# Another company found to be "recommending" who their employees vote for. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 26, 2012, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953 "2012-10-26T17:29:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/1 "2012-10-26T17:29:11Z")
So just like David Siegel and the Koch brothers, Wynn Resorts, the third-largest operator casino chains in the country, is discovered to have been distributing documents to their 12,000 employees stating who the company supports (read: “vote for Romney, or we can’t guarantee your job”). [Link](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/25/wynn-employee-voter-guide_n_2018595.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000009) Is anything going to happen to these companies and owners? I thought this stuff was kind of illegal, right? ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/2 "2012-10-26T17:35:30Z")
It’s not illegal, no. Unions have done similar types of campaigning too. Hopefully the employees respond in the only truly patriotic way - laugh about their boss behind their back. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/3 "2012-10-26T17:40:30Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > It’s not illegal, no. Unions have done similar types of campaigning too. > > Hopefully the employees respond in the only truly patriotic way - laugh about their boss behind their back. “Vote for our candidate or we fire you” isn’t illegal? ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/4 "2012-10-26T17:45:17Z")
> [@Agent\_Foxtrot](#): > > “Vote for our candidate or we fire you” isn’t illegal? Last I checked, ballots were still secret in this country. How would the company know who you voted for? “Show us your ballot or we fire you”, now that’s probably illegal. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/5 "2012-10-26T17:51:10Z")
> [@Agent\_Foxtrot](#): > > “Vote for our candidate or we fire you” isn’t illegal? AFAIK, saying that is not illegal. Actually finding out the vote and then actually firing them would be. ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/6 "2012-10-26T18:24:15Z")
Apparently, it IS illegal in Wisconsin at least, for employers to threaten workers in order to try to influence their vote: [CEO who threatened workers if they voted for Obama violated Wisconsin law](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/10/25/1150260/-CEO-who-threatened-workers-if-they-voted-for-Obama-violated-Wisconsin-law) ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/7 "2012-10-26T18:25:49Z")
Very interesting. I wouldn’t be shocked if there were other state laws that address this. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/8 "2012-10-26T18:40:53Z")
> [@Jenaroph](#): > > Apparently, it IS illegal in Wisconsin at least, for employers to threaten workers in order to try to influence their vote: [CEO who threatened workers if they voted for Obama violated Wisconsin law](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/10/25/1150260/-CEO-who-threatened-workers-if-they-voted-for-Obama-violated-Wisconsin-law) Quoted at that link: > [@](#): > > The other big impact on Rite-Hite employees, if President Obama is re–elected, is the good chance of losing Rite-Hite insurance and being put into Obamacare. Employers have the choice (though competition in the marketplace will dictate), to continue their existing plans or to pay a penalty and have employees go into the Government Plan. Our plan costs much more per family than the penalty and hence the possible competitive need to drop the Rite-Hite Health Plan. Every opportunity to make up for lost profits to taxes will have to be evaluated. > . I’ve never understood why this is supposed to be frightening. Who in their right mind _enjoys_ having their insurance tied to their job? Besides, if the company is going to stop paying most of the employee’s premium, _shouldn’t the employee be expecting a pay raise once the employer-funded insurance goes out of effect?_. I mean, I know that’s not actually in the cards–but it _should_ be, by the logic many employers apply to argue that insurance premiums can be thought of as part of the employee’s pay. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/9 "2012-10-26T18:57:17Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > It’s not illegal, no. Unions have done similar types of campaigning too. As has been noted in other threads: no, unions have not done similar types of campaigning; unions do not have the ability to fire the workers in question. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/10 "2012-10-26T18:58:38Z")
Frylock: I agree that makes absolutely no sense. They are saying that since Obama is imposing a penalty that is lower than the cost of their health care plan they will drop their health care plan and pay the penalty. Well, without Obamacare the penalty is zero, much less than the cost of the health care plan, so if they would drop healthcare if they had to pay a small penalty for doing so, why do they offer health care now? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/11 "2012-10-26T19:16:03Z")
I guess they would not have gotten as much traction if they’d been more honest and said: “Vote for Romney because this will ensure that the upper management and owners of this company make more money. And we like money, especially more of it. You will make less money no matter who wins the election, so vote Romney or we might fire you all.” ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/12 "2012-10-27T00:06:15Z")
Doesn’t anyone else think this would, if anything, HURT Romney’s vote total? If I got an asshole letter like this from my employer it would make me far less inclined to vote for that candidate. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/13 "2012-10-27T01:28:56Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > As has been noted in other threads: no, unions have not done similar types of campaigning; unions do not have the ability to fire the workers in question. They could refuse to accept your unions dues and revoke your union card. > [@RickJay](#): > > Doesn’t anyone else think this would, if anything, HURT Romney’s vote total? If I got an asshole letter like this from my employer it would make me far less inclined to vote for that candidate. I am pretty sure that if I wasn’t a likely voter, this would make me a likely voter for Obama. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/14 "2012-10-27T03:02:20Z")
