# Any occupiers/99%ers here? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 7, 2011, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883 "2011-10-07T12:08:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/21 "2011-10-07T21:52:27Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > Yes, they won’t even leave the parks at the 10pm curfew. What purpose is served by getting arrested for that? It gets them attention. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/22 "2011-10-07T21:55:30Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > How about [this](http://www.adbusters.org/blogs/adbusters-blog/occupywallstreet.html)? I can get behind it: > > I plan on going to Occupy Portland in the near future, and that will be the demand I write on my sign. Clear, simple, concise. It, clear, concise, specific…and it will get lost among all the other signs with all the other problems that people are complaining about. But maybe the news crews and those in power will pick out your particular message and focus in on it. Anything could happen, right? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/23 "2011-10-07T22:02:12Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > It, clear, concise, specific…and it will get lost among all the other signs with all the other problems that people are complaining about. But maybe the news crews and those in power will pick out your particular message and focus in on it. > Anything could happen, right? It’s worth a try. > [@Margaret Mead](#): > > Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. ---
**Author:** ![rhubarbarin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eb9ed0/32.png) [@rhubarbarin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rhubarbarin)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/24 "2011-10-07T22:40:35Z")
I like protests and will probably go join in if it really gets going here in Philadelphia, but I haven’t yet. I think the ‘Occupy’ movement is (so far) very silly. But I dislike so many things about this country I might as well attend protests, even if the ideals or planning of the other protesters isn’t up to my standards. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/25 "2011-10-07T22:52:34Z")
Between the Tea Party and the Occupy Wall Streeters, I can’t decide which “America” to hate more. ---
**Author:** ![Yogurt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/f0a364/32.png) [@Yogurt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yogurt)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/26 "2011-10-08T00:13:14Z")
I’ve been looking out my nice corporate window at them. Looks like they’re having a great time in Baltimore, [http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bal-bs-md-occupy-balti7-20111004141630,0,5686504.photo](http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bal-bs-md-occupy-balti7-20111004141630,0,5686504.photo) ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/27 "2011-10-08T02:33:31Z")
I got my numbers by head-counting the crowd several times during the day. I counted about 500 to 600, not including cops or media. The local news reported numbers ranging from 200 to 800. My group has moved to a neighboring park for the weekend so as to not interfere with an art festival scheduled for the park in front of city hall, where they had been. I believe they plan to move back to the first park on Monday. My favorite sign said “I couldn’t afford a politician, so I just made this sign.” Next week there are some joint events- joining Occupy with an AFL-CIO event and also some Move On ‘Jobs Not Cuts’ events. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/28 "2011-10-08T06:33:43Z")
The news crews are going to focus on the wack jobs that carry signs that read “CHEMTRAILS ARE MURDER!”…while chain smoking. It happened today in Portland. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/29 "2011-10-08T06:47:11Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Between the Tea Party and the Occupy Wall Streeters, I can’t decide which “America” to hate more. Well, the Occupiers at least have good intentions. I respect that. But really, in order to get any real results out of protests, you must focus. ---
**Author:** ![Agnostic\_Pagan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c4cdca/32.png) [@Agnostic\_Pagan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agnostic_Pagan)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/30 "2011-10-08T07:02:28Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > Yes, they won’t even leave the parks at the 10pm curfew. What purpose is served by getting arrested for that? Presumably these are all local people–go home, get some sleep, and come back tanned, rested, and ready at 6am tomorrow. > > Or have I missed a sign? “End the 10pm park curfew!” The purpose is civil disobedience, which has been a key ingredient in several successful movements. Yet as of last night, no one else has been arrested downtown STL over the protests, and everyone complied with the officers request to move to the sidewalk, where I guess the curfew does not apply. And as of midnight when I left for the coffee shop where I am posting, no police presence had shown up to request even that. And some of the protestors do go to their homes, but an increasing number are camping out and plan to stay for the duration and range from college students to union workers to government workers and others. It is too soon to tell if it has legs or not, but it appears off to a good start. Several people brought food donations and helped out. I also saw several activists from other groups trying to coordinate actions. Many others are showing their support honking and waving as they pass by, including a couple city fire engines. All in all not a bad night. Looking forward to what the weekend crowd will be. For an event like this to last event a week in St Louis is amazing to me. This is pointedly not New York or Portland or other progressive bastions around the country. And again, the goal is not to present a coherent or even consistent agenda yet. It is trying to gather enough voices so that any such agenda will have sufficient support to be addressed. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/31 "2011-10-08T13:23:56Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Well, the Occupiers at least have good intentions. I respect that. But really, in order to get any real results out of protests, you must focus. I don’t know what their “intentions” are. Tea Party folk think they have good intentions too. But what it mostly seems to amount to are large crowds of angry, ill-informed people looking for somewhere to focus that anger. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/32 "2011-10-08T14:02:54Z")
Can someone explain what this “Occupy” movement is? Until I came on this thread I was unaware of these mass protests. ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/33 "2011-10-08T15:29:02Z")
