# Another God question **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 14, 2011, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655 "2011-08-14T04:56:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/81 "2011-08-19T15:10:39Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > Daddy? Seriously? Should I be sucking my thumb while I call out to Him too? Since you bring this up, it may at least be very therapeutic for you to give this a try. When you feel hurt or unfairly treated, powerless against a situation, perhaps crawl into bed and just feel like as young as you want, suck your thumb, use a binky, whatever floats your boat, talking to a ‘ideal father’ as your daddy about the situations that seem too much for you to handle, anything from the past that has cause hurt any raw deals life has handed you. ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/82 "2011-08-19T15:26:39Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > The signal to noise ratio in that piece is rather high, but it seems to boil down to “don’t question God.” Nitpick: I think you mean the [signal to noise ratio](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_to_noise_ratio) is low, that is, little signal, lots of noise. A high signal to noise ratio would have lots of signal, little noise. Ah, the dope, where no nit is to small. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/83 "2011-08-19T16:55:34Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Since you bring this up, it may at least be very therapeutic for you to give this a try. > > When you feel hurt or unfairly treated, powerless against a situation, perhaps crawl into bed and just feel like as young as you want, suck your thumb, use a binky, whatever floats your boat, talking to a ‘ideal father’ as your daddy about the situations that seem too much for you to handle, anything from the past that has cause hurt any raw deals life has handed you. Why not. Maybe I can cry a little and shit my pants while I’m at it. Or, I could continue to be a grown up and deal with things that trouble me head on. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/84 "2011-08-19T19:28:03Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > Skimming of the various responses out there–and they vary tremendously–reveals several answers in particular: > > 1. God gave everyone free will, including Adam, Eve, and Satan. > 2. God has a perfect plan. > 3. God chose not to use his foreknowledge on that occasion because he wanted to see if Adam and Eve would obey him or not, and then they made the wrong choice. > > No one can seem to agree on an answer. The problem with A&E is that even if they have free will, they did not have the knowledge to make an informed choice - and therefore were actually innocent, just like a baby who accidentally sets something on fire by knocking down a candle. Does Satan have free will? Either he does not or is very stupid. Since Satan knows the power of God full well, and supposedly knows that Revelations is true, he know he is going to lose. Why not surrender? ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/85 "2011-08-19T20:08:18Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Does Satan have free will? Either he does not or is very stupid. Since Satan knows the power of God full well, and supposedly knows that Revelations is true, he know he is going to lose. Why not surrender? Satan is learning God’s way by trying his way first, just as we are, though Satan has more power then us and got us involved in his plan. Satan now sees the coming destruction pretty much like the alcoholic does. Hitting rock bottom, lake of fire and all, and has to abandon his way but has to also walk through it IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/86 "2011-08-19T20:12:32Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Satan is learning God’s way by trying his way first, just as we are, though Satan has more power then us and got us involved in his plan. > > Satan now sees the coming destruction pretty much like the alcoholic does. Hitting rock bottom, lake of fire and all, and has to abandon his way but has to also walk through it IMHO. So, you’re voting stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/87 "2011-08-19T21:32:27Z")
> [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](#): > > Nitpick: I think you mean the [signal to noise ratio](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_to_noise_ratio) is low, that is, little signal, lots of noise. A high signal to noise ratio would have lots of signal, little noise. > Ah, the dope, where no nit is to small. “t **oo** small”. Damn it! ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2011, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/88 "2011-08-19T22:15:24Z")
I prefer “Where no nit is too small to remain unpicked.” ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2011, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/89 "2011-08-20T11:16:36Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Then you missed perhaps the greatest teaching of Jesus, We are the children of God. Jesus reveled to us that we are the temple of God and the true name which we should be calling God - Daddy. > > Jesus identified the priests in the religious system as the sons of the devil (though not all, such as Nicadeamious, as God has His children at all levels). They lay burdens on people. OT scriptures state the priests (Levites of His day) do not receive any inheritance, as their inheritance is the Lord (the Lord will deal with these people directly). Jesus confirms they will die in their sin. Then Jesus didn’t come to save all men as was taught. That means God did not love all His children just a few chosen ones, so the burden is on God, not the child. A good father loves all his children, and if he knows the children as God should, then he would help the child instead of punishing them for not knowing, or a fault that he put in them at creation. