# Another Grammar Question **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 4, 2015, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825 "2015-04-04T20:06:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/21 "2015-04-06T17:07:01Z")
> [@I.Dunno](#): > > I know you were chastised up above for your comment but I think it’s perfect. If I hear (or read) one more “this is how language evolves” as an excuse for the wrong word or improper grammar, I’m going to loose my mind. Hopefully my brain will still be in tact. > > I literally wait with baited breath too see if their is anyone else who feels the same way. > > WARNING: The above comment is SARCASM. Apparently that needs to be spelled out. This is nonsense, just as jebert’s was. Prescriptivists do NOT say that anything goes. They do NOT claim that every mistake is acceptable. They DO say that language evolves. That’s as complicated a statement as saying that animals evolve. What is normally meant by that statement can stated fairly concisely, however. There are levels to usage. Usage can be sliced in a number of ways - formal, informal, standard, colloquial, slang - and what words are proper in each slice changes over time. In our time, most writing is informal. Truly formal writing is rare outside of academia. Most good writers - which I have defined repeatedly as those professionals whose work is found in books, magazines, newspapers, and the like - write far more informally than they did 100 years ago. Even so, many of the usages self-anointed pedants complain about were fine even back then. (Check Fowler from 1925.) No two people agree about what is acceptable usage, even in the most formal settings. That has been known for 50 years, ever since American Heritage put together its usage panel in the 1960s. Where to draw lines is a personal matter, individual as well as setting-based. Spelling is more or less fixed in good writing. Grammar is more or less fixed in good writing. Good writer’s do not accept apostrophe’s in plural’s. Changes in usage comprise 90+% of evolution of language. However, the usage of so long as in this sense has been accepted in standard, good writing as far back as I can trace. You don’t seem to understand what the issue is, or who is saying what about the evolution of language. You can try to insist on your point nevertheless. See how far that gets you with those who do understand the issue. ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/22 "2015-04-06T17:26:14Z")
> [@jebert](#): > > You have fallen victim to the fallacy that there are rules of grammar and usage. This used to be the case, but that was in the past. Now anyone can say anything in any way they desire and have it mean whatever they want it to. This is how language evolves. Fine: I have a hammer (ball peen); I want to have tea with the queen. O blah dee, war hammer whammer wham whammer Now you probably think that I’m mean. What the above means is that I disagree with the Chaucer scholars who think that Chaucer originally intended the “Shipman’s Tale” to belong to the Wife of Bath, because of a confusion of pronouns. I think what actually happened is that some scribe screwed up, maybe dropped his manuscript or something, and got the pages out of order, and put part of a speech that belonged to the Wife of St. Denis, a character in “The Shipman’s Tale” into the prologue. Anyone who couldn’t figure that out is just not keeping up with the developments in language, and needs to get out from under their rock more often. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/23 "2015-04-06T17:40:05Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Prescriptivists do NOT say that anything goes. They do NOT claim that every mistake is acceptable. In fact, one could argue that such an attitude is perfectly antithetical to the usual prescriptivist mode of thought. Now, descriptivists, on the other hand… 😃 It is very bemusing to me that some people, upon learning that language is not static, react like [Annie from Community.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJaVBfVizq0) ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/24 "2015-04-06T18:13:31Z")
I have no idea where this came from but I wish I had wrote it: _Please don’t say that our language is easy, For its grammar and words leave me queasy. Be it bough, through or cough, Or tough, rough or trough It’s rules make me feel quite uneasy._ ---
**Author:** ![sweat209](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@sweat209](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sweat209)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/25 "2015-04-06T18:24:04Z")
> [@barbitu8](#): > > I sometimes write limericks and post them on FB. I recently wrote this one: > > The loveliest time of the year - > With the beautiful music I hear: > The birds call and sing, > Awaiting their offspring – > Just so long as the skies remain clear. > > I now have second thoughts of the word “so.” I think perhaps it should be “as.” I vaguely remember there is a rule when “so” or “as” is correct, but do not recall the rule. I hear people say both. so long as the skies remain clear. as long as the skies remain clear. Many times hearing both ways. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/26 "2015-04-06T18:43:24Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > In fact, one could argue that such an attitude is perfectly antithetical to the usual prescriptivist mode of thought. Now, descriptivists, on the other hand… 😃 > > It is very bemusing to me that some people, upon learning that language is not static, react like [Annie from Community.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJaVBfVizq0) You linked to a 15-minute show. With Brita from Community. Couldn’t you at least time stamp it so we don’t have to watch the whole thing? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/27 "2015-04-06T18:51:34Z")
It’s Community so why wouldn’t you want to watch the whole thing? But seriously, we’ll need someone smarter than me to answer your question, since when I click on the link, I get the 18 second video with Annie and Jeff that I intended and nothing 15 minutes long and nothing with Britta. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825/28 "2015-04-06T19:33:50Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > It’s Community so why wouldn’t you want to watch the whole thing? > > But seriously, we’ll need someone smarter than me to answer your question, since when I click on the link, I get the 18 second video with Annie and Jeff that I intended and nothing 15 minutes long and nothing with Britta. Well, _now_ I do. But _before_ I got a Paul F. Tompkins podcast with Gillian Jacobs. Computers hate me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-grammar-question/716825.md?page=1)