# And Kinsey spake and saith, "Let there be sex!"--EEEK! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 11, 2004, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283 "2004-11-11T22:18:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Rashak\_Mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@Rashak\_Mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rashak_Mani)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/41 "2004-11-12T18:02:57Z")
> [@Governor Quinn](#): > > The truly amusing thing is that, if this goes the way all similar protests of films have gone, this will result in more people seeing the film. > > If they really wanted to do something, they wouldn’t say a word about this film. One wonders if the producers didn’t send the info about the film to these groups directly… hoping for exactly this kind of controversy and public interest 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/42 "2004-11-12T18:22:19Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > I think I got the reasonning. There has been debates about whether datas obtained in inhumane condition should be used or not in medical science. And it seems to me that Mengele was used as an example in said debates. For instance, if Mengele conducted some particularily nasty experiment, and he noted down the result, should these datas be ignored because they were obtained in an inhumane way, or should they be used because the harm is already done, and it could be useful for medical science (especially since they can’t possibly be conducted again)? > Apparently, Kinsey would have used in his study datas provided by a criminal and gathered in the pursuit of his criminal actions. Hence, he would be in the same position as a medical scientist who would have published a study based on the results of Mengele’s experiments, something that many could consider as morally bankrupt. > > There’s still a step missing (comparing him directly to Mengele rather than to the medical scientist), and this is only a wild guess, but this assumption make the piece you quoted somewhat less idiotic. I think that the debate was not so much over the ethics of Kinsey’s obtaining data from incarcerated prisoners, but in his extrapolating those results to the public at large. Absent data that the people in prison are representative of the public at large, this is a significant methodological shortcoming. However, I don’t know enough about Kinsey’s work to know if the criticism is valid or not. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/43 "2004-11-12T18:29:58Z")
> [@Governor Quinn](#): > > The truly amusing thing is that, if this goes the way all similar protests of films have gone, this will result in more people seeing the film. > > If they really wanted to do something, they wouldn’t say a word about this film. When The Last Temptation Of Christ came out, I saw an interview with a priest who urged Christians not to protest. He had led protests of a film in the seventies and was convinced that the added publicity had helped make the movie such a hit. It was a little film called Deep Throat. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/44 "2004-11-12T23:20:18Z")
Ok I read up on this since I had no idea what it was. all I can say is… > [@gobear](#): > > The forces of ignorance strike again. According to this [article](http://www.imdb.com/news/sb/#1) on IMDB, a gaggle of dimwits terrified by the complexities of human sexuality and dead ignorant of history, psychology, or sociology are planning to perform chanting rituals to placate their nonexistent deity, who apparently disapproves of the genitals He created. …sums my thoughts up _perfectly_. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/45 "2004-11-12T23:32:14Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Tired of Christian Fundies? > > Judasim- No ham. But you can pork brains out. > > ;j ;j ;j That’s gotta be one of the best sigworthy quotes I’ve seen around these parts in a long time. Fucking brilliant. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Lilairen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lilairen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lilairen)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/46 "2004-11-12T23:59:28Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > In the spirit of scientific research into human sexuality, may I invite Robert Knight and his flock of sexphobic losers to go fuck themselves? I thought this was terrific, and quoted it to a bunch of folks. My boyfriend responded, “No. You have to have a control group. So you may only invite a randomly-selected 50% of them to.” (Quoted with permission.) ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/47 "2004-11-13T05:03:32Z")
> [@AskNott](#): > > If you have ever considered Richard Mellon Scaife’s worldnetdaily a source of factual information, this thread should set you straight. :rolleyes: Scaife owns WorldNetDaily? Are you sure? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Death](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecccb3/32.png) [@Evil\_Death](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Death)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 10:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/48 "2004-11-13T10:36:10Z")
> [@Otto](#): > > I pity them. > > Or, I would pity them, if they didn’t, you know, _run the whole fucking country_. Look on the up side, Otto - the last time a nation of religious nuts followed a Bush, they spent _forty_ years in the wilderness. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/49 "2004-11-13T11:15:13Z")