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2011, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/90 "2011-08-20T11:21:51Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Satan is learning God’s way by trying his way first, just as we are, though Satan has more power then us and got us involved in his plan. > > Satan now sees the coming destruction pretty much like the alcoholic does. Hitting rock bottom, lake of fire and all, and has to abandon his way but has to also walk through it IMHO. So your God lets the monster He created destroy His innocent children, Like a child molester does (in a way), and lets the monster live for many centuries so he can harm more and more of them…sorry but that doesn’t seem logical to me that an all knowing loving father would do!!! ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2011, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/91 "2011-08-20T12:50:06Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > God tries to draw us by Love, and if that works - great, but if not God will use any other thing to get us back on track, including death. God knows who would benefit from being saved from this plane and who would ultimately benefit from dieing in it. What a monstrously evil theology. The Aztecs could not have constructed anything as cruel or depraved. ---
**Author:** ![Bri2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/48db29/32.png) [@Bri2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bri2k)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2011, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/92 "2011-08-20T13:01:22Z")
“I believe God is a sadist…and probably doesn’t even know it.” -Sgt. Steiner _Cross of Iron_ Pretty much sums it up for me. Bri2k ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/93 "2011-08-21T13:23:32Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > Then Jesus didn’t come to save all men as was taught. That means God did not love all His children just a few chosen ones, so the burden is on God, not the child. A good father loves all his children, and if he knows the children as God should, then he would help the child instead of punishing them for not knowing, or a fault that he put in them at creation. Jesus came to save all, even the children of the devil, and IMHO even the devil himself. Though not all children at the same time but it is a refining process where the youngest children are saved first. Here is my take on it: We are intermixed and intertwined with the devil and his children, though we are much ‘younger’ and weaker. If God was dealing with the devil directly, he would let the devil’s ways lead the devil into the lake of fire, as this is the type of situation that the devil to fall into needs to turn the devil around. But if the devil goes so do his children, and if the devil and his children go so do many of God’s much younger children. In the Lake of Fire, though the devil may stand it for a time, the younger ones could not and in God’s mercy God will not allow it yet. Since we are intertwined with children of the devil and can not stand that path that the devil is taking God will not allow that path till we (God’s youngest children) can be removed. God is ‘artificially’ stopping hell on earth because of his youngest children. After the youngest children are removed (aka raptured) then God can remove this protection and the world will become hell, which is OK till the older children (children of the devil) want to come back home too, after which God will allow the whole thing to fall into the lake of fire, where eventually the devil will see his error and repent IMHO. Till then the devil has it pretty good as long as he has the children of God believing and worshiping him as they are his protection and the reason the devil is fighting God. We are basically being used as human shields for the devil. Why does not God stop it. It is because He needs the devil to realize (learn) the correct way, and God stepping in will not do that. The devil’s own path is creating the hell he will face and then he will need help for God to get him out of the mess he created thus ending Satan’s rule and his re-acceptance into the family of God IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/94 "2011-08-22T12:52:28Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Jesus came to save all, even the children of the devil, and IMHO even the devil himself. Though not all children at the same time but it is a refining process where the youngest children are saved first. Here is my take on it: > > We are intermixed and intertwined with the devil and his children, though we are much ‘younger’ and weaker. If God was dealing with the devil directly, he would let the devil’s ways lead the devil into the lake of fire, as this is the type of situation that the devil to fall into needs to turn the devil around. > > But if the devil goes so do his children, and if the devil and his children go so do many of God’s much younger children. In the Lake of Fire, though the devil may stand it for a time, the younger ones could not and in God’s mercy God will not allow it yet. > > Since we are intertwined with children of the devil and can not stand that path that the devil is taking God will not allow that path till we (God’s youngest children) can be removed. God is ‘artificially’ stopping hell on earth because of his youngest children. > > After the youngest children are removed (aka raptured) then God can remove this protection and the world will become hell, which is OK till the older children (children of the devil) want to come back home too, after which God will allow the whole thing to fall into the lake of fire, where eventually the devil will see his error and repent IMHO. > > Till then the devil has it pretty good as long as he has the children of God believing and worshiping him as they are his protection and the reason the devil is fighting God. We are basically being used as human shields for the devil. > > Why does not God stop it. It is because He needs the devil to realize (learn) the correct way, and God stepping in will not do that. The devil’s own path is creating the hell he will face and then he will need help for God to get him out of the mess he created thus ending Satan’s rule and his re-acceptance into the family of God IMHO. There is a place in the NT where Jesus is quoted as saying to a woman who needed help,I came only for the house of Israel. That doesn’t sound like he came to save every one, and he sure didn’t care for the Pharisees! Where did you get your theology from?..It seems you have your own, that is fine for you, but it doesn’t make sense to me. Seems contradictory to a lot of what you seem to describe your God to be. On one hand he is love and another he plays cruel games with a monster he created! ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/95 "2011-08-22T13:40:40Z")