> [@Agent\_Foxtrot](#): > > “Vote for our candidate or we fire you” isn’t illegal? Can you quote where they said that? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/15 "2012-10-27T03:35:37Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > As has been noted in other threads: no, unions have not done similar types of campaigning; unions do not have the ability to fire the workers in question. But nether can an employer, because of course they simply have no way of knowing how you voted. The employer isn’t threatening that they’ll fire someone for personally voting for Obama. They are saying “ooooohhhh, the sky will fall if Obama is elected and we’ll lose a bazillion dollars so you’ll lose your job!” Some unions do the same thing; “oh boy, if the nasty Smith gets elected he’ll outlaw unions / take away the subsidies that keep our industry afloat / the sky will fall in.” It’s certainly very common here; indeed, the CAW is practically a wing of the New Democratic Party and officially takes part in its business, in leadership conventions, and the like. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/16 "2012-10-27T07:09:05Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > As has been noted in other threads: no, unions have not done similar types of campaigning; unions do not have the ability to fire the workers in question. Unions regularly campaign for and financially support the U.K. Labour party. And being expelled from the union meant losing your job in closed shops. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/17 "2012-10-27T09:01:33Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > They could refuse to accept your unions dues and revoke your union card. No, a union cannot do that without a valid reason, and voting the wrong way doesn’t qualify as a valid reason. AFAIK, the only valid reason to refuse a dues payment is because of non-payment of a fine levied by the union against a member. This is covered in the Labor Management Relations Act, more commonly known as the Taft-Hartley Act, in Section 7 (I think it’s Section 7, anyway). ETA: **RickJay** and **Quartz** , I’m talking about unions in the US (where the election we are discussing is being held). I’m not knowledgeable at all about UK or Canadian labor laws, and admittedly not an expert on US labor law (IANAL). ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/18 "2012-10-28T15:33:31Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Quoted at that link: > > > [@](#): > > > > The other big impact on Rite-Hite employees, if President Obama is re–elected, is the good chance of losing Rite-Hite insurance and being put into Obamacare. Employers have the choice (though competition in the marketplace will dictate), to continue their existing plans or to pay a penalty and have employees go into the Government Plan. Our plan costs much more per family than the penalty and hence the possible competitive need to drop the Rite-Hite Health Plan. Every opportunity to make up for lost profits to taxes will have to be evaluated. > > I’ve never understood why this is supposed to be frightening. Who in their right mind _enjoys_ having their insurance tied to their job? Besides, if the company is going to stop paying most of the employee’s premium, _shouldn’t the employee be expecting a pay raise once the employer-funded insurance goes out of effect?_. I mean, I know that’s not actually in the cards–but it _should_ be, by the logic many employers apply to argue that insurance premiums can be thought of as part of the employee’s pay. PLEASE tell me that Rite-Hite is a tree-farming concern headquartered in Minnesota… ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/19 "2012-10-28T15:59:48Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > No, a union cannot do that without a valid reason, and voting the wrong way doesn’t qualify as a valid reason. AFAIK, the only valid reason to refuse a dues payment is because of non-payment of a fine levied by the union against a member. This is covered in the Labor Management Relations Act, more commonly known as the Taft-Hartley Act, in Section 7 (I think it’s Section 7, anyway). > > ETA: **RickJay** and **Quartz** , I’m talking about unions in the US (where the election we are discussing is being held). I’m not knowledgeable at all about UK or Canadian labor laws, and admittedly not an expert on US labor law (IANAL). The American equivalent to the CAW is the UAW. The UAW is openly campaigning for Obama/Biden. I mean, you can’t deny they’re telling their members how to vote. They can’t FORCE them to, but neihter can an employer. The message is still there; vote Democratic or things will be worse. (And hey, given the candidate’s positions on the auto bailout, they have a point, but there you go.) Hell, it’s on the UAW home page: > **[UAW | United Automobile, Aerospace and Agricultural Implement Workers of America](https://uaw.org/)** > > The labor union representing workers in auto, aircraft and agricultural implement manufacturing and other industries in the U.S., Canada and Puerto Rico. Today, the UAW home page _ **refers to Mitt Romney as a traitor.** _ They’re just as strident about this as any employer. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953/20 "2012-10-28T16:10:39Z")
> [@Jenaroph](#): > > Apparently, it IS illegal in Wisconsin at least, for employers to threaten workers in order to try to influence their vote: [CEO who threatened workers if they voted for Obama violated Wisconsin law](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/10/25/1150260/-CEO-who-threatened-workers-if-they-voted-for-Obama-violated-Wisconsin-law) As I read what they wrote, I don’t see any statement that work will stop, that the business will close, or the salaries or wages of the employees will be reduced. Am I missing it? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-company-found-to-be-recommending-who-their-employees-vote-for/638953.md?page=2)