# Any case where MM-DD-YY dating has cost money? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 23, 2023, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594 "2023-09-23T11:50:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/101 "2023-09-29T17:30:34Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > In Eastern Time, the transition between Standard and Daylight time takes place at 02:00. I guess the Central transition takes place at the same moment? And would the Atlantic transition then take place at 01:00? The transition takes place at 2:00 everywhere. They repeat the hour between 2 and 3. If I am wrong and they repeat the hour between 1 and 2, then it is the same scenario but an hour earlier. I once took an overnight train (when the Montrealer between Montreal and Washington still ran) on that night and they pulled off on a siding for an hourl ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/102 "2023-09-29T17:58:54Z")
Why? I mean, I can see how a computer would “prefer” a logical order. But we humans are not computers, and we are definitely not logical. Any order would work for us, as long as we are consistent. It’s the lack of consistency that’s the problem, not the specific order. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/103 "2023-09-29T19:12:13Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > The transition takes place at 2:00 everywhere. They repeat the hour between 2 and 3. If I am wrong and they repeat the hour between 1 and 2, then it is the same scenario but an hour earlier. @LSLGuy already gave the correct info in post #94, but I’ll repeat it here. It’s Fall back, Spring forward. This happens in the Fall, so you move the clock back from 2:00 to 1:00, thus repeating that hour. Western Florida does it an hour before eastern Oregon, so they’re at the same time for that hour. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/104 "2023-09-29T19:29:58Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Don’t get me wrong, I think we should join the rest of the world simply because they’re the rest of world Well, why? And second, it is _not_ “the rest of the world”. That was incorrect. “Most” of the world would be more correct. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/105 "2023-09-29T21:45:48Z")
> [@jgc](#): > > For the sake of civilisation we can only hope. Yes, can confirm that civilisation is not at risk. It was a (weak) joke that they would publish an ISO standard for date format with a reference number that derived from a non-standard date format. ---
**Author:** ![abcdefghij](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/43a26b/32.png) [@abcdefghij](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/abcdefghij)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/106 "2023-09-30T11:29:35Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > It was a (weak) joke Nah. Once I got over my initial “WTF are you talking about!?” reaction, I thought it was pretty funny. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/107 "2023-09-30T22:02:20Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > It’s Fall back, Spring forward. This happens in the Fall, so you move the clock back from 2:00 to 1:00, thus repeating that hour. Western Florida does it an hour before eastern Oregon, so they’re at the same time for that hour. Thanks for the update. Trivia point remains. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/108 "2023-09-30T22:17:38Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > > [@Sunspace](#): > > > > That breaks down as soon as you have multiple languages. ⁢ > > All forms of communication break down once you have multiple languages. That can’t be helped. ⁢ The ISO standard that others are recommending doesn’t, since it uses numbers instead of words. That is what I have always thought was its greatest strength. I didn’t discover the alphanumeric sorting advantage until later. > [@Digger11](#): > > When people are talking out loud, does anybody actually **say** “23 August”? No, but I understand that DD-MM countries say “the 23rd of August.” Americans used to do that: the holiday is named “the Fourth of July,” not “July Fourth.” ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/109 "2023-10-01T03:26:24Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > I once took an overnight train (when the Montrealer between Montreal and Washington still ran) on that night and they pulled off on a siding for an hourl When I lived in Indiana I was in a band that often played out-of-state. At that time Indiana didn’t have DST so we didn’t think about having to change our clocks. One Autumn night we’re in Peoria, IL on the night of the time change which we were totally unaware of. The venue closed around 3:30ish a.m.\* We played our last song around 2:50 am (we thought) and started the load-out. The venue manager came up to ask what we were doing. “It’s a little early to leave, isn’t it? It’s only 1:50. You guys still have another set to play.” Collective head-slap ensued. \*I say “-ish” because at that time and place bars could sell liquor right up until 3:00 am, after which bar patrons still had a reasonable amount of time to sit and finish their drinks so the actual moment when folks had to get out the door varied somewhat. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/110 "2023-10-01T04:31:17Z")
Failure to account for DST has resulted in [even more serious consequences](https://www.ronengelman.com/blog/the-terrorist-who-won-a-darwin-award) than ending a show too early. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/111 "2023-10-01T05:37:22Z")
