# Any antiquarians/book collectors: are these worth a look? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 7, 2012, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083 "2012-03-07T23:43:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2012, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/1 "2012-03-07T23:43:56Z")
I’ve mentioned this before in a recent thread, but I thought I’d start my own. I have a small selection of books, not in very good condition alas, left over from my late mom’s private collection as well as her used book store. I know I could easily find someone in Manhattan or the environs to make a book-by-book assessment, but since there are several I’m just wondering if it’s worth lugging them around in the first place. I don’t expect any hugely accurate assessments when you can’t examine the books themselves, of course. Just thought this mix might be of interest and maybe someone could help me decide whether it’s worth an appointment with an antiquarian or some other professional. (Also, any recs on finding a reputable book assessor? I’ve been [screwed before](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14740835&postcount=6) so I need to find someone more trustworthy who won’t rate a book lower than its worth in order to buy it from me.) Anyway, here’s a list of the books, including their general condition. I’ll spoil 'em ‘cause this is a pretty lengthy list. There are some quirky, unusual items in here, including a compilation of poems and essays by noteworthy authors created specifically as a fundraiser for NYC’s Lotos Club (a hifalutin’ literary club). My mom had a taste for the eclectic. 🙂 Also she enjoyed collecting books about book collectors. Very meta! [spoiler] [ol] [li]Burton, John Hill: _ **Book-Hunter** _ - 1887, Worthington Co. (New York): Hardcover, black leather binding (minor tear, worn edges), black boards, gilt printing of author/title, b/w illustration by Hole; related newspaper clipping attached w/foxing beneath[/li] [li] Collins, Wilkie: _ **Man and Wife** _ - 1870, Harper & Brothers, New York, illustrated. Worn faded lavender/brown cloth cover starting to tear; foxing at edges, has signature by two previous owners. [/li] [li] Dickens, Charles: _ **Mystery of Edwin Drood** _ - 1870, Chapman and Hall (London), 12 illustrations by S.L. Fildes. Hardcover, faded green/brown boards, quite worn and scuffed; moderate foxing throughout. Fair to good.[/li] [li]Fast, Howard: _ **Spartacus** _ - 1951, published by author. Hardcover w/dustjacket torn and stained on back, yellow boards worn at edges, inside clean.[/li] [li] Fitzgerald, F. Scott: _ **The Great Gatsby** _ - 1925, first edition. (I mentioned this in the other thread linked above.) Hardcover, no jacket; worn dark green boards, faded lettering on spine, scuff marks, slight tearing at binding; inside has some foxing else in clean condition. All points are in here: “sick in tired,” etc.[/li] [li] Gibbon, Edward: _ **Decline and Fall of Roman Empire** _ - 1820, London For T. Cadell and W. Davies, et al. 12 vol. Hardcover, light brown leather boards (volumes are variously worn, scuffed, marked), spine w/gilt letters, red and black leather, most are cracked and worn but still intact; marbled edges, foxing; first vol. has signature of previous owner.[/li] [li] Gill, William (editor): _ **Laurel Leaves, Original Poems, Stories and Essays** _ - 1875/6, William F. Gill & Co., Boston. - fundraising volume for Laurel Club contains pieces by Longfellow, Oliver Wendell Holmes, Louisa M. Alcott, Tennyson, Swinburne, others. B/w illustrations. Hardcover, green cover with gilt/black decorative elements, worn at edges and some marks/wear on boards. Gilt-edged pages in very good condition. Signed by previous owner (dated 1875). [/li] [li] Brougham, John and Elderkin, John (Editors): _ **Lotos Leaves, Original Stories, Essays, and Poems** _ - 1874/5, William F. Gill & Co., Boston - fundraising volume for Lotos Club contains works by Mark Twain (original appearance of his mock “Encounter with an Interviewer” one-act play), Wilkie Collins, Tennyson, others. B/w illustrations. Hardcover, red cover with gilt/black decorative elements, worn at edges, frayed end of spine, rubbing, marks/wear on boards. Gilt-edged pages. Signed by previous owner. [/li] [li] Glasgow, Ellen: _ **The Freeman and Other Poems** _ - 1902, autographed (“To Cousin Sophie”) by the author. Poor/Fair - torn bindings, severe water damage, foxing. [/li] [li] Kennedy, John F.: _ **Why England Slept** _ - 1940 (not dated but w/publisher ads for Fall 1940), Hutchinson. 