# Anti-vaxxers are ignorant scumbags that kill children **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 1, 2016, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626 "2016-09-01T01:59:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/201 "2017-05-08T14:40:00Z")
In other news, antivaxers are crowing about a newly published study purporting to show that the incidence of neurodevelopmental disorders is markedly higher in vaccinated children compared to those who are unvaccinated. That conclusion is based on an anonymous Internet survey of parents of home-schooled children. No verification of diagnoses or vaccinations, just parental recollections (from a group predisposed to antivax views). The abstract first appeared in a low-rent journal, was retracted, and ultimately published in an even more bottom-feeding journal. Expect to hear lots more about this from the antivax crowd as “proof” of the evils of immunization. > **[A horrendously bad "vaxed/unvaxed" study rises from the dead yet again |...](https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/08/a-horrendously-bad-vaxedunvaxed-study-rises-from-the-dead-yet-again)** > > Antivaccine "studies" never die. They always return to promote disease among children. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/202 "2017-05-08T15:14:23Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > In the meantime, my aforementioned niece keeps posting more anti vax stuff on her timeline. > > [5 Things Everyone Needs To Know About Measles — Healthy Families for God](http://healthyfamiliesforgod.com/2017/04/5-measles/) > > So now it’s immoral and ungodly to get the kids vaccinated, and getting measles that’s a good thing because you can easily treat it with vitamins and it will build up your immunity if you get it too. > > I worry about her 3 year old and one year old. Funny thing about that link is #2 on its list seems to show the idiots compiling the list are aware that the vaccine works and, in fact, is not dangerous. The rest of the list is simply dishonest scare mongering. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/203 "2017-05-08T16:49:16Z")
Oh, but measles is so “benign…” [http://healthfreedomidaho.org/measles-a-benign-disease](http://healthfreedomidaho.org/measles-a-benign-disease) And the “proof” is from 1959! ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/204 "2017-05-08T20:04:22Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Yeah, I also wish Wakefield would take a dirt nap already. damn right … preferrably dead from something a vaccine would have stopped… like the Black Plague or Rabies. ---
**Author:** ![chronometer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@chronometer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chronometer)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/205 "2017-05-08T20:26:49Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Worry more. Natural immunity is NOT better, at least when it comes to measles. There is evidence that after having measles (but not the vaccine), your immune system develops this bias, and ignores other pathogens while keeping up its vigil for measles. So having measles _weakens_ your immune system in regard to everything but measles. This lasts a couple of years. Useful articles: [A deadly shadow: Measles may weaken immune system up to three years](https://www.princeton.edu/main/news/archive/S43/10/03O18/index.xml?section=topstories) > [@](#): > > The measles virus can cause serious disease in children by temporarily suppressing their immune systems. This vulnerability was previously thought to last a month or two; however, a new study shows that children may in fact live in the immunological shadow of measles for up to three years, leaving them highly susceptible to a host of other deadly diseases. > > The study, published in the journal Science, was led by researchers from the University’s Woodrow Wilson School of Public and International Affairs and Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology. The study provides epidemiologic evidence that measles may throw the body into a much longer-term state of “immune amnesia,” where essential memory cells that protect the body against infectious diseases are partially wiped out. [Long-term measles-induced immunomodulation increases overall childhood infectious disease mortality](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4823017/) > [@](#): > > Immunosuppression after measles is known to predispose people to opportunistic infections for a period of several weeks to months. Using population-level data, we show that measles has a more prolonged effect on host resistance, extending over 2 to 3 years. We find that nonmeasles infectious disease mortality in high-income countries is tightly coupled to measles incidence at this lag, in both the pre- and post-vaccine eras. We conclude that long-term immunologic sequelae of measles drive interannual fluctuations in nonmeasles deaths. This is consistent with recent experimental work that attributes the immunosuppressive effects of measles to depletion of B and T lymphocytes. Our data provide an explanation for the long-term benefits of measles vaccination in preventing all-cause infectious disease. By preventing measles-associated immune memory loss, vaccination protects polymicrobial herd immunity. ---
**Author:** ![Beren\_Erchamion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/90ced4/32.png) [@Beren\_Erchamion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beren_Erchamion)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/206 "2017-05-08T20:44:57Z")
Anti-vaxxers belong in prison. Conspiracy to commit child neglect is not protected speech. ---
