# Anti-SSM argument goes from stupid to... what the heck is this? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 10, 2014, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819 "2014-04-10T19:53:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 40
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/781 "2014-04-15T01:54:24Z")
> [@Antinor01](#): > > I’ve heard similar from the far right christians. They typically say things like 'homosexuals are just playing house". Reminds me of Moe Szylak. _“Rich people – they ain’t happy. Oh, they **think** they’re happy. From the day they’re born 'til the day they die, they **think** they’re happy…”_ ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/782 "2014-04-15T01:55:07Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > Basically an arrangement between families involving at least one male and one female from each, usually in the form of exchange for the purpose of breeding and property. What the ever loving hell? Do you seriously believe that marriage is for breeding and property exchange? ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/783 "2014-04-15T01:56:44Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > What the ever loving hell? Do you seriously believe that marriage is for breeding and property exchange? Start at the beginning and try to not vomit when he declares not only are SSM not marriages, they’re not even relationships. ---
**Author:** ![Melchior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Melchior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melchior)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/784 "2014-04-15T01:56:54Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Yes, they are. No, they are not. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/785 "2014-04-15T01:57:34Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > While I’m sure **Dr. Drake** appreciates your concern, he’s a grown man; he strikes me as quite well-qualified to decide where to spend his contempt. > > And if he depletes his stores, I’m equally sure that a great many other posters will be happy to lend him some of theirs. > > Excuse me, _ours_. 🙂 Not to speak for Dr Drake, but I’m pretty much past contempt for Melchior and his ilk. The reason they oppose LGBT rights doesn’t matter. He claims his are dictionary definitions, my family has religious objections, a lot of people have just ‘ewww!’ objections. Life moves on, people like him are dying off in droves. I’d rather be able to have people realize I deserve the same rights they have, but if they can’t be convinced…they can fuck off. ---
**Author:** ![Melchior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Melchior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melchior)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/786 "2014-04-15T01:58:45Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > If one accomplishes literally everything that a given opposite-sex marriage does, then what makes one a cargo-cult marriage and the other the genuine article? Because marriage is in principle a mixture of the sexes. It is a formalized breeding bond. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/787 "2014-04-15T01:58:52Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Actually it’s the fallacy of wow, you seriously think you’re the only person who is allowed to have an opinion on what anything is. Yeah–what’s stupid is that _I’m_ the only person allowed to have an opinion. What the rest of you zombies think doesn’t matter and the sooner you figure that out, the better. 😉 And now that this is in the pit, Melchior, you diseased testicle on a syphilitic warthog: Since there’s a dumb rule here about not being allowed to wish death on someone, I sincerely wish you live a long, lonely, pain-filled life filled with suffering and anguish and that, when your life comes to it’s natural end, you die alone, unloved and unmourned in the gutter, where you belong you fucking bigoted asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Melchior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Melchior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melchior)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/788 "2014-04-15T01:59:46Z")
> [@Antinor01](#): > > Not to speak for Dr Drake, but I’m pretty much past contempt for Melchior and his ilk. The reason they oppose LGBT rights doesn’t matter. He claims his are dictionary definitions, my family has religious objections, a lot of people have just ‘ewww!’ objections. Life moves on, people like him are dying off in droves. I’d rather be able to have people realize I deserve the same rights they have, but if they can’t be convinced…they can fuck off. I have no objections whatsoever to homosexuals as persons. Do I need to make this any clearer? ---
**Author:** ![oft\_wears\_hats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@oft\_wears\_hats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oft_wears_hats)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/789 "2014-04-15T02:00:38Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > No, they are not. Case in point. Dance, puppet, dance. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/790 "2014-04-15T02:01:56Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > I have no objections whatsoever to homosexuals as persons. Do I need to make this any clearer? I really don’t care. As Glinda said, you have no power here begone. Before someone drops a house on you. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/791 "2014-04-15T02:02:14Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > Because marriage is in principle a mixture of the sexes. It is a formalized breeding bond. No, it’s not. We don’t stop opposite-sex couples from marrying if one of 'em happens to be infertile; we hold breeding irrelevant while cheerfully granting the status anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Melchior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Melchior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melchior)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/792 "2014-04-15T02:04:13Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > No, it’s not. We don’t stop opposite-sex couples from marrying if one of 'em happens to be infertile; we hold breeding irrelevant while cheerfully granting the status anyway. It is pro forma a formalized breeding bond. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/793 "2014-04-15T02:15:55Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > It is pro forma a formalized breeding bond. No, it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/794 "2014-04-15T02:16:50Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > It is pro forma a formalized breeding bond. How can it be pro forma if the opposite-sex couple explicitly announces – before, during, and after the wedding – that they _cannot in fact breed?_ Doesn’t the marriage still go through, exactly as if the ability to breed of course isn’t a pro forma requirement? ---
**Author:** ![Melchior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Melchior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melchior)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/795 "2014-04-15T02:18:20Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > How can it be pro forma if the opposite-sex couple explicitly announces – before, during, and after the wedding – that they _cannot in fact breed?_ Doesn’t the marriage still go through, exactly as if the ability to breed of course isn’t a pro forma requirement? I said pro forma. Do you know what pro forma means? But a same-sex couple cannot be even a pro-forma breeding pair. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/796 "2014-04-15T02:19:50Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Start at the beginning and try to not vomit when he declares not only are SSM not marriages, they’re not even relationships. Yeah, saw that and a couple of other things that were new-to-me from the wrong side of the debate. > [@Melchior](#): > > Because marriage is in principle a mixture of the sexes. It is a formalized breeding bond. > [@Melchior](#): > > It is pro forma a formalized breeding bond. The hell it is. There is zero in the wedding vows about breeding. ---
**Author:** ![F.Pu-du-he-pa-as](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c89c15/32.png) [@F.Pu-du-he-pa-as](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.Pu-du-he-pa-as)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/797 "2014-04-15T02:20:30Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > I have no objections whatsoever to homosexuals as persons. Do I need to make this any clearer? Except for the fact that the love we have to offer to someone of the same gender is inherently worthless? I certainly count that as an objection to me as a person-- it’s disingenuous to try to claim otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/798 "2014-04-15T02:21:45Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > It is pro forma a formalized breeding bond. No it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/799 "2014-04-15T02:21:54Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > I said pro forma. Do you know what pro forma means? > > But a same-sex couple cannot be even a pro-forma breeding pair. According to Merriam Websters - done or existing as something that is usual or required but that has little true meaning or importance. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819/800 "2014-04-15T02:27:37Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > Because marriage is in principle a mixture of the sexes. It is a formalized breeding bond. There are marriages that are intended in advance to be without issue; do you classify those as “cargo cult” marriages as well? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819.md?page=39) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-ssm-argument-goes-from-stupid-to-what-the-heck-is-this/685819.md?page=41)