# Anti-vaxxers are ignorant scumbags that kill children **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 1, 2016, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626 "2016-09-01T01:59:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 32
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2019, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/621 "2019-03-04T22:47:40Z")
Oh look, ANOTHER study shows no link between the MMR vaccine and autism. > **[MMR vaccine does not cause autism, another study confirms | CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/04/health/mmr-vaccine-autism-study/index.html)** > > A study of all children born in Denmark from 1999 through 2010 concluded that the measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine does not increase the risk of autism, does not trigger autism in susceptible children and is not associated with clustering of... ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2019, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/622 "2019-03-05T05:02:51Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > Oh look, ANOTHER study shows no link between the MMR vaccine and autism. > > [https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/04/health/mmr-vaccine-autism-study/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/04/health/mmr-vaccine-autism-study/index.html) Yep. It’s an actual real tragedy that good money and resources are being wasted on proving that which has been irrefutably proven time and time again. That’s the other negative fallout from the antivax lunatics. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2019, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/623 "2019-03-06T13:24:48Z")
One justification for this new study is that it not only looked at a huge group of children, it examined multiple subgroups with potentially higher risk factors. A complaint from antivaxers has been that epidemiologic studies are fatally flawed because they can’t detect autism in such subgroups (given how commonly they claim vaccines cause autism, this is a nonsensical claim, but whatever). This new study took that into account: _“The main goal of our modeling strategy was to evaluate whether the MMR vaccine increases the risk for autism in children, subgroups of children, and time periods after vaccination. We defined subgroups according to 1) sibling history of autism (“genetic susceptibility”), sex, birth cohort, and prior vaccinations in the first year of life and 2) a summary index estimated from a disease risk model combining multiple environmental risk factors. The motivation for a summary index was that the combination of several factors each associated with only a moderate risk increase in autism had the potential of identifying children at higher risk through multiple risk factors, in contrast to many stratified analyses of single moderate risk factors.”_ Result: no association between MMR and autism either overall or in the subgroups. In fact, there was even a tiny **negative** association -meaning that autism occurred slightly less often in vaccinated children (not statistically significant). Antivaxers of course have already started [trying to belittle the study](https://respectfulinsolence.com/2019/03/06/mmr-does-not-cause-autism/), but really they should just go back to anecdotes - good science wreaks havoc on their beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2019, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/624 "2019-03-06T16:42:49Z")
[The only way to deal with Anti-Vaxxers](https://tenor.com/view/disbeav-snap-slap-stop-wtf-gif-8066436) ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2019, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/625 "2019-03-08T15:06:44Z")
I’ve got a sister in law who is antivax. She’s got an autistic kid and, you know. But in any breath not devoted to slamming real medicine she sings the praises and superiority of her precious boy. I shut her down at dinner once when she started popping off about evilvax by asking her to clarify that she’d rather her son be dead or maimed from disease rather than be healthy and autistic. The Missus is lobbying for a dinner with sis in the near future. In a rare passive aggressive move, I’ve been spamming my Facebook feed with antivax mockery, trying to start some shit. I’d feel bad, except it’s just the right thing to do. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/626 "2019-03-09T00:13:45Z")
Wait, her kid is autistic but she _still_ refuses to vaccinate them ? What, is she afraid he’ll get double autism ? ---
**Author:** ![icon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c6cbf5/32.png) [@icon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/icon)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/627 "2019-03-09T02:12:45Z")
Here is a rant about Measles outbreak by one of the best ranters [Lewis Black](https://youtu.be/PQpQOLnzQ6E). > [@](#): > > It turns out that Science is no match for its greatest foe: Idiots. //i\ ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/628 "2019-03-09T03:59:01Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I think the sensible approach is to refuse to grant the premise that anything in the vaccine debate hinges on the honesty of Big Pharma in the first place. Of course, Big Pharma is not _always_ evil or _always_ good. But we’re not advocating that anyone needs to trust them. We know that vaccines are safe and effective not because anyone at Big Pharma told us, but because of the mountain of independent peer-reviewed research. > > If you don’t frame the debate this way, then what’s _your_ logical comeback when a major case where Big Pharma acts very badly actually hits the headlines? Alas, doesn’t work. I’ve tried it. “But the peer-reviewed research is not independent!” the anti-vaxxers cry. “All those researchers are in the pockets of Big, Bad Pharma!” It’s the circular reasoning typical of conspiracy theorists. ---
