# Another Star Trek TOS Question: Changeling **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 30, 2020, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871 "2020-04-30T03:58:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/41 "2020-05-01T13:39:30Z")
Even as late as _Babylon 5_, there were sets re-used all over the place. One piece in particular I remember was both a hydroponic garden/park on the station, and a Mimbari temple. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/42 "2020-05-01T14:08:03Z")
> [@Stranger on a Train](#): > > Anyway, I forgot my point but do recall the local PBS station in the middle of a find drive recruited a guy to hawk “Disappearing TARDIS” coffee mugs presumably on the basis of a striking resemblance to William Shatner in both appearance and manner, the latter particularly enhanced by his open contempt for all things science fiction. I have never enjoyed a pledge drive so much either previously or since. Almost as good as the mid-60s fundraising auction on the Boston “Educational Television” channel (long before PBS), which had a spirited bidding war between Jethro Bodine and Milburn Drysdale. Of course, the ETV people never recognized or questioned the names of the supposed bidders… ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/43 "2020-05-01T18:02:27Z")
> [@Icerigger](#): > > What bothers me most about The Changeling and I know it’s silly geek stuff but Nomads energy blots had the power of 90 photon torpedoes, 90!!! The Enterprise survives four hits, 360 photon torpedoes worth, 360!! Come on, in The Ultimate Computer a Starship was totally disabled after being hit three times by “full phasers” from the Enterprise. > > Side note: this episode has one of the highest red shirts casualties, Nomad zaps four of them. The Apple has at least 4 ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/44 "2020-05-01T18:04:32Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The first season isn’t so bad. When you get to the third season is when it really gets excruciating. Its definitely an acquired taste…you’re looking for things to like rather then the show impressing you. Like the derided “Way To Eden”: Nimoy does well, so does Shatner. I could actually understand Charles Napier’s lingo. Ir didnt seem forced. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/45 "2020-05-01T19:15:54Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Even as late as _Babylon 5_, there were sets re-used all over the place. One piece in particular I remember was both a hydroponic garden/park on the station, and a Mimbari temple. Even more recently, _Death in Paradise_ has a patio overlooking the water which has been a part of three mansions and four different hotels. And I didn’t mean to imply that cheap = bad. Danger Man was great - except for the last few episodes in color. See them and you’ll know why Drake resigned. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/46 "2020-05-01T20:05:31Z")
> [@MrAtoz](#): > > That’s why shows would regularly cast the same actor in many different roles, with no concern that the audience might wonder why the guy who was a policeman last month is a cab driver today, and will be a business executive two weeks from now. Columbo would investigate James Gregory’s murder in one episode, and then have Gregory alibi Robert Culp for killing Dean Stockwell in another, only for Stockwell to then get framed for murder and try to clear his name in _another,_ and I’m pretty sure Patrick McGoohan was one of the leading causes of death among Californians. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/47 "2020-05-01T20:32:06Z")
> [@spifflog](#): > > I don’t know. Professionalism? Loyalty to the crew and actors who might never get a job again and will rely on this show’s quality to get another gig? Those that busted their asses to make you look good making the show in first place so that you had generational money for you and your family for half a century and counting? You know Gene, trying for once to not make it all about you? > > Stuff like that perhaps? Good point. The cast and crew did feel they were being abandoned, but objectively there was little Roddenberry could have done. One BIG mistake Roddenberry made was bringing in the third season production staff, based on their “demonstrated professionalism” (my quotation marks). He wanted Freiberger to write a sample episode, but Freddy wasn’t interested in auditioning. He was hired under the belief he could handle the show’s concept, something he clearly wasn’t equipped to do. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/48 "2020-05-01T20:35:01Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Columbo would investigate James Gregory’s murder in one episode, and then have Gregory alibi Robert Culp for killing Dean Stockwell in another, only for Stockwell to then get framed for murder and try to clear his name in _another,_ and I’m pretty sure Patrick McGoohan was one of the leading causes of death among Californians. I’ll see your \*\*\*Columbo \*\*\*and raise you _ **Mission: Impossible** _. Seldom in the field of human conflict have so many actors served so many espionage services under so many different guises. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/49 "2020-05-01T21:01:29Z")
To continue the digression, [Dan Duryea](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Duryea) played several characters in Wagon Train (not to the stars). ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/50 "2020-05-01T21:06:05Z")
One thing that annoyed me on rewatching TOS was [how awful the computer voice](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZXugicgn6U) of the Enterprise was (especially in constantly saying “working”). Now talking computers were a relatively new concept, but they weren’t that new. Even the [“berserk electronic brain machine”](https://youtu.be/FMP4iZm2qr0?t=44) in _The Invisible Boy_ (1957) spoke smoothly and grammatically. Robby the Robot, in his earlier appearance in _Forbidden Planet_ (1956), sounded mechanical but at least spoke in complete sentences. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/51 "2020-05-01T21:07:41Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > Almost as good as the mid-60s fundraising auction on the Boston “Educational Television” channel (long before PBS), which had a spirited bidding war between Jethro Bodine and Milburn Drysdale. Of course, the ETV people never recognized or questioned the names of the supposed bidders… I \*\*loved \*\*those old '70s pledge drives; they were so amateurish! The guy who did them on KTCA in MPS/StP was a middle-aged station manager named Jack. He was always in a white shirt and tie, with his grey hair in a flattop. He would be perched on a stool in front of the camera and nervously make the lamest off-the-cuff jokes, like: “I’ll bet there’s one group of people who like these pledge drives, and that’s professional carpet cleaners. Because you come home from work, turn on the TV, see yours truly on the screen, and proceed to throw up all over the floor!”