**Author:** ![eulalia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eulalia/32/457_2.png) [@eulalia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eulalia)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2017, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/207 "2017-05-09T05:08:36Z")
Andrew Wakefield should be quarantined for life as a pernicious hazard to Public Health. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2017, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/208 "2017-05-09T12:40:57Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > In other news, antivaxers are crowing about a newly published study purporting to show that the incidence of neurodevelopmental disorders is markedly higher in vaccinated children compared to those who are unvaccinated. Update: Even the poorly-regarded open access journal that published this crappy “vaccinated vs. unvaccinated” study has been sufficiently embarrassed that the article has been retracted - for the second time! > **[Updated: Vaccine-autism study retracted — again](https://retractionwatch.com/2017/05/08/retracted-vaccine-autism-study-republished/)** > > For the second time, a journal has quickly retracted a study that suggested vaccines raise the risk of autism and other neurodevelopmental disorders. The study first raised a furor last year, promp… > **[A boatload of fail: Were two horrendously bad zombie "vaxed/antivaxed"...](https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/09/a-boatload-of-fail-were-two-horrendously-bad-zombie-vaxedantivaxed-studies-retracted)** > > Yesterday, Orac made a rare oversight. He missed an antivaccine study that's risen from the dead once again after having been retracted. He is more than happy to correct that oversight here and now by applying some Insolence to the second study as... Cue antivax conspiracy theories in 3…2…1… ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/209 "2017-05-11T09:33:30Z")
This is an article from Minnesota on a large measles outbreak. [http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/measles-outbreak-costs-minnesota-millions/ar-BBAZobf?li=BBnb7Kz](http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/measles-outbreak-costs-minnesota-millions/ar-BBAZobf?li=BBnb7Kz) ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2017, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/210 "2017-06-03T20:32:03Z")
Measles outbreak in Minnesota (discussed in this thread a month ago) continues to worsen: > [@](#): > > As of June 1, there were 73 confirmed cases, at least 50 of which were treated at Children’s Hospitals and Clinics of Minnesota. Twenty were admitted. Some of the children being treated have mouths so sore they can’t drink or swallow, leading to severe dehydration and requiring days of treatment. Last year, there were only 70 measles cases reported in the entire US. > **[Anti-vaccine groups step up work as Minnesota measles outbreak rages](https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/06/anti-vaccine-groups-step-up-work-as-minnesota-measles-outbreak-rages/)** > > Outbreak tally in the state now exceeds the total cases in the US last year. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2017, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/211 "2017-06-04T00:44:19Z")
Anti-vax morons need to foot the bill that Minnesota is facing because of their ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/212 "2017-06-05T01:49:23Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > You can get the vaccine earlier if you have actually had shingles, because you can get shingles more than once, but the vaccine will prevent further outbreaks. I don’t know how often the vaccine must be repeated. My husband had the shingles in his early 40, and he got the vaccine about six months after he recovered, and insurance paid for it. > > Worry more. Natural immunity is NOT better, at least when it comes to measles. There is evidence that after having measles (but not the vaccine), your immune system develops this bias, and ignores other pathogens while keeping up its vigil for measles. So having measles _weakens_ your immune system in regard to everything but measles. This lasts a couple of years. > > Worry about any one-year-old and below in a place with vaccine numbers below herd immunity, because less than one-year-olds can’t have the MMR yet. > > I actually had some dimbulb argue with me that measles aren’t that bad, and her evidence was the episode of _The Brady Bunch_ where all the kids got it. > > Right. They’re really gonna have the episode where Bobby gets encephalitis and dies. I just went to a birthday party for the aforementioned 1 year old on May 27. Felt carsick going home. Woke up early May 29 with a lot of body pain and then hurling, spent the rest of the day feeling like crap. It took a few days to feel right again. As it turns out, the parents had been stricken with this whatever-virus about five days before the party (I didn’t know this at the time). The baby got sick with a fever, my brother and his wife got sicker than I did, and my niece told us on FB, “Sorry, everyone.” But I’m pretty sure she still won’t admit that she might just be in the wrong about vaccines and illnesses. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/213 "2017-06-05T14:42:10Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > But I’m pretty sure she still won’t admit that she might just be in the wrong about vaccines and illnesses. > > :dubious: Hey, you lived and recovered, right? So it’s really not so bad, yes? :rolleyes: That’s the mentality… ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2017, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/214 "2017-06-22T16:03:22Z")
