# Another Critical Race Theory thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 4, 2021, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389 "2021-05-04T19:44:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/262 "2021-05-17T07:57:09Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > racism is the common, ordinary experience of most PoC in the USA Does it mean every PoC in the US has encoutered racism? I’m sure that’s true. Does it mean racism is encountered daily, and if so are we talking ‘microaggressions’ or something more overt? Does it mean racism is present in every aspect of life and every relationship? If so, is this the definition of racism where it means unconcious bias rather than prejudice? I don’t know why you’re asking me what evidence I’d accept, I told you I’m not asking for evidence, I’m asking for clarification on what it means. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/263 "2021-05-17T08:54:44Z")
It means incidents of racism are generally common in the lives of PoC in America - such incidents aren’t “abnormal”. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/264 "2021-05-17T08:55:56Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Does it mean racism is encountered daily, and if so are we talking ‘microaggressions’ or something more overt? Does it mean racism is present in every aspect of life and every relationship? Yes > [@DemonTree](#): > > If so, is this the definition of racism where it means unconcious bias rather than prejudice? A distinction without a difference. Unconscious bias _is_ prejudice. But no, this is the definition of racism that includes all of it. > [@DemonTree](#): > > I don’t know why you’re asking me what evidence I’d accept I told you why. You’re arguing with me about my own motives, when I’ve laid out what I was responding to in a plain post. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/265 "2021-05-17T08:59:34Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > It means incidents of racism are generally common in the lives of PoC in America - such incidents aren’t “abnormal”. She’s trying to wrangle some sort of difference between unconscious and overt racism, as though that mattered to the recipients. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/266 "2021-05-17T09:03:47Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > She’s trying to wrangle some sort of difference between unconscious and overt racism, as though that mattered to the recipients. Or as though it even matters for CRT. Individual motives are not really a significant part of CRT, and this appears to really bother a lot of people. I think there are lots of white folks who just can’t help themselves with approaching everything at all related to racism with, as a first response, “What about me? I’m not racist, and I need my lack of racism to be acknowledged and praised before we go any further!” ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/267 "2021-05-17T09:07:30Z")
You have to remember, she comes from a part of the UK that simply doesn’t have a lot of racism. She only (distantly) knows 3. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/268 "2021-05-17T09:12:30Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > I told you why. You’re arguing with me about my own motives, when I’ve laid out what I was responding to in a plain post. > [@MrDibble](#): > > She’s trying to wrangle some sort of difference between unconscious and overt racism, as though that mattered to the recipients. You’re the one assuming motives here, not me. AFAIK I didn’t say anything about your motives at all. This whole conversation makes no sense. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/269 "2021-05-17T09:14:07Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Or as though it even matters for CRT. Individual motives are not really a significant part of CRT, and this appears to really bother a lot of people. I think there are lots of white folks who just can’t help themselves with approaching everything at all related to racism with, as a first response, “What about me? I’m not racist, and I need my lack of racism to be acknowledged and praised before we go any further!” More assuming motives. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/270 "2021-05-17T09:16:39Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > You’re the one assuming motives here, not me. I’m basing it on your own posts. Things like: > [@DemonTree](#): > > is this the definition of racism where it means unconcious bias rather than prejudice? And previously: > [@Is the lack of black fathers the true reason for racial disparity?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-lack-of-black-fathers-the-true-reason-for-racial-disparity/923010/78): > > there’s a difference between this ‘baked in’ racism and concious racism, and they need to be dealt with differently. What does the difference matter? Racism is racism _to the victims_. > [@DemonTree](#): > > AFAIK I didn’t say anything about your motives at all. Then why do you keep asking _why_ I asked a question, and just answer the question? ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/271 "2021-05-17T09:19:09Z")
You live in a society where for white people, ‘racist’ is pretty much the worst thing they can be called. Then you present a theory that says everyone (white?) is a racist. And you’re surprised people have a problem with that? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/272 "2021-05-17T09:20:00Z")