1st English ed. Hardcover, no dustjacket. Worn, faded red boards, black printed title on spine and “Hutchinson” (publisher) on front cover; some water damage on cover and foxing inside, one very minor tear on title page. [/li] [li] Leroux, Gaston. _ **The Phantom of the Opera** _ - 1911, Bobbs-Merrill (New York and Indianapolis). First English language edition. Hardcover, no dustjacket (I don’t believe there was any in the first place). Orange/russet cloth cover, some very minor scuffing, inside pristine, with beautiful illustrations by Andre Castaigne. Title on cover is white and clear; on spine the text should be white but has been rubbed away (darn it!). [/li] [li] Orcutt, William Dana: _ **The Magic of the Book** _ - 1930, Little, Brown & Co., Limited Edition , #182 of 375 copies, signed by author. Vellum spine and tips, parchment boards, top edge gilt. Minor wear on spine, otherwise in lovely condition.[/li] [li] Sinclair, Upton: _ **The Flivver King** _ - 1937, published by author. Softcover, worn pale green wraps, small tear in back and wear at stapled binding; inside, some minor water damage otherwise pages in good shape.[/li] [li] Voltaire: _ **An Essay Upon the Civil Wars of France** _ - 1928, The Georgian Press, Limited Edition, #42 of 475 copies. Worn marbled boards and leather spine, some foxing but mostly clean pages.[/li] [li] Wilde, Oscar: _ **De Profundis** _ - 1909, G.P. Putnam’s & Sons/Knickerbocker Press (New York); Second Printing “with additional material,” illustration of author by Kelly. Hardcover, no dustjacket (uncertain if this was published with one); pale tan boards w/black binding; some minor marks. Inside cover w/bookplate, otherwise very good.[/ol][/li] Anyway, there are also a few other oddities, such as the first editions of Frank Harris’s _ **My Life and Loves** _ and his biography of Oscar Wilde, but I believe they’re in too poor shape to bother. My mother seems to have had a very odd affection for Harris, a man who lied and self-promoted his way through the Gilded Age society and turned every story, even Oscar Wilde’s biography, into an anecdote about himself. To hear him tell it, he was a major player in just about every colorful incident in the late 19th and early 20th century. Basically An egomaniacal, opportunistic Zelig or Forrest Gump.[/spoiler] The biggest problem is obviously the condition of the books, which are usually only fair-to-good, with a couple of exceptions. After my mom died, my father didn’t take good care of her possessions (and we were too young to really take charge of this stuff ourselves) and I fear mom’s precious possessions – second only to her family, of course – were woefully neglected and left in sun-filled or musty conditions that did them no favors. Anyway, anyone have some thoughts? Might they have some worth, and if so, how does one find a reputable book assessment? Thanks! If nothing else, most fellow book-lovers would enjoy the unusual books on the list. ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2012, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/2 "2012-03-07T23:51:54Z")
I have absolutely no idea as to your books’ value, but your link goes to the wrong post. Here’s your [sad story](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14741279&postcount=7). Wow, you briefly owned a book signed by James Joyce and Matisse? Very cool. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2012, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/3 "2012-03-07T23:59:44Z")
Oh crap, you’re right. How did I miscount there? Thanks so much, **lisiate**. Yeah. Funnily enough I was searching for that thread earlier and came across an entirely different topic I’d not paricipated in, where [**Zoe** happened to bring up that very edition of _Ulysses_, which had been listed in _Reader’s Digest_ as an example of a book being crazy rare and valuable.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11751369&postcount=107) And I blew it. So very young, poor and stupid was I! ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/4 "2012-03-23T13:38:00Z")
One last forlorn little bump, just in case someone might have some ideas about these books. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/5 "2012-03-23T14:59:53Z")