An EU court has decided that nope, science isn’t necessary when deciding whether to award damages for “vaccine injury”, intuition works great. The highest court’s bizarre decision was issued in the case of a French complainant who developed multiple sclerosis _a year_ after getting an immunization. There is zero credible evidence that vaccination causes MS. Doesn’t matter. If enough people make the claim, that apparently translates into “specific and consistent” data which is good enough for the EU. > **[Vaccines Can Be Blamed for Illnesses Without Proof, EU Court Says](https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2017-06-21/eu-court-vaccines-can-be-blamed-for-problems-without-proof)** > > The highest court of the European Union says courts can consider whether a vaccination led to an illness even without scientific proof. This can only be a good thing, since we already know [from](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/apr/21/italian-court-rules-mobile-phone-use-caused-brain-tumour) [past decisions](https://www.skepticalraptor.com/skepticalraptorblog.php/italian-mmr-autism-decision-overturned/) that science is best settled in the courts. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2017, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/215 "2017-06-22T16:31:35Z")
So basically, the US is exporting stupidity. At least it is something we have in abundance. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2017, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/216 "2017-06-22T17:52:40Z")
Would y’all like to [meet those “Anti-Vax” doctors?](https://www.skepticalraptor.com/skepticalraptorblog.php/anti-vaccine-doctors-naming-names/#more-10396) that are pushed as experts on the subject? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/217 "2017-06-22T18:07:25Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > So basically, the US is exporting stupidity. At least it is something we have in abundance. [The American system set up to provide compensation in genuine cases of vaccine-related injury](http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/04/vaccines-trial-us-court-separates-fact-fiction), despite requiring a relatively low standard of proof (“preponderance of evidence”) typically follows evidence-based science, as in its rejection of vaccines-cause-autism claims. One wonders if such cases will now be rubber-stamped as valid in the E.U., since a number of parents “consistently” make such claims even though the alleged connection has been thoroughly debunked. \*a defect in the linked article is that it suggests certain upper extremity injuries were due to vaccines, when they apparently were caused by improper injection techniques damaging joint capsules/nerves and thus were not due to the vaccines themselves. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2017, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/218 "2017-08-17T18:26:57Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Perhaps you could point out that one of the complications of many of these diseases IS brain damage – which can lead to permanent mental retardation. That’s what’s so insane about the whole “vaccines cause autism!” bullshit. If anything, kids are more at risk for brain damage from the very diseases these vaccines prevent. I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. Turns out that most of my niece’s “info” comes from this site: > **[Healthy Families for God](https://www.healthyfamiliesforgod.com/?s=vaccines)** The main points are: 1. Vaccines are inherently evil because they come from cell lines that originated in aborted fetuses; 2. Breastfeeding will provide all the immunity the kids need; 3. If they get sick, it’s easy to combat measles and mumps with big doses of vitamins A and C. And once you throw God into the mix, the opposition doesn’t stand a chance. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2017, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/219 "2017-08-17T20:15:57Z")
Is it too early to start investing in the stocks of Iron Lung makers? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2017, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/220 "2017-08-17T20:22:21Z")
THere was a recent article about the pushback on vaccination by various state governments and I made the mistke of reading the Facebook based comments. I learned: 1. vaccines do nothing except kill and cause autism 2. No one has ever studied the safety of vaccines, ever 3. Measles can be cure with Vitamin C 4. They all have an anecdote about how the school their kid went to had an outbreak of a vaccinatable disease and all the kids with the vaccination got the disease and the unvaccinated ones didn’t catch it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626.md?page=12)