# And now we've given up **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 7, 2021, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792 "2021-06-07T21:39:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2021, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/81 "2021-07-17T21:10:33Z")
> Quote from Robin Williams. > > Years ago, someone got modded on these boards for quoting it, because it was seen as an insult, outside the Pit. > > Canadian Dopers rushed to defend the user, saying “no, it’s social commentary!” 😃 > > I think it’s entered the vernacular now. They are a terrible poster and I’m surprised they’re still around. wait… 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2021, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/82 "2021-07-18T14:35:48Z")
Reread _An Enemy of the People_ by Ibsen and _Death in Venice_ by Thomas Mann. Then meditate deeply on the folly of men. Ibsen and Mann successfully teased out a strand of particularly foolish human folly, holding it up into the light of day. Regardless, it is this same strand of folly that has now seized our world. ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2021, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/83 "2021-07-18T18:06:08Z")
> **[Arizona COVID-19 updates: State reports 2,306 new cases, 5 new deaths](https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-health/2021/07/02/arizona-coronavirus-live-news-updates-covid-19-pandemic/7835673002/)** > > Arizona's seven-day death rate per 100,000 people ranked fourth among states and territories as of Saturday, according to the CDC. And it’s working! for a while Arizona’s seven-day death rate was third in the country, we were holding at seventh for a couple of months and now we are back at sixth. It shouldn’t take much more before we are number one. Come on Douchey, I know you can do it!!! ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2021, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/84 "2021-07-20T20:07:58Z")
> **[Arizona COVID-19 updates: State reports 2,306 new cases, 5 new deaths](https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-health/2021/07/02/arizona-coronavirus-live-news-updates-covid-19-pandemic/7835673002/)** > > Arizona's seven-day death rate per 100,000 people ranked fourth among states and territories as of Saturday, according to the CDC. And according to today’s update, we are at For most of May and June, Arizona’s percent positivity was at 5% but increased to 6% for the weeks of June 20 and June 27 and 9% for the week of July 4, according to the state. It was 12% for the week of July 11. It’s at 14% so far for the week of July 18. Schools are going to be opening, they aren’t allowed to mandate masks or require an un-vaccinated child exposed to COVID be quarantined because that would be discriminatory. We did our best to beat New York last year and got really close. Douchey sure does want the win. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2021, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/85 "2021-07-20T21:59:30Z")
Republicans are treating COVID like it’s a major campaign contributor. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2021, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/86 "2021-07-20T22:44:42Z")
It is the grift that keeps on giving. ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/87 "2021-07-22T03:35:55Z")
I didn’t want to start a new thread, but this is new and different (and probably pay-walled). [arizonarepublic](https://arizonarepublic-az.newsmemory.com/?token=27aeddb4422de32d3d5f2ca929eb4ed4&cnum=cf5f07f9-9a77-4704-a737-35dc23ca1a49&fod=1111111-0&selDate=20210721&licenseType=paid_subscriber&) "Phoenix-based Banner Health, which is Arizona’s largest private employer, says its entire workforce must get a COVID-19 vaccine by Nov. 1. Banner is the first health system or hospital in the state to publicly announce mandatory COVID-19 vaccines for employees. There will be “limited exceptions” to the requirement, officials said. The criteria for those exceptions is still being developed, according to Banner leadership." Douchey has forbidden private companies from requiring their employees be vaccinated. Banner is the largest private employer in Arizona and they probably have pretty good lawyers. I am looking forward to the standoff and certainly do hope that Banner wins. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/88 "2021-07-22T03:54:17Z")
Good. We’re in the middle a real Idiocracy-level bunch of idiocy and it’s time to stop dealing with irrational ideas and people as tho they were otherwise. Besides, what are they gonna do? Lock Banner Health up in prison? ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/89 "2021-07-22T03:59:00Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Besides, what are they gonna do? Lock Banner Health up in prison? That’s one of my happy thoughts. What would they really do if Banner Health chose to just close down? Hospitals and clinics suddenly empty during a recognized by everyone but the pubs COVID surge? That wouldn’t make voters really happy, even pub voters. Of course, that won’t happen and I certainly don’t want it to happen. I just want them to stand up to the idiots and help turn things around as much as they can. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/90 "2021-07-22T04:00:27Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Besides, what are they gonna do? Lock Banner Health up in prison? Probably declare that modern medicine is a lefty liberal plot, and pass legislation saying that nobody is allowed to see a doctor, and if they get sick, they can go get homeopathic medicine, or pray the disease away, or maybe go to a barber to get a good bleeding. (Cue: [Theodoric of York; Medieval Barber)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edIi6hYpUoQ) ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/91 "2021-07-22T04:01:24Z")
I’m sure that in years to come, the survivors and descendants will look back at wonder how such a slow-moving, easily preventable virus decimated civilization. ETA: Mad props to you, **Euphonious** , for knowing Theodoric of York! ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/92 "2021-07-22T12:49:32Z")