Hey - book collecter here. Hmm - what you need to do is go to [Bookfinder.com](http://Bookfinder.com), look up the books, cross-match editions and condition points and see what dealers have them listed for. I tend to monitor Bookfinder and eBay closed auctions for a while until I get a feel for the highs and lows. I love many of the books you have listed from a content standpoint, but am not seeing many that have major value - a few may be worth tens of dollars. The Dickens and the Collins are worth researching more. The one I am holding out hope for is The Great Gatsby - a First with the correct points AND dust jacket would be worth $150,000+, so Firsts without dj are climbing in value. I have seen Fine, tight copies selling for a few thousand dollars. So yours may be worth up to ~$1,000 to the right buyer… Best of luck checking them out. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/6 "2012-03-23T17:05:09Z")
If Dickens/_Drood_ is really the 1870 edition it could be very valuable. Dickens died in 1870 and TMoED was unfinished and still being serialized at the time; it’s believed some hints as to how the story would end were in the illustrations that were done for it, and your’s says it includes the plates. Even if the book itself is falling apart and beyond repair, if the plates are in good condition they could be worth a lot framed. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/7 "2012-03-23T17:30:16Z")
Thanks for the recommendations, guys! Yes, my “money’s” on the _Gatsby_ to be at least of relatively decent value, though not nearly the way it would be even if the lettering on the spine still retained their gilding. That’s a big loss, worth-wise. And the same for the _Drood_. It has an awful lot of foxing on it, and the outside cover is fairly worn–not surprising perhaps for a book with a cloth cover that’s over a century old. Tthe books in best shape are the ones that are the oddest/most novelty – the two gentlemen’s club fundraiser compilation books (_Laurel Leaves_ and _Lotus Leaves_. I’m so curious about how they came about as ideas for fundraisers–whether any or all of the essayists or poets were members of these clubs, which would make sense if they were literary clubs and the writers were donating their services (or already-existing pieces, most likely) to the compilations. Sentimentally, the _Drood_ and the Wilkie Collins books are my favorites, and I suspect the _Drood_ was my mother’s favorite as well having been an avid mystery reader as well as collector/bookseller. Siuch a shame that she wasn’t able to acquire any firsts from her favorite authors, Rex Stout or Agatha Christie. It can’t have been for lack of trying, so maybe the money was just too dear. I suspect most of the other books above were found in garage/tag sales. Back in the days before “Antiques Roadshow” and the web’s easy access to research tools, people were less aware of how valuable some of their allegedly old junk was. Now I understand such finds are much rarer, though I’m sure still possible. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/8 "2012-03-23T17:35:42Z")
_De Profundis_ may also have some value. It wouldn’t be a first edition (it first appeared in book form in 1905), _BUT_ it might be the first edition to include certain passages. For those who don’t know its story: _De Profundis_ was a long treatise begun by Oscar Wilde while he was serving a 2 year prison for sodomy. It started as a letter to Wilde’s former lover, Lord Alfred Douglas, and that letter was basically Wilde’s century and a decade foreshadowing of Cee Lo Green by saying _F[orget] YOU_, thoroughly trashing his codependent partner in one of the most spectacularly disastrous love affairs of all time. The reason Wilde was in prison was because of Douglas (aka ‘Bosie’) goading Wilde into suing Douglas’s father, the Marquis of Queensbury, who had called Wilde a “somdomite” [sic], for libel due to his relationship with Bosie. There were about 800 different reasons suing Queensbury was a bad idea, but foremost among them was that it was of course true- Wilde _was_ a sodomite as defined under English law, and in Queensbury’s defense of course this was proven, and that led to Wilde’s arrest and prosecution and, ultimately, his death. (He didn’t die in prison but an ear injury that occurred there not only ultimately caused an infection that caused him periods of excruciating pain for the rest of his short life and ultimately caused his death at the age of 46.) Other reasons was that Queensbury was much richer than Wilde (Wilde earned a fortune but pissed it all away (much of it on the thoroughly obnoxious but beautiful Bosie- far more certainly than he gave his wife and sons) and was already teetering on the brink of bankruptcy when he filed suit; Queensbury, though