\* Another time, he was acknowledging some of the people who had phoned in and said (reading off an index card): “And finally, I’d like to mention Mr **[…]** of \*\*[…] \*\*[who had apparently made a very rude crank call]. You, sir, should be shot!” And he flung the index card on the floor in disgust. Twenty minutes later, he was back with: “I’d like to issue a public apology to Mr **[…]** of **[…]** …” who had obviously phoned the station to tell them he wasn’t the crank caller. The oldest trick in the world, and Jack fell for it! 😛 \*I am \*\*not \*\*making this up, honest! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/52 "2020-05-01T21:19:05Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > I’ll see your \*\*\*Columbo \*\*\*and raise you _ **Mission: Impossible** _. Seldom in the field of human conflict have so many actors served so many espionage services under so many different guises. And most of them were Sid Haig! ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/53 "2020-05-01T21:20:03Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > And most of them were Sid Haig! Sid certainly got around, yes! ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2020, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/54 "2020-05-01T21:29:53Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Its definitely an acquired taste…you’re looking for things to like rather then the show impressing you. > > Like the derided “Way To Eden”: > > Nimoy does well, so does Shatner. I could actually understand Charles Napier’s lingo. Ir didnt seem forced. _The Way to Eden_ made absolutely no sense with respect to marketing. It was apparently an attempt to attract a younger audience with an episode on the hot hippie trend, but it made the hippies (that young people would have identified with) look like complete idiots and assholes. It would have turned off the exact audience it was theoretically trying to attract. It was like your parents’ take on hippies, not your own. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2020, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/55 "2020-05-02T01:54:40Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > One thing that annoyed me on rewatching TOS was [how awful the computer voice](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZXugicgn6U) of the Enterprise was (especially in constantly saying “working”). Now talking computers were a relatively new concept, but they weren’t that new. Even the [“berserk electronic brain machine”](https://youtu.be/FMP4iZm2qr0?t=44) in _The Invisible Boy_ (1957) spoke smoothly and grammatically. Robby the Robot, in his earlier appearance in _Forbidden Planet_ (1956), sounded mechanical but at least spoke in complete sentences. Gene Roddenberry’s Wife was the computer voice. I suspect that computers speak now because of Star Trek. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2020, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/56 "2020-05-02T02:03:36Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > One thing that annoyed me on rewatching TOS was [how awful the computer voice](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZXugicgn6U) of the Enterprise was (especially in constantly saying “working”). Now talking computers were a relatively new concept, but they weren’t that new. Even the [“berserk electronic brain machine”](https://youtu.be/FMP4iZm2qr0?t=44) in _The Invisible Boy_ (1957) spoke smoothly and grammatically. Robby the Robot, in his earlier appearance in _Forbidden Planet_ (1956), sounded mechanical but at least spoke in complete sentences. It always seemed to me that TOS deliberately made it where computers were inferior to people. You have, of course, the episode that tackles this directly, with the computer that controls the ship. But you also have Kirk beating those androids. It seems to me that the idea that machines might make humanity obsolete was something they wanted to avoid. As such, making the computer very mechanical, and requiring a lot of people to run a starship was intentional. Since the future of Star Trek was optimistic, and the fear of computers taking over was pessimistic, they avoided the issue. By TNG, people were more familiar with computers and they could let the computer do more things without it seeming like a replacement. Plus, they had an android they could use for contrast. My fan theory, BTW, is just that computer tech moved more slowly in the Trek universe, or possibly suffered a huge setback. I tie it in with a Voyager episode where they go back to the 1990s and find that the head computer tech guy actually got his tech from reverse engineering equipment from the 29th century. Since they undo that timeline by the end of the (two part) episode, I argue that puts us back to where tech didn’t move as quickly. The main contradiction is Star Trek IV, with Scotty using a contemporary Macintosh computer, which would seem more advanced than what Kirk had on his ship. I file that away under time travel shenanigans–they accidentally went back to a different timeline than their own. Hence why they are so l_aissez-faire_ about changing the timeline. I’m sure there are other smaller inconsistencies, but I’ve never let them bother me before with my fan theories. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2020, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/57 "2020-05-02T17:45:05Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Gene Roddenberry’s Wife was the computer voice. Majel Barrett was Nurse Chapel and Number 1 in the original pilot too. > [@](#): > > I suspect that computers speak now because of Star Trek. [Computers were already singing by 1961](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41U78QP8nBk) (and the song was also sung by HAL in _2001_ as an homage). As I noted, talking computers were already appearing in movies by at least 1957. _Star Trek_ was well behind the curve with respect to talking computers. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2020, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871/58 "2020-05-02T18:31:49Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Majel Barrett was Nurse Chapel and Number 1 in the original pilot too. > > [Computers were already singing by 1961](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41U78QP8nBk) (and the song was also sung by HAL in _2001_ as an homage). As I noted, talking computers were already appearing in movies by at least 1957. _Star Trek_ was well behind the curve with respect to talking computers. Well, shucks! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/another-star-trek-tos-question-changeling/852871.md?page=2)