# Another filmed police encounter (Hammond, IN) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 7, 2014, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645 "2014-10-07T13:23:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/281 "2014-10-08T00:16:36Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I suppose they could have laid siege to the car and refused to budge for however long it took for the passengers to _have_ to get out for one reason or another, but that wouldn’t have been an efficient use of anyone’s time. Or, you know, negotiated. Talked to the guy. Maybe they could even have decided that this wasn’t worth the effort and sent these folks on their way with the appropriate tickets for their minor offences. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/282 "2014-10-08T00:20:40Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > It is the assertion of your ilk that the police _are_ wild animals who harass innocent people for no other reason than because they can. If this is true, then why would you not treat them as such? My ilk? 😕 I’m not the one who made the comparison. ---
**Author:** ![JesterX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JesterX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JesterX)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/283 "2014-10-08T00:31:53Z")
Has anyone ever heard of cops laying down a spike chain in front of a vehicle after pulling it over? ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/284 "2014-10-08T00:46:12Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Indiana would appear to be a [stop-and-identify state](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_and_identify_statutes), in which a person being lawfully detained is obligated to identify themselves upon request and may be arrested for failure to do so; Except for the fact that the man was making every effort TO identify himself, including providing paperwork through his window and the sunroof. But you don’t give a flying fuck about facts because you’re a lying sack of pig vomit. > [@Smapti](#): > > They were rowdy and noncompliant, and failed to sufficiently explain their actions to the officers. Again, just making shit up out of nowhere. Not one soul who sees that video except you would in a million years call them rowdy. You’re such a fucking asshole. > [@JesterX](#): > > Has anyone ever heard of cops laying down a spike chain in front of a vehicle after pulling it over? Oh HELL no. But then, I’m not DWB either. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/285 "2014-10-08T00:55:36Z")
Dweeb? Well, maybe. ---
**Author:** ![GrumpyBunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc8723/32.png) [@GrumpyBunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrumpyBunny)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/286 "2014-10-08T01:21:05Z")
If the cops wrote the ticket, didn’t they already identify the driver? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/287 "2014-10-08T01:34:45Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Because sometimes a seatbelt violation turns into [this.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzSZYN9C2Mg) Statistics were already posted. Do try to keep up. > [@](#): > > Believe it or not, cops are people, and they like to go to work in the morning with the expectation that they’ll be going home again at night. They’re people?!? A minute ago you were comparing them to ravenous wild bears. Make up your mind. If they’re people, they can be trained to do things properly and can improve if their performance is bad. If they’re killer animals, they have to be placated until you get a chance to run away. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/288 "2014-10-08T01:47:17Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I suppose they could have laid siege to the car and refused to budge for however long it took for the passengers to _have_ to get out for one reason or another, but that wouldn’t have been an efficient use of anyone’s time. You know there are durations of time between 2 minutes and starve them out right? If there is no threat of violence to the officers why not wait them out? They could bill them for the officers time associated with the detail. Getting into a physical altercation with the people in the car puts the officer at more risk than just sitting around for a while. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/289 "2014-10-08T01:49:24Z")
So, I was finally able to see the actual video. Holy shit! Anyway, I’ve been a driver and passenger for many traffic stops and: 1. I’ve never been asked for ID as a passenger. I don’t know anyone personally who has been asked for ID as a passenger. Really, WTF is that about? 2. I’ve never had spike strips put in front of my car. Then again, I’m not a minority. Ugh, these fucking cops make me sick. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/290 "2014-10-08T01:54:30Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > 1. I’ve never been asked for ID as a passenger. I don’t know anyone personally who has been asked for ID as a passenger. Really, WTF is that about? What was it about? One of two things: they were annoyed at him, or they saw a black man and figured they’d go on a fishing expedition and see if they could find a reason to arrest him. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/291 "2014-10-08T02:05:45Z")
> [@Shayna](#): > > Except for the fact that the man was making every effort TO identify himself, including providing paperwork through his window and the sunroof. This seems to be a key point overlooked by some Dopers. He’s called a “criminal” but the main crimes seem to be (1) not wearing a seatbelt and (2) not wanting to be tased. One can go to Youtube and find videos of many drivers asked to step out of their cars, being completely non-threatening, and still being tased. The tone-deaf Holier-than-thou “Fuck the criminals who don’t wear seatbelts. I’m not a criminal, so I’ve never been pulled over, but if I were I wouldn’t be tased!” shows that America has indeed split into factions that lack a common ground for communication. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/292 "2014-10-08T02:21:12Z")
Situations like this are why people–white, black, and brown–need to start resisting frivolous demands for ID and other intrusions that do nothing to advance public safety. The more people feel empowered to challenge abusive cops and the more public support there is in challenging abusive cops, the more likely it is that cops will think twice before demanding things of people they shouldn’t and using excessive force. Almost all of the situations that have made news in recent weeks were precipitated by confrontational cops making demands that were unnecessary and intrusive. When cops are in the habit of making these kinds of demands and always get compliance, they start feeling entitled to submission even when submission is undeserved and dangerous. Quite simply, these cops are flipping out because they don’t know how to handle a “no”. It’s apparently a word they aren’t trained to anticipate and respond to without the use of force. I hope the family sues the pants off these cops. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/293 "2014-10-08T02:26:58Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > 1. I’ve never been asked for ID as a passenger. I don’t know anyone personally who has been asked for ID as a passenger. Really, WTF is that about? I guess I got stopped a couple of times while driving in the US. On one occasion my late wife, who was in the passenger seat, was asked for ID. Just a data point - it obviously does happen sometimes. In her case she provided ID and the cops yelled at her because it was a state ID, not a DL. I don’t mean “drew their guns and threatened her” or anything, they just seemed upset that she didn’t have a DL. When she pointed out, with some irritation, that people with epilepsy are often denied licenses because of their condition, the cop denied that this was true. I’d say “no harm, no foul”, but it didn’t give us a good impression of the police. They never told us why they wanted to see her ID, given that she had committed no offence. At least I don’t think she had - it was her car, but I believe I, as the driver, was responsible for the speed of the car. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/294 "2014-10-08T02:34:28Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > This seems to be a key point overlooked by some Dopers. > > He’s called a “criminal” but the main crimes seem to be (1) not wearing a seatbelt and (2) not wanting to be tased. > > One can go to Youtube and find videos of many drivers asked to step out of their cars, being completely non-threatening, and still being tased. > > The tone-deaf Holier-than-thou “Fuck the criminals who don’t wear seatbelts. I’m not a criminal, so I’ve never been pulled over, but if I were I wouldn’t be tased!” shows that America has indeed split into factions that lack a common ground for communication. ::weeps:: Oh, also? He was wearing his seat belt, it was the driver who allegedly wasn’t. He did absolutely fuckall wrong. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/295 "2014-10-08T02:59:33Z")
Police do ask for passenger ID sometimes. It’s rare. Two instances I can think of that it happened were: 1. A coworker of mine was a designated driver. He was pulled over with 3 other people in the car on suspicion of drunk driving. Two cruisers were involved. While my coworker was given a field sobriety test the other officer apparently got bored and asked the passengers for ID. They all provided their ID’s. After running the ID’s the officer asked one of the passengers to step out of the car and arrested him. He had a warrant out for violating a court order to pay child support. My Co-worker was given a breathalyzer(passed) and was sent along his way with the two remaining passengers. 2. Girl I was taking a class with was the passenger in a car registered to her. Her boyfriend was driving with her and her daughter(age 3) as passengers. An officer pulled them over. He didn’t even ask for the drivers(the BF) ID. He asked for her ID. She gave it to him. He checked the name and asked her to step out of the vehicle hand cuffed her and dragged her to to his cruiser and threw her in the back seat. It turned out she had an unpaid speeding ticket and there was a warrant for failure to appear.She claimed she contested the ticket and never heard from them again.(I doubt that part of the story if you don’t hear from them you’d best go asking questions because it will come up again, like in this case) It was a Friday night in a small town, she didn’t get out till Monday. The judge on Monday instructed her to pay the ticket, which she agreed to. The judge then scolded the arresting officer telling him ‘his actions were out of line there was no reason this woman needed to be jailed for the offense, she wasn’t driving and wasn’t a danger to anyone’ In both stories all the people involved were white, but it’s Massachusetts so the cops don’t have as many minorities to harass. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/296 "2014-10-08T04:27:33Z")
This article claims that one of the cops involved has two prior incidents of excessive force that resulted in the city paying settlements. [http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/10/watch-cops-smash-window-to-use-taser-on-passenger-during-seat-belt-traffic-stop/](http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/10/watch-cops-smash-window-to-use-taser-on-passenger-during-seat-belt-traffic-stop/) ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/297 "2014-10-08T04:35:36Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > The victims in this case are suing the Hammond Police. Best wishes to them. > > (autoplaying video…) [Cops Pulled Gun, Tasered Passenger During Traffic Stop: Suit – NBC Chicago](http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/hammond-police-lawsuit-278347221.html) The city will settle for an undisclosed amount like they did the last couple of times their officers were involved in harassment cases. Ninja’d by **Hentor**. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/298 "2014-10-08T06:03:34Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Of course it does. > > And you keep talking about “showering children with glass” as if modern automobile windows weren’t made of safety glass that breaks into completely harmless rounded beads. are you out of your fucking mind? Car windows are made of tempered glass, when it breaks it breaks into little (around 1/4 inch) sharp as fuck on every single edge bits of glass, a car door window would probably make close to a thousand of these. nevermind the rest of your strangeness, this one thing is pure 100% out of your mind wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/299 "2014-10-08T06:23:06Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > You know, the argument that “there are only a few bad cops, and they give all the rest a bad name” is getting pretty threadbare lately. More like “There are only a few good cops, and they’re not from around here.” This happened in my area. The spot where this went down - 169th and Cline Avenue in Hammond, Indiana is a place I pass by frequently. Yes, there are a lot of good cops in this area. There are also some bad ones. I also have to wonder if Driving While Black was a factor as well. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2014, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/300 "2014-10-08T08:01:13Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > And here’s another one, for the NYPD. [Article](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/nypd-pistol-whip-investigation) and [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wyAMydIkyA). > > Teenager was being investigated for marijuana possession. At some point, he flees, apparently. The video picks up at the end of the chase. He stops and gives up. As soon as the first cop reaches him, though he’s just standing there and offering no more resistance, he is pistol whipped. The kid staggers against the wall and puts his hand up. Another cop arrives and punches the kid. The kid is on the ground. There’s no evidence of any struggle. It looks like the cops cuff him, and then punch him one more time while he’s on the ground. > > These cops are being investigated by IA and the DA. Why did they pistol whip him? Why did they punch him when his arms were in the air? Why did they punch him again when he was on the ground? That example is a little different from past police threads as it is AFAIK typical NYC cop behavior. If you resist arrest you get pounded. The cops apparently believe that such practice gives them better street cred as a group. Admittedly my cite is weak. I read a Village Voice piece about a rookie cop who chased a perp and collared him. The rookie cop was injured along the way – scruffed up (nothing like a visit to the hospital). His fellow cops let him know he was being a dick in their opinion: they expected the perp to sustain injuries under such circumstances. This was from the 1980s. Anyway, ubiquitous recording devices may require a shift in police practice. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645.md?page=16)