he had his own financial problems, could afford much better lawyers. Add to that the man was psychotically vindictive and had a violent temper (he was so savage in his abuse of his wives and sons that it’s theorized two of his sons suffered from PTSD; his last wife got some revenge when she divorced by seeking annulment on the grounds he was unable to consummate the marriage). Anyway, Wilde showered a fortune on Bosie who was famous for his public tantrums and for loudly insulting Wilde at any opportunity and for splashy walkouts- they frequently separated- and then for goading the whipped Wilde into the move that cost him what was left of his fame, his money, his sons (his long suffering wife finally divorced him and changed the kids surname to Holland and took them to Switzerland to live as poor relations when Wilde was ruined), his freedom, his health, and ultimately his life largely as a way of getting his older famous lover mainly to settle a score in a tremendously rich and dsyfunctional family’s squabbles. And how dysfunctional was the relationship? After writing _De Profundis_, after being released from prison, Wilde and Bosie got back together. Then broke up in a screaming match. Then got back together. Then broke up again. After Wilde’s death Bosie went on bipolar roller coasters about his relationship with Wilde. Depending on the particular month he either considered Wilde the great love of his life and the greatest genius and kindest man of all time, or little short of a twin brother of Satan as well as a talentless hack who led boys, including Bosie, astray. Except for the times he claimed they had never had a sexual relationship at all, which contradicted things he’d said earlier and would say later. Bosie also liked to sue people for saying- well, pretty much anything about him, factual or otherwise, especially if it included Wilde. He won some lawsuits too. (Unfortunately for him the judgments were usually against people who couldn’t pay them so he didn’t get anything, and since he’d lost a large part of his inheritance in bad investments and spousal and child support [after Wilde’s death he married/had a special needs child/separated) and the fact he _got_ sued several times, he was soon living in genteel poverty.) Anyway, when _De Profundis_ appeared in book form in 1905 courtesy of Wilde’s literary executor/former lover/closest friend/the anti-Bosie Robbie Ross, Douglas’s hissy fits and threatened suits against Ross (who he did successfully sue for other things) and the publisher made them cut a lot of it, pretty much anything that was really specific to Bosie. However, starting in 1908, a year before your version was published, they started adding things _back_ to it, basically having learned from their lawyers that any liability was on the part of Wilde and as he was dead and his estate insolvent, sue away. SO, the point being, even though it’s not the first apperance in book form, it was published at the time when they were restoring the cuts made in the original, and could be the first to have a particular passage or more. ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/9 "2012-03-23T18:22:19Z")
Rare book dealers aren’t like a gold exchange. They’ll offer you a fraction of what they think they can re-sell the book for, and if it’s in poor condition, even less. Yeah, most of those books are worth a look. I think eBay is your best bet, but know of no way you can get top dollar on the whole lot of them in a short amount of time. ---
**Author:** ![Taomist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Taomist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Taomist)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/10 "2012-03-23T18:39:04Z")
> [@Krokodil](#): > > Rare book dealers aren’t like a gold exchange. They’ll offer you a fraction of what they think they can re-sell the book for, and if it’s in poor condition, even less. Yeah, most of those books are worth a look. I think eBay is your best bet, but know of no way you can get top dollar on the whole lot of them in a short amount of time. This. Plus you just might want to put a few up for sale on this board…I am sure there are many people here as wierd as I am and like old books just…because they’re old. The condition is secondary, as those who buy books like that don’t do so for their resale value. Hell, I’d be interested in the Dickens, I just have no idea where to start for a price point! Anyway, just a suggestion 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-antiquarians-book-collectors-are-these-worth-a-look/615083/11 "2012-03-23T18:39:37Z")