Your first two sentences are incorrect. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/273 "2021-05-17T09:20:53Z")
There’s no point debating someone who misrepresents everything I’ve said. I’m done replying to you in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/274 "2021-05-17T09:21:40Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > someone who misrepresents everything I’ve said. …by simply _quoting_ you. That’s a neat trick. > [@DemonTree](#): > > I’m done replying to you in this thread. Since you kept dodging my one plain question, this is no great loss. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/275 "2021-05-17T09:28:08Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I don’t know what CRT is supposed to mean but when I hear people talk about it on TV it often sounds like it means that everything is about race, and that everything favors white people over black people, and that’s the way white people intended everything to be. At no time did I hear any mention of white people not being ashamed of the advantages they have in life like the person mentioned in the OP stated. So it is no surprise to me that so many people in this deeply racist country are antagonistic towards CRT no matter what it actually is. This is completely intentional and strategic. CRT is (or was) a niche academic theory, fine for what it is, with little traction outside of academia. Then someone decided it could stand in as a _bête noire_ (no pun) for all race concerns, and unleashed the marketing brand-smiths upon it. Or, in their own words, here’s what they’re doing: > _et voilà_ we have now manufactured the latest Egghead Menace, straight out of academia and onto your TV screen. Fragile whites are to get mad because someone’s less than adoring of whiteness. White-adjacent groups (Asian, Indian) are to get mad because another minority’s concerns are being privileged at their expense. Woke lefties are to assist the cause by vigorously defending this niche theory that wasn’t even important to anyone a year ago. Fox News, as usual, rakes in the bucks by playing both sides of a conflict they stoked, but the ultimate beneficiaries are the Republican party, who get to talk about another imaginary white fragility panic instead of the latest story about a smirking cop murdering a restrained man on camera. Am I saying stop talking about CRT? Maybe. I’m not sure how to ignore it without conceding the field to the bad guys, but I’m also sure it’s not wise to play into the hands of white strategists. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/276 "2021-05-17T09:33:57Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > This is completely intentional and strategic. CRT is (or was) a niche academic theory, fine for what it is, with little traction outside of academia. Then someone decided it could stand in as a _bête noire_ (no pun) for all race concerns, and unleashed the marketing brand-smiths upon it. Are Kendi and di Angelo 5th columnists in your conception? ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/277 "2021-05-17T09:37:08Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Are Kendi and di Angelo 5th columnists in your conception? I don’t understand what you’re getting at, what do you mean? ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/278 "2021-05-17T09:44:49Z")
You implied the idea of CRT left academia and was popularised by people who are opposed to it, with nefarious motives. But as I understand it, Kendi and di Angelo were influential in bringing ideas derived from CRT to a popular audience, where they are being picked up by many corporations and school boards, and even the CDC. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/279 "2021-05-17T09:57:36Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > But as I understand it, Kendi and di Angelo were influential in bringing ideas derived from CRT to a popular audience, where they are being picked up by many corporations and school boards, and even the CDC. The phrase “ideas derived from CRT” is doing a lot of work here, can you see how? It’s exactly like the summary Twitter link I posted above. Take an unknown niche theory like CRT, use negative branding to turn it into a toxic menace, then associate it with real social justice concerns that we’d rather not talk about. Poof, the magic is done, we’ve changed social justice from being a popular widespread concern into an evil concerted egghead plot, a Problem That Has A Name, complete with named villains (Kendi and di Angelo - who else can you think of)? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/280 "2021-05-17T10:05:46Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > You live in a society where for white people, ‘racist’ is pretty much the worst thing they can be called. That sounds so familiar… > [@](#): > > Al Monroe : It’s every man’s worst nightmare, getting accused of something like that. > > Cassandra : Can you guess what every woman’s worst nightmare is? (from _Promising Young Woman_) ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389/281 "2021-05-17T10:09:12Z")
I don’t see your point. It’s the ideas that people like Rufo object to, what does it matter if they are ‘really CRT’ or not? They object to them either way. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-critical-race-theory-thread/941389.md?page=15)