### Author:  [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/101 "2008-09-06T00:12:16Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#):
>
> So what do you call a black person who really is uppity?
Since uppity means
> [@](#):
>
> 1880, from up; originally used by blacks of other blacks felt to be too self-assertive (first recorded use is in “Uncle Remus”). The parallel British variant uppish (1678) originally meant “lavish;” the sense of “conceited, arrogant” being first recorded 1734.
And in the south came to mean a black person who aspired to the rights and privileges reserved to whites.
Since I believe in the inherent equality of people regardless of their skin color then no black person can be uppity because there are no rights and privileges to which they are not entitled by virtue of the color of their skin.
In other words, in this context, you ain’t as funny as you think you are.
---
### Author:  [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/102 "2008-09-06T00:24:40Z")
OMG, [Mr. Uppity!](http://www.mrmen.net/char.php?uppity/mr) :eek:
---
### Author:  [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/103 "2008-09-06T00:31:06Z")
> [@askeptic](#):
>
> In other words, in this context, you ain’t as funny as you think you are.
I ain’t trying to be funny, but, as you quoted, “The parallel British variant uppish (1678) originally meant “lavish;” the sense of “conceited, arrogant” being first recorded 1734.”
And “uppity” can me somebody who’s conceited, arrogant, and thinks they’re better than you are.
---
### Author:  [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/104 "2008-09-06T00:35:24Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#):
>
> I ain’t trying to be funny, but, as you quoted, “The parallel British variant uppish (1678) originally meant “lavish;” the sense of “conceited, arrogant” being first recorded 1734.”
>
> And “uppity” can me somebody who’s conceited, arrogant, and thinks they’re better than you are.
Why does it seem like all wingnuts, cranks, whacos and conservatives can’t read?
[QUOTE=me]
And in the south came to mean a black person who aspired to the rights and privileges reserved to whites.
[/QUOTE]
did you just gloss over that part?
---
### Author:  [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/105 "2008-09-06T00:46:54Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#):
>
> So what do you call a black person who really is uppity?
Barack Obama?
\
Oh, come on–it was funny! And the thread has come full circle…
---
### Author:  [@warmgun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/warmgun)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/106 "2008-09-06T02:14:00Z")
> [@levdrakon](#):
>
> It’s not the word, it’s how you use it.
So it’s OK to call a black, “My nigga” as long as I really, really don’t mean it in a racist way?
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### Author:  [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/107 "2008-09-06T03:00:05Z")
[http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/05/congressman-says-he-didnt-know-uppity-has-racial-overtones/](http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/05/congressman-says-he-didnt-know-uppity-has-racial-overtones/)
Georgia congressman claims he didn’t know ‘uppity’ had racial overtones.
… bulllllllllllllllllllllsssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit.
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### Author:  [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/108 "2008-09-06T04:11:28Z")
> [@warmgun](#):
>
> So it’s OK to call a black, “My nigga” as long as I really, really don’t mean it in a racist way?
Depends. A black what?
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### Author:  [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/109 "2008-09-06T04:34:32Z")
Look, at some point we have to stop eliminating English words from our vocabulary because some people use them as euphemisms.
It’s not the word, it’s how you use it.[/QUOTE
[![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3f4z7BNnqs)
Militant Black Guy
---
### Author:  [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/110 "2008-09-06T04:48:38Z")
> [@levdrakon](#):
>
> Look, at some point we have to stop eliminating English words from our vocabulary because some people use them as euphemisms.
>
> It’s not the word, it’s how you use it.
Sorry - I was trying to quote Levdrakon in the above post - too late to edit
---
### Author:  [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/111 "2008-09-06T06:36:15Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#):
>
> [http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/05/congressman-says-he-didnt-know-uppity-has-racial-overtones/](http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/05/congressman-says-he-didnt-know-uppity-has-racial-overtones/)
>
> Georgia congressman claims he didn’t know ‘uppity’ had racial overtones.
>
> … bulllllllllllllllllllllsssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit.
Maybe he hasn’t actually been to Georgia…and doesn’t own a TV.
---
### Author:  [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2008, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/112 "2008-09-06T09:14:14Z")
Davis apologized for saying “boy” and claimed he truly meant nothing racist. I actually believe him: I’ve heard _many_ southern men, especially of the redneck variety, refer to younger men, regardless of color, as “boy”. Hell, the synonym for rednecks is “good ol’ BOYS”. It really can be innocent.
There’s no way any native southerner doesn’t know the term “uppity nigger”. Not unless they are just dummer than a box of hair, though that is entirely possible. In either case, now they know.
ETA: Just noticed Shameful Cracka beat me to the “good old boy” comment- sorry. Somehow didn’t notice it when skimming.