> [@JaneDoe42](#): > > I didn’t want to start a new thread, but this is new and different (and probably pay-walled). [arizonarepublic](https://arizonarepublic-az.newsmemory.com/?token=27aeddb4422de32d3d5f2ca929eb4ed4&cnum=cf5f07f9-9a77-4704-a737-35dc23ca1a49&fod=1111111-0&selDate=20210721&licenseType=paid_subscriber&) > > "Phoenix-based Banner Health, which is Arizona’s largest private employer, says its entire workforce must get a COVID-19 vaccine by Nov. 1. > > Banner is the first health system or hospital in the state to publicly announce mandatory COVID-19 vaccines for employees. There will be “limited exceptions” to the requirement, officials said. The criteria for those exceptions is still being developed, according to Banner leadership." > > Douchey has forbidden private companies from requiring their employees be vaccinated. Banner is the largest private employer in Arizona and they probably have pretty good lawyers. I am looking forward to the standoff and certainly do hope that Banner wins. Actually there is a thread on [“Mandatory Vaccination,”](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-vaccination/946494) and that might be a place to cross-post this item. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/93 "2021-07-22T13:09:47Z")
I’ve spent the last six days going in and out of NewYork-Presbyterian / Weill Cornell Medical Center. I wasn’t the patient – my father was taken there from his memory care residential facility. I have to say, the medical staff of that hospital has a really, really _relaxed_ attitude about wearing masks. I mean, _really_ relaxed. In that a lot of the staff just don’t bother. Even around elderly patients. If the staff of a reputable hospital is sending the message that masks don’t matter, there’s nothing to worry about, how can we expect anyone to care? ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/94 "2021-07-22T15:26:12Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I have to say, the medical staff of that hospital has a really, really _relaxed_ attitude about wearing masks. I mean, _really_ relaxed. In that a lot of the staff just don’t bother. Even around elderly patients. On some other message board, I have run across a significant minority of patient-care professionals (including a few M.D.s) who believe that masking has not really been all that effective against COVID spread. In an unguarded moment, they’ll post that “masking has no effect” is kind of “medicine’s little secret” but that most can’t talk about it openly for political reasons. And yes, they’ll post a few just-so studies or results from just-so experiments that kind of point to masks not working very well. Might be worth a new thread. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/95 "2021-07-22T15:32:58Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > On some other message board, I have run across a significant minority of patient-care professionals (including a few M.D.s) who believe that masking has not really been all that effective against COVID spread. I have to say I didn’t see any MDs without masks. Nurses, though? Lots of them. Also plenty of staffers who weren’t RNs or MDs. ---
**Author:** ![tofor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tofor/32/13727_2.png) [@tofor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tofor)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/96 "2021-07-22T15:58:50Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Might be worth a new thread. My original thread looking for the best data: [To Mask or Not to Mask, that is the Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-mask-or-not-to-mask-that-is-the-question/917910) The explanations about how masks work on this disease are intuitively satisfying. The hard data is (understandably) harder to come by and what data we have is generally difficult to interpret. Here’s the perfect test: 800 people quarantine for two weeks and get tested to ensure they don’t have COVID already. Each participant sits in a small room with somebody actively infected with COVID for 30 minutes. In 400 cases the ill person is wearing a mask. In 400 cases the ill person is not wearing a mask. All participants go back into quarantine for 2 more weeks. Monitor for differences in infection rates. Who wants to fund my study? ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2021, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/97 "2021-07-23T00:15:57Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > > Besides, what are they gonna do? Lock Banner Health up in prison? > > Probably declare that modern medicine is a lefty liberal plot, and pass legislation saying that nobody is allowed to see a doctor, and if they get sick, they can go get homeopathic medicine, or pray the disease away, or maybe go to a barber to get a good bleeding. (Cue: [Theodoric of York; Medieval Barber)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edIi6hYpUoQ) The commodities markets are going to be overwhelmed by leech-breeding speculation. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2021, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/98 "2021-07-23T00:41:50Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I’ve spent the last six days going in and out of NewYork-Presbyterian / Weill Cornell Medical Center. In the news today: [Union protests NewYork-Presbyterian vaccine requirement](https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/workforce/union-protests-newyork-presbyterian-vaccine-requirement.html) I have been at Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania facilities a lot in recent weeks and only noticed unmasking once, when doc was privately delivering patient not so good (but could be worse) news. They also have a September 1 vaccine deadline (August 1 for docs). No unions. ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2021, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/99 "2021-07-23T02:41:31Z")
I am glad this is happening. I think many people have put off routine and/or acute care because they doubt their safety in medical offices. I know I wasn’t thrilled to go to my doctor and see all of the front office staff unmasked. Even if they all were vaccinated (under 35% in this county so that’s pretty doubtful), what sort of example were they making to the patients. I have a new doctor now. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2021, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792/100 "2021-07-24T15:19:47Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > In the news today: > > [Union protests NewYork-Presbyterian vaccine requirement](https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/workforce/union-protests-newyork-presbyterian-vaccine-requirement.html) I saw that somewhere, some local news outlet. At this point, I’m perfectly fine with administering the vaccine at gunpoint. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-now-weve-given-up/943792.md?page=6)