> [@Eva\_Luna](#): > > Do you have a passport, and if so, what’s the format of your DOB there? That’s what I have to go by. I was just looking at the US passport pages to see the format and languages (and yes the fields are labeled in English/French/Spanish)… but does it really take _10 to 13 weeks_ plus mailing time for a routine passport request? 😮😮😮 That puts some of the discussion on the Reddit Canada/US border forum in perspective (people panicking because they only have a month to get a US passport). In Canada the routine request through a “Service Canada” office takes 20 business days plus mailing time (10 if you go in person to a passport office). > **[How to renew a passport in Canada - Canada.ca](https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/canadian-passports/renew-adult-passport.html)** > > Learn how to renew your adult passport, including the specific steps you need to follow, the documents that you need to submit with your application, and how to submit your application in Canada. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/112 "2023-10-01T06:26:31Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > I was just looking at the US passport pages to see the format and languages (and yes the fields are labeled in English/French/Spanish)… but does it really take _10 to 13 weeks_ plus mailing time for a routine passport request? 😮😮😮 Yeah. My ex-wife had to renew her American passport through some place in St. Louis, and it took months. She, with her brand-new Canadian citizenship card, got a Canadian passport in about three weeks. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/113 "2023-10-01T09:52:48Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > I was just looking at the US passport pages to see the format and languages (and yes the fields are labeled in English/French/Spanish)… but does it really take _10 to 13 weeks_ plus mailing time for a routine passport request? 😮😮😮 It does right now. That’s not the norm, which is why people are getting blindsided by it. In 2018, I got my non-expedited renewal done in well under a month IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/114 "2023-10-01T11:54:47Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > I was just looking at the US passport pages to see the format and languages (and yes the fields are labeled in English/French/Spanish)… but does it really take _10 to 13 weeks_ plus mailing time for a routine passport request? 😮😮😮 It’s one of the consequences of nutjobs who have spent decades trying to shrink government until it’s small enough to drown in a bathtub. There’s a bunch of Federal stuff that is woefully underfunded. But let’s not digress more than that. ---
**Author:** ![abcdefghij](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/43a26b/32.png) [@abcdefghij](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/abcdefghij)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/115 "2023-10-01T16:06:26Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > but does it really take _10 to 13 weeks_ plus mailing time for a routine passport request? 😮😮😮 Right now, you would be extremely fortunate to get your US passport in 10 to 13 weeks. The system is completely broken. The only reason my wife and I were able to renew ours last spring, despite filing in plenty of time _and_ paying for rush service, was because the passport office separated the payment from my wife’s application, returned the application for non-payment (but never returned the money), which put her in an emergency status that enabled getting an in-person appointment two days before our flight. By the time I was eligible for an emergency appointment, they were all taken. Fortunately, I was allowed to piggy-back on her appointment. All reports are that the delays have only gotten worse. ---
**Author:** ![abcdefghij](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/43a26b/32.png) [@abcdefghij](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/abcdefghij)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/116 "2023-10-01T16:08:53Z")
> [@abcdefghij](#): > > the passport office separated the payment from my wife’s application, returned the application for non-payment (but never returned the money) We know they did this because they called and said “hey, you sent us money and we don’t know why”. I explained why, they said they’d look into it, and they never did. The next day, her application was returned, and my wife spent days on the phone with people who’d never heard about the first person. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/117 "2023-10-01T16:53:05Z")
That’s interesting. My wife and kids all got new passports last year; we did not expedite and got them all, much to my surprise, in three weeks. They were giving us a four plus month timeframe, but we got ours right away. Same thing with my renewal the year before. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/118 "2023-10-01T18:04:32Z")
Hmm, I just renewed my son’s passport. He’s a minor, so every time it has to be done as a completely new passport. We expedited, and it took exactly a month to get. Maybe things are getting better? ---
**Author:** ![abcdefghij](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/43a26b/32.png) [@abcdefghij](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/abcdefghij)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/119 "2023-10-01T18:35:18Z")
I should’ve said: we ran my child’s through at the same time (same deal; minor child, so had to be done in person). We got their new passport in a similar 3 or 4 weeks; my wife’s and mine were a total cluster fuck, despite being handed to the same agent at the same time. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594/120 "2023-10-01T19:48:22Z")
How long BEFORE the expiration date can you renew a passport? I see the [travel.state.gov](http://travel.state.gov) site says the old passport must have been issued within the last 15 years, but I don’t see anything about a limit on how recently it had been issued. Like, can I renew it after 5 years just to be safe? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-case-where-mm-dd-yy-dating-has-cost-money/990594.md?page=7)