**Author:** ![fedman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/278dde/32.png) [@fedman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fedman)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/629 "2019-03-09T13:02:58Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > This is nothing a severe Polio outbreak couldn’t cure, and the scary thing is I think that will be the case. we’ve already getting measles outbreaks ---
**Author:** ![fedman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/278dde/32.png) [@fedman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fedman)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/630 "2019-03-09T13:04:48Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > I like my idea better. No government funded schooling, no travelling on public transport no universal healthcare (in countries that have it). Even better lets make it the law that unvaccinated people (unless for genuine medical reasons) have to wear facemasks all the time when they’re in public and a biohazard symbol so sensible people can avoid them. > > Yeah I realise that makes me sound like a Nazi. In this case it’s justified, and they could get rid of the “discrimination” any time they wanted by getting vaccinated. too bad we can’t declare a medical emergency ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/631 "2019-03-09T14:47:10Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > Alas, doesn’t work. I’ve tried it. “But the peer-reviewed research is not independent!” the anti-vaxxers cry. “All those researchers are in the pockets of Big, Bad Pharma!” > > It’s the circular reasoning typical of conspiracy theorists. Yes, antivaxers will generally find a way to label even independent (non-pharma-funded) studies as corrupt. Case in point: the latest major study to find that [the MMR vaccine is not linked to autism](https://annals.org/aim/fullarticle/2727726/measles-mumps-rubella-vaccination-autism-nationwide-cohort-study). Immediately one of the loudest anti-vax groups (Age of Autism) derided the study by dredging up the case of Poul Thorsen. Thorsen was a secondary author on another Danish population study of the MMR published back in 2002 (which also found no MMR-autism link). Thorsen was later accused of embezzling CDC research funds for personal use. The study was never refuted and Thorsen had no involvement in the 2019 study, but antivaxers think that by shouting his name they can smear the current authors and ignore the results. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/632 "2019-03-09T16:24:18Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Arizona state Rep Kelly Townsend says [pushing for vaccines is “Communist”](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/something-is-in-those-vaccines-lawmaker-says-mandatory-measles-shots-are-communist/ar-BBUeXKA?ocid=spartandhp). (bolding mine) > When people, especially people in a position of power and influence, say that no amount of scientific evidence will change their position the debate stops. They have declared you to be the enemy, and that everything you say is just part of the conspiracy. Fight them, expose them, get them out of office and get those kids vaccinated before this deliberate ignorance kills even more people. > > ninja’ed by **Baker**. But if people believe that anti vaccines are evil and immoral because they’re full of dead baby tissue and so on, then the scientific evidence doesn’t matter anyway. My aforementioned niece , mother-of-three, posted the following bullshit on her FB page: > **[Natural Whole Healthy You | livingwhole.org](https://livingwhole.org)** > > Learn about the many benefits of essential oils. From improved sleep quality to boosted focus and reduced stress levels, essential oils are well worth Given how religious she is, and her husband along with her, there is no way to change their minds about this. I just hope nothing bad happens to their kids. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/633 "2019-03-09T18:34:24Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > Given how religious she is, and her husband along with her, there is no way to change their minds about this. > I just hope nothing bad happens to their kids. Don’t hope. Pray. And tell her that you are praying for god to protect her children both from the diseases that they are not protected from, and from the parents who would expose their unprotected children to diseases. Even better if you do not believe in a god. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/634 "2019-03-09T20:43:00Z")
[A six-year-old boy almost dies of tetanus in Oregon.](https://www.oregonlive.com/health/2019/03/unvaccinated-oregon-boy-6-nearly-dies-of-tetanus-racks-up-1-million-in-bills.html) Get this – his family sutured the wound AT HOME. Jesus wept. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/635 "2019-03-09T21:36:46Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > [A six-year-old boy almost dies of tetanus in Oregon.](https://www.oregonlive.com/health/2019/03/unvaccinated-oregon-boy-6-nearly-dies-of-tetanus-racks-up-1-million-in-bills.html) > > Get this – his family sutured the wound AT HOME. Jesus wept. And they’re still refusing to give him any vaccines whatsoever. Time to call CPS? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/636 "2019-03-09T23:21:40Z")
And they have a million dollar hospital bill. Money well spent, I guess, to prevent those life-threatening vaccines from entering his blood stream. ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/637 "2019-03-09T23:37:10Z")
My God, these people are such idiots! The hospital gave him the first dose of the vaccine when he was life-flighted in. And then despite a prolonged, excruciating, life-threatening course of tetanus, they refuse the second dose? Obviously way too much fun was had to preclude the possibility of going through all that again by getting that second dose. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/638 "2019-03-09T23:37:31Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > And they have a million dollar hospital bill. Money well spent, I guess, to prevent those life-threatening vaccines from entering his blood stream. Question for those of you who are lucky enough to have a UHC. Should that have happened in Canada, would they still be on the hook, or would even expenses created by negligence be covered? ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/639 "2019-03-10T00:02:26Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Wait, her kid is autistic but she _still_ refuses to vaccinate them ? What, is she afraid he’ll get double autism ? Double _secret_ autism. I was unclear. The “kid” is 30 and severe (nonverbal, boxing gloves, helmet, etc.). He’s taken quite a toll on her and having an atypical son myself I am not without a great deal of sympathy for her. But she needed to make sense of this crazy world, and hung all the problems on his MMR. Never mind she’s on the spectrum, as is her dad, her daughter (ya, both of her kids), a sister, her two brothers… Seems more like a genetic thing in her case. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626/640 "2019-03-10T02:03:07Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > Time to call CPS? Yes. At least tetanus is not contagious, so this isn’t going to a phenomenon like measles outbreaks. But that doesn’t help this poor kid who was unlucky enough to be born to idiot parents. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626.md?page=31) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anti-vaxxers-are-ignorant-scumbags-that-kill-children/764626.md?page=33)