# Another filmed police encounter (Hammond, IN) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 7, 2014, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645 "2014-10-07T13:23:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/101 "2014-10-07T18:45:23Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Getting out of the car _would_ have helped his situation. Not necessarily. He still might have been tased, or worse. > [@](#): > > He brought this upon himself. This does not follow. You are wrong, as you are about nearly everything here. You are incapable of viewing police actions in an objective manner. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/102 "2014-10-07T18:46:17Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > This is never stated and never more clear. Watch the video. The passenger and the woman can obviously _see_ the breaching tool. The woman shrieks viscerally and complains that they’re going to mess up her car. The man’s response is less coherent but noticeable. > [@](#): > > What he says can be understood – he’s asking questions, and asking to speak to a supervisor. “I want to talk to your manager!” is an appropriate response if you ordered a Big Mac with no pickles and they gave you pickles. Not if a policeman is asking you to step out of the car. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/103 "2014-10-07T18:46:53Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Did you watch the video? Yes. That’s why I asked if you jerk off to this stuff. You haven’t said no. You may recall that my initial question was “Did they ask nicely.” > [@](#): > > The cop asks “Are you going to get out or not?” at least once that is audible, and gestures at least half a dozen times indicating that the man should step out of a car. The cop makes it clear that if they don’t get out they’re going to have to break the window, as evidenced by the woman’s reaction to complaining that her car is going to get messed up. That’s not asking nicely. Particularly since they had already pointed guns at these people. > [@](#): > > He is refusing to follow lawful orders and is behaving in a disorderly and incoherent manner. He is inherently dangerous. Every word of this is a lie. He was not disorderly. He was sitting in his car talking to the officers. He was not incoherent. I understood every word he said. Are you dumb, or are you being disingenuous? > [@](#): > > His response to seeing the officer approach the window with the breaching tool is “Look, if you gonna do this, I’m not operationin’ this vehicle!” He’s not behaving as a mentally sound individual. He says several times that he’s not the operator of the vehicle. (I know you don’t get big word. It means driver.) The word you quoted him saying is “operating.” > [@](#): > > Now you’re just being crass. Correct. And since you didn’t deny it, I’m treating it as confirmation. I’m not judging or anything; everybody has turnons. I’m just saying that now that I know you masturbate to this stuff, it does explain a lot. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/104 "2014-10-07T18:47:17Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > You are incapable of viewing police actions in an objective manner. I’m not the one who cries brutality at every instance of a white police officer using force against a black person. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/105 "2014-10-07T18:48:27Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Watch the video. The passenger and the woman can obviously _see_ the breaching tool. The woman shrieks viscerally and complains that they’re going to mess up her car. The man’s response is less coherent but noticeable. That’s still not a “clear indication”, and at that point, I doubt anything they could have done would have prevented the cops from using force. > [@](#): > > “I want to talk to your manager!” is an appropriate response if you ordered a Big Mac with no pickles and they gave you pickles. Not if a policeman is asking you to step out of the car. You are not capable of determining what is appropriate with regards to the police. You’re _always wrong_ about this. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/106 "2014-10-07T18:48:38Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I’m not the one who cries brutality at every instance of a white police officer using force against a black person. No. You cum. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/107 "2014-10-07T18:50:35Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I’m not the one who cries brutality at every instance of a white police officer using force against a black person. Neither am I, but you’re the one who _never_ cries brutality. Your point of view (in addition to extreme cowardice and abrogation of basic moral duty) seems to be “if the cops do it, it’s legal”. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/108 "2014-10-07T18:53:05Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Do you think it’s a reasonable outcome to wait for 911 to dispatch a supervisor to the scene of a traffic stop? That seems far fetched. The appropriate time to contest these actions would be in court. 😕 😕 😕 The call to 911 was not to protest the seatbelt violation. It was about fear – that turned out to be well-founded – that the cops would turn violent. It would be nice to live in a country where an innocent Black man had nothing to fear from a White policeman. There is plenty of recent evidence that that country is not the U.S.A. At the risk of [del]Godwinizing[/del] Cheneyizing the thread: The argument that the cops should damage a car and tase an innocent man to avoid wasting minutes of their precious time is the same argument as the 2003 reason for invading Iraq: “Good idea? Dunno, but our boys are getting bored in the desert, not even allowed to fraternize with Saudi girls.” ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/109 "2014-10-07T18:53:51Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > That’s still not a “clear indication”, and at that point, I doubt anything they could have done would have prevented the cops from using force. They could have gotten out of the car. > [@](#): > > You’re _always wrong_ about this. In your opinion. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/110 "2014-10-07T18:54:46Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > They could have gotten out of the car. I seriously doubt that would have prevented force from being used. > [@](#): > > In your opinion. And everyone else’s, here, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/111 "2014-10-07T18:55:37Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Correct. And since you didn’t deny it, I’m treating it as confirmation. I’m not judging or anything; everybody has turnons. I’m just saying that now that I know you masturbate to this stuff, it does explain a lot. Isn’t there a board rule against accusing members of being sexually turned on by whatever they’re advocating for? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/112 "2014-10-07T18:55:59Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > In your opinion. His and pretty much everyone’s not seated inside the Reichstag. ETA: ninja’d. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/113 "2014-10-07T18:56:39Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I seriously doubt that would have prevented force from being used. So, for the $10,000, then; why did the cops Tase the man? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/114 "2014-10-07T18:57:55Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > It would be nice to live in a country where an innocent Black man had nothing to fear from a White policeman. And that country is _this_ one. If the man in question had been obeying the law he would have had nothing to fear. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/115 "2014-10-07T18:58:17Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > So, for the $10,000, then; why did the cops Tase the man? Because they thought they could get away with it, perhaps. I can’t think of a legitimate reason to tase someone sitting in his car, with no weapon, and with no one in any danger. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/116 "2014-10-07T18:58:55Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Neither am I, but you’re the one who _never_ cries brutality. Your point of view (in addition to extreme cowardice and abrogation of basic moral duty) seems to be “if the cops do it, it’s legal”. [/QUOTE] I guess you didn’t read the thread about the Charleston incident, or about the police rapes, then. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/117 "2014-10-07T18:59:00Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Isn’t there a board rule against accusing members of being sexually turned on by whatever they’re advocating for? Only if the accuser is proven wrong. But you understand that sort of assumption of guilt until proven innocent, right? ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/118 "2014-10-07T18:59:13Z")
If there is no immediate danger, there is **ZERO** reason why officers should do anything other than wait for the non-violent, traffic-infracting citizen to comply. Any police force that believes otherwise is not one I want ‘protecting’ the citizens of my town. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/119 "2014-10-07T18:59:28Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > And that country is _this_ one. If the man in question had been obeying the law he would have had nothing to fear. Considering the multiple examples of black men obeying the law and still being mistreated by cops that have been presented, like the guy who was shot after obeying the order to present ID, this is a blatant lie. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2014, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645/120 "2014-10-07T18:59:56Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Because they thought they could get away with it, perhaps. I can’t think of a legitimate reason to tase someone sitting in his car, with no weapon, and with no one in any danger. Sorry, I’m afraid that’s not the correct answer, we’ve got some lovely parting gifts for you. They Tased him because _he refused to leave the vehicle of his own volition._ Had he stepped out of the car as instructed, they would have had no cause to use force to remove him from the car. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-filmed-police-encounter-hammond-in/700645.md?page=7)