# And now, reported to the police for babysitting while being black **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 14, 2018, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943 "2018-10-14T17:34:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/21 "2018-10-16T04:06:52Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Note from the article: > If he would have said yes then that conversation would have verified that Mr. Lewis was a babysitter–and she wouldn’t have called the police. Oh, I see. So it’s really his fault. I think if I were the parents, I would be glad that my babysitter did not let some random stranger talk to my children in a parking lot. She might have been a potential kidnapper or something. Except, of course, that she is a white woman and he is a black man, so he should trust her good intentions implicitly. ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/22 "2018-10-16T04:19:04Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Note from the article: > > If he would have said yes…and she wouldn’t have called the police. How do we know that? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/23 "2018-10-16T06:44:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > It depends on what she said to 911, but the officer’s response, that she “feels uncomfortable,” with him there is probably not criminal. In other words, she didn’t say (that we know of) anything false. > > For comparison’s sake, consider a 911 call reporting a man with a gun in a holster, in a state where open carry is legal. Would you imagine that call as a criminal act? That would depend on what 911 is there to do. Is it just the number for the police? Then, no, I wouldn’t have a problem with that, really. It’s just a concerned citizen reporting something they find suspicious. The police then can choose to investigate or not. But if 911 is the emergency number? Then both are wasting everyone’s time reporting something that is not an emergency. I could see that being criminal. I would want the punishment to fit the crime, so probably a first time would just an admonishment, but I would want there to be an option of prosecuting repeated non-emergency calls to 911. In this situation, I am presuming this is a non-emergency number. As such, I don’t see any reason to punish the caller other social shame. However, I do question the police’s choice to get involved based on only what she said. Some would say there’s no harm in checking, but I disagree. There is a cost in this: that of allowing people to disrupt the lives of perfectly law abiding citizens. Police should need some minimal level of cause to investigate, and “felt uncomfortable” does not fit that, in my opinion ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/24 "2018-10-16T07:18:29Z")
Good grief. The little girl, Addison, said to a reporter: > [@from article](#): > > Mr. Parker said he had a proud moment when, during an interview with a reporter, his daughter was asked if she had anything she wanted to say to the woman. “She said that, ‘I would just ask her to next time, try to see us as three people rather than three skin colors because we might’ve been Mr. Lewis’s adopted children,’” he recalled. Looks like we should be trusting the kids over adults in this kind of malarky. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/25 "2018-10-16T07:38:49Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > There are two very clear problems with trying to charge people like this: > > 1. Prosecuting someone for “misuse of 911” is potentially an immensely hard case to make. I mean, how often are you going to be able to prove malicious or fraudulent intent? > > and > > 1. Going after this stuff hard core would create a chilling effect on legitimate use of 911. I tend to agree. At the same time, though, I think we should be able to do something about people who feel entitled to weaponize the service, especially against people of color, whenever they feel vaguely uncomfortable or encounter something that is merely outside of their range of experience. I guess the best outcome we can hope for is social opprobrium and, as happened in this case, that the person suffers some other consequence for their bigotry or prejudice, such as losing their job. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/26 "2018-10-16T08:30:12Z")
I don’t agree “kudos” to the officer. How many times did he need to ask them if they were okay? And let’s be honest: At the point in time, that man’s life was in the hands of two small white children. Thank god they were good kids, and told the truth. I can’t even begin to imagine what that must feel like. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/27 "2018-10-16T18:07:19Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Er… what crimes could she be arrested for? Er… Filing a false police report. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/28 "2018-10-16T18:42:52Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Er… Filing a false police report. IANAL, but in [New York](https://newyorklegaldefense.com/resources/ny-penal-law/article-240-offenses-against-public-order/240-50/) it does not appear that calling 9/11 even if your suspicions are unfounded constitutes filing a false report. It’s more like reporting a crime that you know didn’t happen. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Wolf333](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf333/32/3460_2.png) [@Wolf333](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolf333)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/29 "2018-10-16T18:51:12Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Note from the article: > If he would have said yes then that conversation would have verified that Mr. Lewis was a babysitter–and she wouldn’t have called the police. Same wo7ld be true if she had just minded her business. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/30 "2018-10-16T19:09:25Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > I don’t agree “kudos” to the officer. How many times did he need to ask them if they were okay? I think you’re being unfair. The officer couldn’t be certain of the whole story at this point. Unless the police are certain that the reporting woman is a racist fool (if she has priors, for example) then policy must surely be to remain calm and civil but prioritize certainty about children’s safety, and the quickest and easiest way to do that (and let the guy go on his way) is to talk to them. Peripheral social concerns must take a temporary back seat to that. The racist woman’s bullshit is entirely responsible for this, and if it’s a widespread problem we must find a way to deal with it _other_ than making cops reluctant to check on the safety of children when it’s in question. > [@Grrr](#): > > And let’s be honest: At the point in time, that man’s life was in the hands of two small white children. Thank god they were good kids, and told the truth. His _life_? We’re discussing _this_ cop’s behavior, and whether it was appropriate. Based on this cop’s behavior, what evidence do you have that if the kids lied, there would have been anything other than an orderly arrest? And what would you expect a cop to do other than arrest the guy if the kids confirmed that they were being kidnapped? And how would that be the fault of anyone other than a racist woman + stupid kids? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/31 "2018-10-16T21:50:48Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > IANAL, but in [New York](https://newyorklegaldefense.com/resources/ny-penal-law/article-240-offenses-against-public-order/240-50/) it does not appear that calling 9/11 even if your suspicions are unfounded constitutes filing a false report. It’s more like reporting a crime that you know didn’t happen. > > Regards, > Shodan The apartment confrontation happened in St. Louis. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/32 "2018-10-17T01:37:09Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I think you’re being unfair. The officer couldn’t be certain of the whole story at this point. Unless the police are certain that the reporting woman is a racist fool (if she has priors, for example) then policy must surely be to remain calm and civil but prioritize certainty about children’s safety, and the quickest and easiest way to do that (and let the guy go on his way) is to talk to them. Peripheral social concerns must take a temporary back seat to that. The racist woman’s bullshit is entirely responsible for this, and if it’s a widespread problem we must find a way to deal with it _other_ than making cops reluctant to check on the safety of children when it’s in question. No, sorry, it was obvious to me, those kids were fine after the first asking. Also, cops need to stop entertaining this shit. Instead of questioning the children over and over, he should have been questioning that lady. Asking her what reason does she have for suspecting there was something wrong with this gentleman. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/33 "2018-10-17T01:45:30Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > No, sorry, it was obvious to me, those kids were fine after the first asking. I’m not sure what you mean by “first asking”. I’m not seeing multiple asking, maybe we are looking at different videos? All I’ve seen is the one (below) linked in the second post, where the “kidnapper” is annoyed but calm and cooperative; the cop is polite but firm about asking the kids to step out of the car at 1:20; the cop is then seen talking in an amicable and chatty way briefly with the kids and the guy; he seems satsified and the video ends 17 seconds later, but it doesn’t show how the interaction ends. Is there another longer video showing the cop persisting longer? > **[Babysitting While Black: Georgia Man Was Stalked by Woman as He Cared for 2...](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/09/us/black-man-babysitting.html)** > > A black man who was babysitting two white children had the police called on him after a white woman tried to question him about what they were doing with him. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/34 "2018-10-17T02:34:50Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I’m not sure what you mean by “first asking”. I’m not seeing multiple asking, maybe we are looking at different videos? All I’ve seen is the one (below) linked in the second post, where the “kidnapper” is annoyed but calm and cooperative; the cop is polite but firm about asking the kids to step out of the car at 1:20; the cop is then seen talking in an amicable and chatty way briefly with the kids and the guy; he seems satsified and the video ends 17 seconds later, but it doesn’t show how the interaction ends. Is there another longer video showing the cop persisting longer? > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/09/us/black-man-babysitting.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/09/us/black-man-babysitting.html) I can’t watch videos right now because I’m at work. But the one I saw the cop asked the kids if they were okay about three or four times. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/35 "2018-10-17T20:21:18Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Er… Filing a false police report. Er… no. Unless she said something specific to the police that was gone unreported, beyond simply “I feel uncomfortable,” that’s not the crime described by MO Rev Stat § 575.080. > [@](#): > > 575.080. 1. A person commits the crime of making a false report if he knowingly: > > (1) Gives false information to any person for the purpose of implicating another person in a crime; or > > (2) Makes a false report to a law enforcement officer that a crime has occurred or is about to occur; or > > (3) Makes a false report or causes a false report to be made to a law enforcement officer, security officer, fire department or other organization, official or volunteer, which deals with emergencies involving danger to life or property that a fire or other incident calling for an emergency response has occurred or is about to occur. All three sections of § 575.080 require a specific falsehood, and she apparently said only that she felt uncomfortable, which, whatever else we may say about it, seems undeniably true. Or was there some other relevant section of the Missouri Revised Statutes you were picturing? ---