---
### Author:  [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/113 "2008-09-07T04:13:37Z")
> [@eldowan](#):
>
> OK, I didn’t realize the history behind those words.
>
> However, because I didn’t know the context and meaning _behind_ those words, completely refutes your statement that they “_can have no other possible interpretation_”. They absoluetly can, and do have other possible intrepretations, and to say otherwise is to tell me what my interpretation has to be.
>
> However they may be out of line to use, the terms aren’t inherently racist. People I know call each other ‘boy’ and don’t mean ‘nigger’. How do I know? because it was being said from one white ‘boy’ to another.
Maybe you missed the part where I pointed out that any Georgia elected official would HAVE to know the context and historical meaning behind those words. :dubious:
---
### Author:  [@nd\_n8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nd_n8)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/114 "2008-09-07T05:54:23Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#):
>
> That cracked me the hell up, too. Strangely enough…now that you indicate n8 is white; it does kinda rub me wrong, just a smidge. Even though I found that funny, and even though the word ‘nigger’ doesn’t really bother me, (I use nigga on a regular basis…), I still think it a bit…tense?..when a white person uses it in my company.
A thousand apologies m’lady, I assuredly meant no offense.
I understand though, when you use the word “tense”, somewhat of what you mean here. You don’t know much about me, or the difference between me and any random white guy who might run around using that particular word as a popular portion of his vocabulary. There are times when I am hanging out with black people, at work, at a party, at a bar, at my buddy Chuck’s house playing video games, where someone says something racially polarizing and there is a tension in the air. These are people I have known for years, people I went to high school with 20 years ago. It doesn’t even have to be me that says it (it’s like 99% of the time not me). Suddenly there is a coolness in the air. Nobody says anything untoward, nobody acts in a way that is specifically different, there’s just something unsettling in the air. Tense is a great way to describe it. And then, as quickly as it came, it goes away, also without rhyme or reason.
I hate that. I hate that tension. I hate the history that the tension represents. I would love to ignore it, to be able to disregard it. I would love to be able to say “Oh those silly Negroes, always going on like that, always overreacting to silly stuff that don’t mean nothing” but no, I can’t say that, I can’t feel that and I can’t stand other people who do. I know the history behind the words and, whether the intent is there or not I understand the animosity that they bring.
Is someone who uses the words uppity or boy in reference to a black person trying to be racially insensitive? Are they trying to hurt people? Maybe, maybe not; perhaps it’s an ingrained ignorance or perhaps it is an intentionally racist expression of superiority. But to claim ignorance of the underlying meaning of these words, and others, is flat out foolish. To deny their implications is to deny the history and the pain which they once were meant to inflict. Do they carry that pain now? To some they do and to some they don’t. But to flat out assume that they don’t is damned foolish at best and blatantly racist at worst.
I’m not saying we need to start censoring words. But I do think we need to understand the history behind the words and show a little common sense in their use. I also think that race relations is a giant pink elephant sitting in America’s living rooms and people of all sorts of backgrounds and races are in complete denial of it’s existence. From time to time it comes up, and it’s not quite as big as it once was, but there’s still a long road ahead of us in the struggle for equality. Hell, it’s a long and winding road just to decide what equality really means and that’s still just the first steps.
I’ll proudly take those steps with you and, while I may say some regrettable things to my fellow residents down here in Whitey-land in an attempt to make them see the foolishness of some of their ways, I mean no disrespect to anyone.
Except the Dutch.
---
### Author:  [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/115 "2008-09-07T17:59:21Z")
Are we not supposed to be aiming towards a race blind America? How can we ever accomplish that if you have to note the race or ethnicity of the person you are speaking with or talking about and check it against your mental list of words you cannot use with that race or ethnicity?
Words like “uppity” or “boy” should not be censored, but it would be nice if certain words eventually were allowed to simply become archaic. Words like “nigger.” Unfortunately, “nigga” seems to be enjoying more popularity than ever.
If we all have to note the race of who we are speaking to, we are never going to learn to ignore race.
---
### Author:  [@Li\_l\_Pluck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Li_l_Pluck)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/116 "2008-09-07T18:12:15Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#):
>
> That cracked me the hell up, too. Strangely enough…now that you indicate n8 is white; it does kinda rub me wrong, just a smidge. Even though I found that funny, and even though the word ‘nigger’ doesn’t really bother me, (I use nigga on a regular basis…), I still think it a bit…tense?..when a white person uses it in my company.
I totally get what you’re saying, but I didn’t feel tense only because it was clear to me that **nd\_n8** had been poking fun at his troglodyte neighbor. However, apart from situations where whites are mocking racist whites, I’d feel tense (at the very least) if I heard a white person–or any other non-black person–slinging that word around.