Maybe what pissed Wilde off so much was that Queensbury’s note said “_Posing_ as a Sodomite.” Dammit, he _was_ a sodomite and no one was gonna claim it was merely an act! (No, I know that wasn’t it. Wilde was clearly head-over-heels for Bosie and was manipulated into fighting Bosie’s paternal problems in public. Which reminds me, speaking of the Frank Harris books and his biography of Wilde, he (Harris) claims that he was the “first” to tell Wilde not to sue, and did everything in his power to prevent the suit. I’m frankly surprised Harris didn’t put himself in that courtroom defying the judge and jury, or perhaps visiting Wilde and offering to dig him out of prison barehanded without even a shovel – all while seducing the warden’s daughter, of course.) Re: the edition of _De Profundis_, there’s a fairly extensive intro by Robbie Ross that includes: > [@](#): > > In sending copy to Messrs. Mehuen (to whom alone I submitted it) I anticipated refusal, as though the work were my own. A very distinguished man of letters who acted as their reader advised, however, its acceptance, and urged, in view of the uncertainty of its reception, the excision of certain passages, to which I readily assented. > > Since there has been a demand to see these passages, already issued in German, they are here replaced along with others of minor importance. I have added besides some of those letters written to me from Reading, which though they were brought out by you in Germany I did not, at first, contemplate publishing in this country. They illustrate Wilde’s varying moods in prison. Owing to a foolish error in transcription, I sent you these letters with wrong dates–dates of which other unpublished letters. The error here is rectified. > > By the courtesy of the editor and the proprietors of the _Daily Chronicle_, I have included the two remarkable contibutions to their paper on the subject of prison life: these and _The Ballad of Reading Gaol_ being all that Wilde wrote after his release other than private correspondence. The generous reception accorded to _De Profundis_ has justified the prepration of a new and fuller edition. He also goes on to explain that the title _De Profundis_ is his own, and mentions that many people thus thought it was a forgery by Ross. As he says wryly, “Were I capable either of the requisite art, or the requisite fraud, I should have made a name in literature ere now.” All that said, I’m beginning to wonder about whether this is a genuine second edition. The copyright of the second edition says 1909, but on the very last page there’s an announcement by Putnam & Sons of a new book called “Wall Shadows,” which is described as a study of American prisons by Frank Tannenbaum – who, according to the text, in _1914_ led an orderly group of jobless men into a church looking for work, after which he was thrown in jail. And _Wall Shadows_ was published in 1922! So, um, unless this was a fictional book, how the heck could this ad have been included in a genuine 1909 printing of a book? So yeah, I think this must be a reproduction, unless there was some kind of temporal distortion leading to Putnam & Sons being able to advertise a book that won’t be published for at least thirteen years! That’s a shame. There are a few other novelties in the collection. One is Dorothy Sayers’s _Unpopular Opinions_; _The Man in the Moon_ by William Hone with illustrations by George Cruickshank (a 1820 pamphlet in fairly dire shape except that the insides and illustrations are clean); _The Pursuit of the House-Boat_ by John Kendrick Bangs (1st ed. 1897 – a really odd pastische featuring the ghosts of Socrates, Sir Walter Raleigh, Samuel Johnson, and Sherlock Holmes, among others… actually the book is dedicated to Conan Doyle with thanks for killing off Holmes and thus allowing the book to be created… so it’s right before Conan Doyle brought Holmes back from the dead I suppose). A strange mishmash of a collection but my mom was fairly eclectic. Edited to add: my extensive reply missed the two insertions above. Yep I know if I offered these to a bookseller who was willing to buy them, I’d get a not-very-good deal. My thought was more to take them to an appraiser, separate from a bookseller, so at least I know what their approximate value is. 🙂 **Taomist** , that’s an interesting idea – but really the _Drood_ is probably the book I’m least interested in parting with, thanks to its sentimental value re: my late mom. But thank you!