish to be treated yourself”. No need to mention men or women at all, it is something that should be part of every school ethos as important for \*all \*to adhere to for \*all \*situations. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/107 "2018-08-20T12:08:47Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > The crucial point you’re ignoring is that the statement is implicitly making girls **responsible** for boys’ behavior by being “ladylike”: > > This is clearly suggesting that boys aren’t obligated or expected to act “gentlemanly” with girls who don’t act “ladylike”. And the secondary implication is that if he treats you in an “ungentlemanly” way, it’s because you weren’t being “ladylike” enough. > > Both of those messages are unethical and wrong. And yes, they are a form of victim-blaming when it comes to sexual mistreatment of girls. Yes, but you’re having to pervert the words to make them say what you need them to say in order to arrive at the message you’re claiming they contain. The message is not “The more you act like a lady, the more he’ll act like a gentleman”. It’s “The more you act like a lady, the more _likely_ it is that the guys will act like gentlemen”. Nowhere in the school’s message is it implied that _every_ guy will act like a gentleman, nor is it implied that no guy will ever commit rape or assault. By the time they reach middle school, everyone, boy or girl, should know that there are simply bad people out there, and there’s no way anyone can guarantee that you won’t ever run afoul of one of them. And believe it or not, most people know this already. I seriously doubt that sex of any kind was on anyone’s mind at all when they wrote that message. It was simply intended as a way to get girls to try to behave in ways that would encourage guys to behave better themselves. But you people, ever eager to manufacture victims somewhere, instantly seized upon it and twisted it into this ridiculous faux message about making sexual assault the girl’s fault, as if the school’s administration for some idiotic and utterly incomprehensible reason deliberately set out to pre-emptively shift the blame for any future sexual assault onto its female middle school student body in order to spare the boys. The entire idea is ridiculous on the very face of it. ---
**Author:** ![blob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blob/32/489_2.png) [@blob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blob)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/108 "2018-08-20T12:39:28Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > It was simply intended as a way to get girls to try to behave in ways that would encourage guys to behave better themselves. Why, in your world, are guys under no obligation just to BEHAVE THEMSELVES? Poor things, they aren’t responsible for their actions, it’s all somebody else’s fault… If only those girls would encourage them, they might do it, they can’t be expected just to behave properly all on their own… Poor dears, it’s hard not to feel sorry for them, isn;t it?:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/109 "2018-08-20T12:59:16Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > The message is not “The more you act like a lady, the more he’ll act like a gentleman”. That is _ **EXACTLY WHAT THE MESSAGE SAYS** _. Do you need to see an optometrist? Does the site management need to look into enabling blink tags if the other forms of emphasis I just used prove insufficient? Oh, and we’re still wondering: > [@Zakalwe](#): > > What would you suggest as the male-focused counterpart for the other side of the hall/boy’s locker room? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/110 "2018-08-20T13:03:04Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > That is _ **EXACTLY WHAT THE MESSAGE SAYS** _. Do you need to see an optometrist? Does the site management need to look into enabling blink tags if the other forms of emphasis I just used prove insufficient? > > Oh, and we’re still wondering: > [@Zakalwe](#): > > Okay, just curiosity here, but let’s say that you win and the saying stays up. What would you suggest as the male-focused counterpart for the other side of the hall/boy’s locker room? How about “Just because you can’t control yourself doesn’t mean you have the right to attack anything that’s female.” ? ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/111 "2018-08-20T13:49:14Z")
Like how ‘ladylike’ a thirteen yr old girl is determines the ‘gentlemanly’ behaviour of a thirteen yr old boy! How about we charge parents with producing gentlemanly sons instead of looking to other people’s daughters to do that? What a steaming pile of poor reasoning. It’s the 21st freaking century you dinosaur! ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/112 "2018-08-20T14:49:13Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > It seems to me like it is gendered for no good reason. > > You can easily use some form of the golden rule to say exactly the same thing that should be (hopefully) uncontroversial. i.e. “treat others as you wish to be treated yourself”. > > No need to mention men or women at all, it is something that should be part of every school ethos as important for \*all \*to adhere to for \*all \*situations. “Be excellent to each other.” - Bill S. Preston, Esq. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/113 "2018-08-20T15:13:53Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > Okay, just curiosity here, but let’s say that you win and the saying stays up. What would you suggest as the male-focused counterpart for the other side of the hall/boy’s locker room? The more you act like a gentleman the more likely she is to put out? ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/114 "2018-08-20T15:31:12Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > Try this one? > > ['Misogynistic' quote above HISD middle school lockers goes viral | khou.com](https://www.khou.com/article/news/local/misogynistic-quote-above-hisd-middle-school-lockers-goes-viral/285-585244043) Nope. That’s the same website. It probably didn’t implement the new EU rules about data protection (that’s the main reason why we can’t access a non-EU news site, currently). ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/115 "2018-08-20T15:35:26Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > … Obvious Troll continues being Obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/116 "2018-08-20T16:26:56Z")
Leave it to the diseased asshole leakage named Starving Artist to ruin the perfectly good hockey diss thread us ladies were having. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/117 "2018-08-20T16:38:04Z")
> [@Nawth\_Chucka](#): > > Leave it to the diseased asshole leakage named Starving Artist to ruin the perfectly good hockey diss thread us ladies were having. :mad: That wasn’t very ladylike. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/118 "2018-08-20T16:56:45Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > … Obvious Troll continues being Obvious. (Specific words are less indicative of a “potty mouth” mentality than the sentiments expressed, Potty Mouth.) ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/119 "2018-08-20T17:07:08Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Christ what an asshole. Didn’t we recently have some kind of kerfluffle about how exactly these misogynistic ideas cause women to not want to stick around? Yes. Yes we did. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > So hopefully some of the more imbecilic aspects of the women’s movement have blown over and now with the younger generation men can get back to doing nice and thoughtful things for women without being glared at or called sexist pigs for their trouble. You really are an oblivious dinosaur. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817/120 "2018-08-20T17:14:08Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Nope. That’s the same website. It probably didn’t implement the new EU rules about data protection (that’s the main reason why we can’t access a non-EU news site, currently). Well, [here’s a link](https://twitter.com/lbeckman/status/1030528413612888068/photo/1) to the Tweet (including photo) at least. And here’s a small sampling of the article that I think sums it up: One HISD teacher who wishes to remain anonymous told KHOU she could not believe the quote is at the school in 2018. […] “To me it meant that girls need to take responsibility, not only for their own actions, but for whatever the boys to us as well and I just didn’t feel like that was an image of the equality and self-determination that, we as a district or myself as a mother, want to portray,” the teacher said. Several Twitter users claimed the quote was photoshopped but Beckman responded saying it was real, tweeting more high resolution shots of the quote. A couple of hours later, HISD confirmed the photo was in fact real when the district sent a statement to KHOU 11 News Friday afternoon. “The quote does not align with HISD values, and it will be taken down.” the statement read. Disturbingly enough, the quote comes from Sydney Biddle Barrows, a business woman who was the owner of an escort agency in New York City. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-from-the-slut-shaming-is-the-way-we-live-deep-in-the-heart-of-texas-department/819817.md?page=7)