Your hands have millions of germs, you can never get them all. Also, many viruses are spread thru the air into your nose/mouth, so antibacterial soaps don’t any effect with those. Just getting germs on your hands can’t cause you to get the virus. It’s when you rub them into your nose, mouth or eyes that they become implanted.
germ "jerm\ noun [F germe, fr. L germin-, germen, fr. gignere to beget — more at kin] (1644)
1 a : a small mass of living substance capable of developing into an organism or one of its parts
b : the embryo with the scutellum of a cereal grain that is usu. separated from the starchy endosperm during milling
2 : something that initiates development or serves as an origin : rudiments, beginning
3 : microorganism; esp : a microorganism causing disease
So it isn’t resistance (as in the bacteria which makes an adaptation to anti-biotics), but overgrowth of opportunistic bacteria who now have a clear or clearer field for growth.
As someone noted above the anti-bacterial soaps have a long lasting effect - I don’t think pool chlorine works as well on our bodies - plus a lot of people shower after swimming in pools and so on.
[/almost quote] Probably because the chlorine is an “acitve” chemical ingredient - it quickly diffuses into the air (or something) - if you have owned fish tank, for example, you know you are supposed to let the tap water sit for a certain amount of time to get rid of the chlorine before adding it to the tank. Not strong or long lasting enough.
It might be like saying, “Take this one antibiotic tablet and you’ll be fine” and you know that isn’t true, you need to take the stuff over 10-14 days to get rid of most
an infection.
Now pool water is not the same as drinking water. (My pool supply person says there is a
bacteria/mold/fungus/something that is chlorine resistant, even chlorine loving but that is all I remember.) It’s probably the same as the anti-biotic tablet, you know, take one and you’ll be fine??? Sure there is a lot of chlorine in the pool but the effect is probably not long lasting enough on our skin and lots of us shower after leaving the pool anyway.
And for all I know those dermatologists could have been lying, “Here, take this reserve anti-biotic and stop using anti-biotic soaps.” The stuff was something like Lindamycin. I know it was a girl’s name and mycin not cyllin on the end.
BUT using regular soap and the mechanical action of rubbing your hands together and over each other is enough to get your hands clean.
More should just be more.
Oh, I’m gonna keep using these #%@&* codes 'til I get 'em right.
I’m going to have to modify my position on this one and come down on Jois’s side. In the past I had read articles that equated the action of Triclosan with that of alcohol, chlorine and others that inflict horrid damage on the cells. The prospect of resistance was considered as ridiculous as the idea of roaches becoming resistant to shoes.
It appears that at least one bacteria has become resistant to Triclosan. Even though it is a fairly common intestinal flora, it does prove it can be done. This is touched on in both the second article I posted and the URL posted by APB9999.
Note for the record that though I never stated it, I do agree with Jois’s assertion that more harm is done by damaging benign colonies of bacteria, whos presence is key in keeping the nasties in check.
I have had the symtoms Jois describes (back zits) after swimming in strongly clorinated pools as well. It would appear that this is some evidence (however anecdotal) that this type of thing can be caused by clorinated water.
Sorry Jois, I promise not to post off the top of my head anymore. And to think I almost jumped on someone for doing that myself. It is reasuring to see that at least some of the posters here actually read the links provided.
Chlorine is a small molecule that interferes with a lot of chemical reactions; it kills bugs dead, alright. Antibiotics interfere with some highly specific chemical pathway in the bacterium. In principle, a bacterium can become resistant to antibiotics in two ways: it can change its metabolic pathway to function in a way that is not interefered with by the antibiotic (very rare AFAIK), or it can develop a chemical method, usually an enzyme, to remove the antibiotic itself from its cytosol and/or the environment.
Topical antibacterials act differently. You can put alcohol on your skin in concentrations high enough to kill bacteria without killing you. You cannot take so much alcohol internally that it will kill an infection without killing you at the same time. (Though, of course, we all try it, sometimes without waiting for an infection). You can substitute other topicals for ethanol in that sentence. These are not inhibiting a single pathway, rather they are interfering in the overall metabolism of the cell. Bacteria are thus highly unlikely to develop any resistance. This is true of Chlorine as well.
The new vogue for antibacterial soaps has crossed the line, though. Just for consistency, I’ll keep picking on Triclosan. This compound inhibits lipid synthesis - a specific enough pathway that resistance is conceivable. For the mechanism of action, look here. (A Nature article, kind of technical.) http://www.nature.com/server-java/Propub/nature/394531A0.frameset?context
From the reference: Nature.com above: “Our results show that organisms that are intrinsically resistant to triclosan
may contain triclosan-insensitive enoyl reductases. Like triclosan, other
drugs that are at present thought to be nonspecific ‘biocides’ might actually
have specific targets.”
So the idea (I hope) is that " 'biocides that attack a specific target have a great potential for creating (permitting?) resistant organisms?"
I’d go back to using Ivory, but I’d smell like my mother just bathed me.
Oh, I’m gonna keep using these #%@&* codes 'til I get 'em right.
Thank you, APB999, for explaining the differences between alcohol, chlorine, and the antibiotics! (Notice that I’m not even going to ask you how tetracyclines fit into this scheme. No, I’m not going to. But if you have a few minutes…)
Oh, I’m gonna keep using these #%@&* codes 'til I get 'em right.
There are two main reasons why antibacterial soap won’t do much for most people.
To really achieve much benefit, you need to wah your hands for about 45 seconds. Most of us probably don’t do that.
If anyone else has touched the tap handle, towel, door, etc., you’ll just have the nasties back again. In public facilities, at least, one would probably be better off washing hands normally and then having some way of opening the door to get out that doesn’t require you to come in contact with the jerk who defecated and then used the door without washing his or her hands.
WillGolfForFood - too bad you won’t be able to read this for a day or two! Just kidding I bet you’ll be able to read this by the time they set you free.
Congrats on tossing the glasses!
Your Doc’s suggested use of anti-bacterial soap is probably exactly what that kind of soap is good for - You use it pre-surgery the nite before and it has some extended effect in killing of some/most/all of your skin’s bacteria and then again in the AM for the same reason and effect and you have helped clean up the surgical field for your operation.
The harmful part is using it over and over all the time.
Oh, I’m gonna keep using these #%@&* codes 'til I get 'em right.