> [@Gobear](#): > > The forces of ignorance strike again. According to this article on IMDB, a gaggle of dimwits terrified by the complexities of human sexuality and dead ignorant of history, psychology, or sociology are planning to perform chanting rituals to placate their nonexistent deity, who apparently disapproves of the genitals He created. Due respect, and in keeping with our newly restored friendship, don’t you think that the reference to “their nonexistent deity” is, if not a bit harsh, a bit untenable? Consider the man who just simply sees nothing beautiful whatsoever in the works of Salvador Dali. Wouldn’t it be odd for him to say, writing on those who adore Dali’s work, something about “their nonexistent aesthetic”? I mean, just because he cannot see the beauty does not mean that no man can possibly see the beauty or that the beauty does not exist. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/50 "2004-11-13T13:10:53Z")
I disagree with your comparison, \*\* Liberal \*\*. Aesthetics are highly subjective. The actual existence of something (god in this case) is factual. One could argue one way or the other about the existence of god, but either he exists, either he doesn’t. The equivalent of your Dali example would be for instance people assuming that god exists and debatting about him being loving and compassionnate or mean and bloodthirsty. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/51 "2004-11-13T14:51:58Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Due respect, and in keeping with our newly restored friendship, don’t you think that the reference to “their nonexistent deity” is, if not a bit harsh, a bit untenable? Consider the man who just simply sees nothing beautiful whatsoever in the works of Salvador Dali. Wouldn’t it be odd for him to say, writing on those who adore Dali’s work, something about “their nonexistent aesthetic”? I mean, just because he cannot see the beauty does not mean that no man can possibly see the beauty or that the beauty does not exist. > [@Liberal](#): > > Due respect, and in keeping with our newly restored friendship, don’t you think that the reference to “their nonexistent deity” is, if not a bit harsh, a bit untenable? Consider the man who just simply sees nothing beautiful whatsoever in the works of Salvador Dali. Wouldn’t it be odd for him to say, writing on those who adore Dali’s work, something about “their nonexistent aesthetic”? I mean, just because he cannot see the beauty does not mean that no man can possibly see the beauty or that the beauty does not exist. I think you’re confusing the reality of the object with feelings about the object. i know that you are religious and I know you are perfectly sincere in your faith, just as I am sure that a Dali fan is sincere in his admiration. But I can see a Dali painting, I can see photos of the artist, I have a reasonable belief in the existence of his work. The same cannot be said of any deity (not just yours). I don’t believe in YHWH for the same reasons that I don’t believe in Zeus or elves. They might exist, but the odds are they don’t. As for being harsh, venting goes in the Pit, does it not? In any event, I don’t see how faith in god justifies blatant lies about Alfred Kinsey and the _a priori_ censorship of the movie. If the ultrafundies don’t want to see the movie, nobody’s forcing them to. They have a choice to see it or not. But they do not reciprocate freedom of choice–they wish to forbid anyone from seeing the movie. They wish to set themselves up as judges even over people who do not share their beliefs, and I reject that utterly. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/52 "2004-11-13T17:33:50Z")
I thought the line about a “nonexistent deity” was gratuitous as well. It unnecessarily had the effect of insulting people who would otherwise sympathize with your rant, many of whom are the first to say (and who say so frequently on this board) that the kind of intolerant and dishonest behavior described in your OP is completely unacceptable, **un** Christian, and unjustified by either faith or the Bible. There are people who want to be on your side, you feel the same way you do and it is wasn’t especially called for in _this_ thread (as opposed to the many other threads and debates relating to theism and the supernatural in which such pronouncements are _expected_ by theists and are not taken personally) to tell them _all_ that their God doesn’t exist. ---
**Author:** ![iampunha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/74df32/32.png) [@iampunha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iampunha)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2004, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/53 "2004-11-14T00:19:24Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Jesus Christ, don’t these people have anything better to do? Honestly, wouldn’t God prefer that they volunteer at a soup kitchen, rather than protesting some frigging movie? Serve the poor or protect Our Children from the evils of Homosexuality? You haven’t been getting your AFA email updates, have you? I’ll pray for you… ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2004, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283/54 "2004-11-14T01:02:05Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I thought the line about a “nonexistent deity” was gratuitous as well. It unnecessarily had the effect of insulting people who would otherwise sympathize with your rant, many of whom are the first to say (and who say so frequently on this board) that the kind of intolerant and dishonest behavior described in your OP is completely unacceptable, **un** Christian, and unjustified by either faith or the Bible. There are people who want to be on your side, you feel the same way you do and it is wasn’t especially called for in _this_ thread (as opposed to the many other threads and debates relating to theism and the supernatural in which such pronouncements are _expected_ by theists and are not taken personally) to tell them _all_ that their God doesn’t exist. Remind me to introduce you to the concept of a rant sometime. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-kinsey-spake-and-saith-let-there-be-sex-eeek/274283.md?page=2)