> [@Bri2k](#): > > “I believe God is a sadist…and probably doesn’t even know it.” > -Sgt. Steiner > _Cross of Iron_ > > Pretty much sums it up for me. > > Bri2k Nice one, that. And as long as we’re nitpicking; that should be - **Fw** Steiner. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/96 "2011-08-22T13:58:32Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > There is a place in the NT where Jesus is quoted as saying to a woman who needed help,I came only for the house of Israel. That doesn’t sound like he came to save every one, and he sure didn’t care for the Pharisees! Where did you get your theology from?..It seems you have your own, that is fine for you, but it doesn’t make sense to me. Seems contradictory to a lot of what you seem to describe your God to be. On one hand he is love and another he plays cruel games with a monster he created! Jesus had to learn who He was and what He was to do on this earth. Jesus the man did not know everything, that is clear in scriptures, stated at least 3 times directly. Which makes sense, Jesus had to overcome as we are required to overcome, if Jesus had perfect knowledge then our struggle, with imperfect knowledge would be harder and we could take credit. Jesus had to operate on faith as we are to do. Jesus by healing this woman showed that Jesus didn’t just come for the Jews. His statement after the resurrection makes His destiny clear - make deciples of all nations - Jesus did not just come to save the Jewish People. Jesus had to learn this which He did here. The (many of the) Pharisees are children of the devil, and need to be separated out from the children of God for a harder level of purification as the children of God don’t need to suffer that - this is what the rapture is about. ---
**Author:** ![spiirit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/71e660/32.png) [@spiirit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spiirit)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/97 "2011-08-23T11:47:12Z")
> [@obbn](#): > > Hello Again, > Thanks to everyone for the food for though on my previous God question. I have a few and I think a new thread would be appropriate for each, so the discussion stays focused. > Okay, while pondering the God question and talking with my wife I had a, what I believe, is a common thought. When a major (or minor for that matter) disaster happens, lets say a plane crash, and a few people survive you will hear them credit their survial to the intervention of God. I can understand that reasoning, because they lack any other reasonable explination for surving. However is it reasonable to assume that God deemed these few people worthy of surviving, but the other 200 people aboard didn’t deserve intervention as well? If God was really looking out for them would he, instead of saving them during the crash, prevent the crash in the first place. Keep the engine from blowing up or the wind shear from hitting them? > I have always heard the rationalization that everything happens for a reason and it has always bothered me. God is always credited for a postive outcome, but I rarely hear anyone “blame” God for bad events. Even in the arena of sports, an athlete will credit a victory to the will of God. What about the other team? Does this athlete really think that no one on the other team deserved help as well. And more importantly why in the world would an athlete think that God would even care about a game? I would think that if I were God I would have more pressing issues at hand than the Super Bowl. > I know this is a common thought, but I would like to hear some opinions on it. I am really more interested in the opinions of “believers” more than those of you who don’t believe. Not that I don’t think your opinion counts, but something tells me most of you would have a standard response of “this is why there can’t be a God”. I am curious as to the opinions of those who could justify a God saving the person in seat 44A while he allows the person in 44b to perish. > I just made the popcorn and will be checking back soon. * * * The word of God declares- God is no respecter of persons. God does not esteem one above another. God cares nothing for the flesh. The flesh is as dung to God. Satan so desired the flesh that God gave it to him. These are tough sayings and hard to believe until found in the scriptures and cannot be denied. God claims to intend to restore the flesh, bones and sinew upon a mighty army of souls in a discourse with one of the sages. ## God will raise all the dead on that last day. He is not worried about it. God is after the end results which is purification of all that can be saved and brought into his kingdom as his family pure and simple. That is his grand plan for the flesh in the regeneration. The depth of your question is to grand for the knowledge you posses and yet all is in the scriptures for you to see. A small child makes a game of asking an adult “Why” to every response given… finally the response becomes a final “Because I said so”! Now the child is on their own for answers and life begins… LOL! ## You are using questions gleaned from only skimming the surface of bible mysteries. If you get down to business with study you will be answering your own such questions and saving the heavy stuff for others who might have the answers or clues to such. To further your education- The Bible proves that we each have our own destiny, even the world and the heavens themselves have a destiny All such has been written and sealed in heavenly books. Our destinies were determined even before the earth was formed. The “Book Of Life” was filled with it’s names before the earth was formed. Each of the chosen already has a place prepared for them in Paradise. All these things and ever much more are available to you or anyone who recieves the Christ in the manner instructed… because the Holy Spirit shall be given, who will answer all and teach all as he is requested… but you must then have the questions. Destiny written, explains why odd things seem to happen around us and to us. Well… It becomes a matter of Faith/Belief that such thing’s exist in order for us to comprehend it all. Read Isaiah 45:7 and see what you can deduce about where good and evil came from… just as an example. Do not use the NIV version of the bible as you will never be sucessful on that path. Tom W. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/98 "2011-08-23T12:18:11Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Then you missed perhaps the greatest teaching of Jesus, We are the children of God. Jesus reveled to us that we are the temple of God and the true name which we should be calling God - Daddy. > > Jesus identified the priests in the religious system as the sons of the devil (though not all, such as Nicadeamious, as God has His children at all levels). They lay burdens on people. OT scriptures state the priests (Levites of His day) do not receive any inheritance, as their inheritance is the Lord (the Lord will deal with these people directly). Jesus confirms they will die in their sin. I know you believe that Jesus said or did things, because someone wrote that he did, and you believe that person. There are many things that Jesus was quoted a saying that didn’t happen, such as His returning in his father’s Glory, with his angels,while some of the people there listening to him would still be alive…it didn’t happen. He is also quoted as saying the world would end in that generation but it didn’t. People just decided to translate the word generation to fit their beliefs.(Matthew chapter 24\_verse 34) but Matthew also use the word generation just as we do today, he is said to have written;" there were 14 generation between David and Jesus!! ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/99 "2011-08-23T12:22:47Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Jesus had to learn who He was and what He was to do on this earth. Jesus the man did not know everything, that is clear in scriptures, stated at least 3 times directly. > > Which makes sense, Jesus had to overcome as we are required to overcome, if Jesus had perfect knowledge then our struggle, with imperfect knowledge would be harder and we could take credit. Jesus had to operate on faith as we are to do. > > Jesus by healing this woman showed that Jesus didn’t just come for the Jews. His statement after the resurrection makes His destiny clear - make deciples of all nations - Jesus did not just come to save the Jewish People. Jesus had to learn this which He did here. > > The (many of the) Pharisees are children of the devil, and need to be separated out from the children of God for a harder level of purification as the children of God don’t need to suffer that - this is what the rapture is about. Are you saying that God let Satan create some of the people on earth? That is even worse and would make God a terrible being,God supposed to have created Satan, so that would mean he wanted evil to exist…sorry, such a being would not be a good being but evil in it self!! ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655/100 "2011-08-23T12:27:48Z")
> [@spiirit](#): > > * * * > > The word of God declares- > > God is no respecter of persons. > God does not esteem one above another. > God cares nothing for the flesh. > The flesh is as dung to God. > Satan so desired the flesh that God gave it to him. > > These are tough sayings and hard to believe until found in the scriptures and cannot be denied. > > God claims to intend to restore the flesh, bones and sinew upon a mighty army of souls in a discourse with one of the sages. > > ## God will raise all the dead on that last day. He is not worried about it. God is after the end results which is purification of all that can be saved and brought into his kingdom as his family pure and simple. That is his grand plan for the flesh in the regeneration. > > The depth of your question is to grand for the knowledge you posses and yet all is in the scriptures for you to see. > > A small child makes a game of asking an adult “Why” to every response given… finally the response becomes a final “Because I said so”! Now the child is on their own for answers and life begins… LOL! > > ## You are using questions gleaned from only skimming the surface of bible mysteries. If you get down to business with study you will be answering your own such questions and saving the heavy stuff for others who might have the answers or clues to such. > > To further your education- > > The Bible proves that we each have our own destiny, even the world and the heavens themselves have a destiny All such has been written and sealed in heavenly books. Our destinies were determined even before the earth was formed. The “Book Of Life” was filled with it’s names before the earth was formed. Each of the chosen already has a place prepared for them in Paradise. All these things and ever much more are available to you or anyone who recieves the Christ in the manner instructed… because the Holy Spirit shall be given, who will answer all and teach all as he is requested… but you must then have the questions. Destiny written, explains why odd things seem to happen around us and to us. > > Well… It becomes a matter of Faith/Belief that such thing’s exist in order for us to comprehend it all. Read Isaiah 45:7 and see what you can deduce about where good and evil came from… just as an example. > > Do not use the NIV version of the bible as you will never be sucessful on that path. > > Tom W. The Bible proves that it was written by humans, there is no proof of anything except it was written by humans just as the Koran and other books of other religions or just stories we read for pleasure( or say like the dictionary a way to understand others words). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-god-question/592655.md?page=6)