(Just an aside: A few years ago, I went on a few dates with a white guy who was a high school teacher in New York. Nice guy, non-racist, had dated black men, the whole bit. One day, we got into a discussion about the words “nigger” and “nigga”–he taught at a high school that was overwhelmingly black and Hispanic, so he’d heard the latter spoken by the students quite often–and he indicated his disgust for such language and would never use it. I asked him what he did whenever the word appeared in something that he was teaching–he taught English literature–and he said that he just used “mm-mm”. I told him that, while I and other black folks appreciated his distaste for the word, in that context, it was permissable for him to say it, but he wouldn’t have any part of it. That Channukah, I gifted him with a copy of Dick Gregory’s “Nigger”. Partly as a sort of tongue-in-cheek gift, but also because I liked the book, and I thought he might find it interesting.)
So, yeah, apart from very limited circumstances, white folks shouldn’t use “nigger” (or any permutation thereof) in the company of black people. Or in the company of non-black people, for that matter.
And while I don’t care if blacks use it amongst themselves, I’ve never taken kindly to other balcks calling me “nigga” as a term of endearment, because as far as I’m concerned, there’ll never be anything endearing about it. And I do wish that blacks wouldn’t use the word in front of non-blacks. Not only because I’m sick and tired of white folks saying, “If blacks can use it, why can’t I?” (because you can’t, bitch!), but also because it’s just crass, y’know?
---
### Author:  [@Li\_l\_Pluck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Li_l_Pluck)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/117 "2008-09-07T18:20:42Z")
> [@Li\_l\_Pluck](#):
>
> And I do wish that blacks wouldn’t use the word in front of non-blacks. Not only because I’m sick and tired of white folks saying, “If blacks can use it, why can’t I?” (because you can’t, bitch!), but also because it’s just crass, y’know?
(Sorry, missed the edit window.)
Well, except for Chris Rock, Dave Chappelle, and the late Richard Pryor. And perhaps some others with whom I might not be familiar.
---
### Author:  [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/118 "2008-09-07T18:35:56Z")
> [@levdrakon](#):
>
> Words like “uppity” or “boy” should not be censored
Who’s calling for censorship? All I see anyone doing is acknowledging that historically, there is a context for that word, and it’s a racist context. If one is going to use thar word, one should be aware that many people are going to assume racism. If one would prefer to make it very clear that one is not a racist, then choose one’s words more carefully. That’s not censorship, that’s effective communication.
> [@Li'l Pluck](#):
>
> I’m sick and tired of white folks saying, “If blacks can use it, why can’t I?”
Amen. This is such a disingenuous argument, it makes me fucking insane. First of all, why are you itching to call anyone nigger? Secondly, put most simply, **I** can call my sister a bitch or my brother an asshole, **but you can’t**. It’s a simple and fundamental rule of social discourse. Live with it.
---
### Author:  [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/119 "2008-09-07T18:55:02Z")
> [@DianaG](#):
>
> Amen. This is such a disingenuous argument, it makes me fucking insane. First of all, why are you itching to call anyone nigger? Secondly, put most simply, **I** can call my sister a bitch or my brother an asshole, **but you can’t**. It’s a simple and fundamental rule of social discourse. Live with it.
On the other hand, I don’t consider bitch or asshole to be such harmful words they should be removed from discourse. The argument is that nigger is in a class by itself because of its historical and social context. I agree with that.
I have no desire to use the word, but I think that there is some room to say, “If you’re forbidding anyone else from using the word, it would make sense to stop using it, yourselves.”
YMMV, of course.
---
### Author:  [@Li\_l\_Pluck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Li_l_Pluck)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2008, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/and-so-the-code-words-begin/462066/120 "2008-09-07T19:12:24Z")
> [@OtakuLoki](#):
>
> On the other hand, I don’t consider bitch or asshole to be such harmful words they should be removed from discourse. The argument is that nigger is in a class by itself because of its historical and social context. I agree with that.
>
> I have no desire to use the word, but I think that there is some room to say, “If you’re forbidding anyone else from using the word, it would make sense to stop using it, yourselves.”
>
> YMMV, of course.
First, **DianaG** : A-fucking-men to your entire post.
**OtakuLoki** : I’m not sure how I’d respond to your question other than to suggest respectfully that you read \*\*DianaG’s \*\*post again. I mean, really, is it that difficult to accept that one group of people can call themsevles what they want, and you can’t? I know–I’m not always the biggest fan of in-group/out-group rules, either, but if a group of people of whom I am not a part tells me that “we can say this about ourselves, but you can’t,” then the proper thing for me to do is to accept it, not take it personally, and do the polite thing by abiding by their wishes, not to ask them to cease and desist. (I believe that Judith Martin covered this once by saying that it’s just good manners.)
Alternatively, if the word that some members of that group use for themselves really distresses you, you can opt not to associate with those members of that group who use such language.
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