# Angry Muslim crowd torches embassies **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2006, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023 "2006-02-04T20:35:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/21 "2006-02-05T00:53:12Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > You know, I’m a screaming leftist liberal who struggles to remain rational about this kind of thing. I try not to let my emotional response get the better of me, and to examine and discuss these things in the cold light of reason and tolerance. > > But then, sometimes I just think, It’s time for the big smackdown. Nothing else is gonna work. These guys’ culture needs a reboot. > > Now, I’ll regret having said that, and I’ll want to take it back, in the cold light of reason and tolerance. But damn. What can possibly cut through this situation? You think that is bad? I am also like you and I also do some cartooning. (animator in training) **Fear our power you lesser mortals!** 😉 On a more serious note, I did notice that many reasonable Muslims do think this was stupid IIRC the reports. Unfortunately, extremists are taking over the dialog and just as freedom ends when the rights of others are affected, Muslims all over should understand that even people in the west that oppose the strong arm tactics of our leaders in the ME, will not mind much if force is applied to an specific threat like this one. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/22 "2006-02-05T00:58:32Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > I’ve been standing up for peace-loving Muslims who do no harm at all, of whom there are many, and some of whom are friends of mine. > > That said, I too wish the people making capital of this, and the rioters, would just fuck off. Just what is the stance of these peace loving friends on stoneing of women and female genital mutilation? ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/23 "2006-02-05T00:58:54Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > **dances** - this is being discussed in at least one of the GD threads, and it sounds like not all Muslims feel the same way about the issue. There are, or at least were, some schools of Islam that were opposed to any depictions of people, others that felt you shouldn’t depict plants either, etc etc. I’m not sure what you mean about Muhammad being a flower. What I meant is that Muslims have (because it’s forbidden) no depiction of their guy. We (western religion) have a blue-eyed long-haired caucasian fellow drawn from the biblical statement that God created man in His own image (ignore that that presumption kinda leaves black folks, et. al. in a bad spot). However, God is alleged to be all powerful, which includes the ability to represent him or herself in a waterfall, a flower, a cheese sammitch, or an underpass salt-stain. I was attributing an equal measure of divine ability to their holy man, which means that he could look like anything at any time if that was his desire, hence getting fired up over human-referenced depictions of a deity is short-sighted. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/24 "2006-02-05T00:59:13Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Who are “the people making capital of this”, who presumably are just as contemptible as the rioters in your eyes? The Arab politicians, mainly. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/25 "2006-02-05T01:02:58Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > I was attributing an equal measure of divine ability to their holy man, which means that he could look like anything at any time if that was his desire, hence getting fired up over human-referenced depictions of a deity is short-sighted. It doesn’t work that way, though. To a lot of Christians, Jesus = God. But Muhammad isn’t God to Muslims, he’s God’s last prophet. That’s why they have that ban on depicting him in the first place: supposedly Muhammad felt it would lead to idolatry, and he didn’t want to be worshipped. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/26 "2006-02-05T01:03:08Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Well, not [recently](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades) anyway. OMG!! U r so insiteful! Teh Xtians burned Cantaloupe 800 years ago! Their just like the Islams! RELIGAN IS FOR STUPID CONFORMISTS! ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/27 "2006-02-05T01:05:06Z")
> [@askeptic](#): > > Just what is the stance of these peace loving friends on stoneing of women and female genital mutilation? Stoning of women: appalling. FGM: appalling. (In case you were suffering from a bout of ignorance, FGM is a north African obscenity, carried out by both Muslim and Christian societies.) ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/28 "2006-02-05T01:07:39Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Who are “the people making capital of this”, who presumably are just as contemptible as the rioters in your eyes? These cartoons were printed in the Netherlands almost six months ago. People took them to the Middle East recently to stir shit up, and Mission Accomplished as far as that goes. The people who wanted to start this uproar and the religious and political leaders who are encouraging it, as **jjim** says, are certainly very contemptible. ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/29 "2006-02-05T01:10:16Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > It doesn’t work that way, though. To a lot of Christians, Jesus = God. But Muhammad isn’t God to Muslims, he’s God’s last prophet. That’s why they have that ban on depicting him in the first place: supposedly Muhammad felt it would lead to idolatry, and he didn’t want to be worshipped. Ah. Thank you for the clarification. So-I can see why he wouldn’t want his _followers_ depicting him, given the desire to avoid idolatry, but why does it make a shit of difference what non-followers do? Particularly when the depiction wasn’t favorable. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/30 "2006-02-05T01:11:17Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > I fear it’s gotten to the point that the only way Islam is going to be able to mend their image is for the peace loving Muslims to rise up and strike down the fools. This is a house that will most likely have to be cleansed from within. I hope so. But as I implied in [this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7069064&postcount=148), purely on a pragmatic basis, alienating said moderates by blanket condemnation of every single member of that religion is the _wrong fucking thing to do_. We need them to do it, so let’s help them. Fuck it, I’d donate money to help set up a moderate Islamic mouthpiece (and pay for their armed security). ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/31 "2006-02-05T01:14:34Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > So-I can see why he wouldn’t want his _followers_ depicting him, given the desire to avoid idolatry, but why does it make a shit of difference what non-followers do? Particularly when the depiction wasn’t favorable. Yeah, I said the same thing in GD. I wish I had more context for these drawings (I don’t know what any of the Dutch text says), but it may not be a question of violating the commandment as the fact that depicting Muhammad as a terrorist is undeniably insulting. The fact that it’s in violating of a “don’t draw him” commandment is probably just makes it worse - and it also means they’re not used to seeing such things. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/32 "2006-02-05T01:15:03Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > I fear it’s gotten to the point that the only way Islam is going to be able to mend their image is for the peace loving Muslims to rise up and strike down the fools. This is a house that will most likely have to be cleansed from within. And if they can pull that off, then the Christians can get to work on wackos like Phelps, Robertson, and the fundie nuts who like to shoot abortion doctors and blow up their clinics. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/33 "2006-02-05T01:16:26Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > So-I can see why he wouldn’t want his _followers_ depicting him, given the desire to avoid idolatry, but why does it make a shit of difference what non-followers do? Particularly when the depiction wasn’t favorable. Because that’s how fundamentalists - of any stripe - operate. As far as they’re concerned, it’s not just _they_ who are subject to the laws of God/Allah/Yaweh/Rama/Buddha/Whatever, it’s the entire bloody world. Hence the wish to strike gay marriage off the books in various western countries, and the desire to burn embassies of countries that have had the temerity to allow newspapers therein to print “blasphemous” photographs. ---
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/34 "2006-02-05T01:32:17Z")
I just want to point out, the restriction against depicting Mohammed antedates him, and he himself said nothing about it in the Koran. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/35 "2006-02-05T01:44:58Z")
> [@Rusalka](#): > > I just want to point out, the restriction against depicting Mohammed antedates him, and he himself said nothing about it in the Koran. Absolutely, but it is apparently a hadith - and of course if you reject the hadiths, you have also to reject the Talmud, Apocrypha, all that _post facto_ stuff that people who believe shit are wont to believe in. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/36 "2006-02-05T02:07:13Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > OMG!! U r so insiteful! Teh Xtians burned Cantaloupe 800 years ago! Their just like the Islams! RELIGAN IS FOR STUPID CONFORMISTS! Go fuck yourself, pinhead. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/37 "2006-02-05T02:12:00Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Go fuck yourself, pinhead. Eh… Metacom gets very, erm… emotional, when religion is the topic under discussion. Whatever you do, don’t suggest that there’s no more of a reason to believe religious doctrines or dogmas than there is to believe myths, he’ll pitch a hissy fit and then run away. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/38 "2006-02-05T02:22:55Z")
I thought **Metacom** ’s post was pretty funny. Come on man, you can’t seriously reach back 800 years for a comparison. “Cantaloupe”… that had me in stitches. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/39 "2006-02-05T02:29:25Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Come on man, you can’t seriously reach back 800 years for a comparison. Somtimes, though, you can. Although, of course, the caveat of ‘not recently’ was suggesting, in my reading, that it was an historical example and not a current one used for 1:1 comparison. The fact, though, that the Muslim leaders who are deliberately orchestrating this farce are, in terms of ideology, back in the Dark Ages, is not lost on me. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2006, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023/40 "2006-02-05T02:39:45Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > I thought **Metacom** ’s post was pretty funny. Come on man, you can’t seriously reach back 800 years for a comparison. “Cantaloupe”… that had me in stitches. I wasn’t comparing anything, other than man’s inhumanity, etc. It was meant to be somewhat tongue-in-cheek, but apparently Christianity is in the no-fun zone. The merest suggestion that perhaps those who follow Jesus aren’t as holy as they would like others to believe sends people like that into frothing fits, which of course just makes my point. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/angry-muslim-crowd-torches-embassies/343023.md?page=3)