**Author:** ![ctnguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@ctnguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ctnguy)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/36 "2018-10-18T10:11:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Er… no. Unless she said something specific to the police that was gone unreported, beyond simply “I feel uncomfortable,” that’s not the crime described by MO Rev Stat § 575.080. > > All three sections of § 575.080 require a specific falsehood, and she apparently said only that she felt uncomfortable, which, whatever else we may say about it, seems undeniably true. > > Or was there some other relevant section of the Missouri Revised Statutes you were picturing? Would the St Louis police normally send out officers to respond to a 911 call stating nothing more than, “a man went into an apartment in my building and I feel uncomfortable”? I’m genuinely asking, not trying to be snarky, but I do have a sneaking suspicion that she must have lied or exaggerated to 911 to get a police response. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/37 "2018-10-18T10:52:57Z")
> [@ctnguy](#): > > Would the St Louis police normally send out officers to respond to a 911 call stating nothing more than, “a man went into an apartment in my building and I feel uncomfortable”? I’m genuinely asking, not trying to be snarky, but I do have a sneaking suspicion that she must have lied or exaggerated to 911 to get a police response. Not to defend this lady, but “I don’t think he lives here” or “I think he’s a burglar” is both not a lie and not a false report. When I had a run-in with a shady character years ago, the police told me I should have just called them after the first shady thing he did, and not waited until he went completely off the rails. What this does require is some critical thinking skills, and an understanding that the police go into these encounters with the knowledge that anyone in this country could be carrying a gun, and criminals caught in the act might not shy away from using it. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/38 "2018-10-18T13:39:08Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I tend to agree. At the same time, though, I think we should be able to do something about people who feel entitled to weaponize the service, especially against people of color, whenever they feel vaguely uncomfortable or encounter something that is merely outside of their range of experience. I wholeheartedly agree in principle that people should not be permitted to abuse 911. I am sure you might have run across the article by a former 911 operator about how “a black person is doing (insert perfectly normal activity)” is something they had to deal with every day, and of course dumb 911 calls are not restricted to Verbing While Black. People have called 911 because their favourite TV show wasn’t on. Personally I am kind of amazed anyone calls 911 for anything that is not a dangerous or serious health situation, but maybe in some places that’s how it’s supposed to work. The thing is, though, that we don’t want to create unintended consequences. The 911 system has saved a lot of lives - like, thousands and thousands of them. As maddening as Verbing While Black calls and harassment are, anything done that disincentivizes the use of 911 could, while reducing harassment calls, also reduce effective calls. Absent a really good statistical analysis I don’t know either way what the correct step is, but ensuring people feel empowered to call for help strikes me as being the likely safest approach. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/39 "2018-10-18T14:13:41Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I wholeheartedly agree in principle that people should not be permitted to abuse 911. I am sure you might have run across the article by a former 911 operator about how “a black person is doing (insert perfectly normal activity)” is something they had to deal with every day, and of course dumb 911 calls are not restricted to Verbing While Black. People have called 911 because their favourite TV show wasn’t on. Personally I am kind of amazed anyone calls 911 for anything that is not a dangerous or serious health situation, but maybe in some places that’s how it’s supposed to work. > > The thing is, though, that we don’t want to create unintended consequences. The 911 system has saved a lot of lives - like, thousands and thousands of them. As maddening as Verbing While Black calls and harassment are, anything done that disincentivizes the use of 911 could, while reducing harassment calls, also reduce effective calls. Absent a really good statistical analysis I don’t know either way what the correct step is, but ensuring people feel empowered to call for help strikes me as being the likely safest approach. It’s weird - some people will call 911 because they didn’t get the right cheeseburger, other people [won’t call 911 when they see a drunk driver speeding off the wrong way on a one way street](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=310203&highlight=police). ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2018, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943/40 "2018-10-19T15:10:49Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > As maddening as Verbing While Black calls and harassment are, anything done that disincentivizes the use of 911 could, while reducing harassment calls, also reduce effective calls. Absent a really good statistical analysis I don’t know either way what the correct step is, but ensuring people feel empowered to call for help strikes me as being the likely safest approach. People seem over-empowered to call for help right now. When they see a normal black man with some white children the safest approach is to call for help? You are part of the problem. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-reported-to-the-police-for-babysitting-while-being-black/822943.md?page=3)