Here in LA, there were some large marches and protests on Thursday. One of them took place outside the offices of Deloitte & Touche, where protesters were jeering employees walking by. One of the local news stations interviewed an DT employee taking a smoke break and asked him what he thought of the protesters. He responded with, “I think they need to find jobs.” ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/34 "2011-10-08T15:40:32Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If this is supposed to be a “Wall Street” type of protest, then protest things that have to do with Wall Street-business, finance and the like. Focus a bit so that the people you want to influence know that you are talking to _them_ in particular. As it now stands, nobody is in a position to address the concerns of this crowd… This was my initial reaction, but I’ve been persuaded I was wrong. There’s a lot of unfocused or misfocused anger among the 99% of Americans; **this anger is valid** even if some of the naive protesters are confused. If the movement is successful it must eventually get better focus, but meanwhile the confusion is evidence that this is a genuine democratic movement with grassroots origin. PS: Today I spoke to an American who had just come to Thailand, watched RT News at his hotel, **and learned of these protests for the first time**. It seems they’re not getting the attention they deserve by America’s own news shows. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/35 "2011-10-08T15:51:48Z")
That D-T employee and Herman Cain have both expressed that these protesters need “to find jobs.” I think that’s the point. These people are fighting for jobs. The money is all on Wall Street and banks and lobbies and politicians, but there are no jobs. That’s the point of this: Stop the corporate greed and start creating jobs. Close the tax loopholes for the wealthy, and stop this unemployment-inducing austerity. The private sector isn’t hiring, the public sector is being bullied into slashing jobs, but people on Wall Street and in the upper levels of corporate America are rolling in dough. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/36 "2011-10-08T16:02:49Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > The news crews are going to focus on the wack jobs that carry signs that read “CHEMTRAILS ARE MURDER!”…while chain smoking. It happened today in Portland. I’m not in the least bit surprised. The corporate owned media doesn’t have much interest in people taking this movement seriously. They know where their bread is buttered. Their first course of action was simply to ignore it. Now that it’s too big to ignore, they are going to make it look as silly as possible. While I would love to see more coherence to this protest, this is an organic grassroots movement and there’s no central leadership capable of forcing Orthodoxy on every protestor. That being said, I think it’s quite clear what they are angry about: That our government is catering to the whims of the 1% at the expense of the 99%. The manner in which this is occuring and the solutions to it are extremely complicated and multifaceted and thus is very difficult to ennunciate an exact solution that will fit on a bumper sticker, or even on a sign. Nonetheless, it is fitting that there is now a sizable movement of people willing to publicly call attention to this problem. Here’s one [photo](http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=735855747448&set=o.169658036449747&type=3&theater) I found of Occupy Portland I noticed two signs were visible in this photo. One says “Too big to jail? Perp walk Wall Street.” Calling attention to the sad fact that none of the people who helped causes this crisis actually suffered any consequence for it. I think this is a pretty damned important thing to point out. The second says “The top 1% and their lobbyists have completely bought off 99% of Congress. Now we the 99% of America demand public financing of elections.” Paul Krugman made some noteworthy comments in this opinion piece, entitled “[Confronting the Malefactors](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/opinion/krugman-confronting-the-malefactors.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss)”: > [@Paul Krugman](#): > > What can we say about the protests? First things first: **The protesters’ indictment of Wall Street as a destructive force, economically and politically, is completely right.** [emphasis mine] > > A weary cynicism, a belief that justice will never get served, has taken over much of our political debate — and, yes, I myself have sometimes succumbed. In the process, it has been easy to forget just how outrageous the story of our economic woes really is. So, in case you’ve forgotten, it was a play in three acts. Krugman then goes on to explain the history behind the crisis. > [@Paul Krugman](#): > > Given this history, how can you not applaud the protesters for finally taking a stand? > > Now, it’s true that some of the protesters are oddly dressed or have silly-sounding slogans, which is inevitable given the open character of the events. But so what? I, at least, am a lot more offended by the sight of exquisitely tailored plutocrats, who owe their continued wealth to government guarantees, whining that President Obama has said mean things about them than I am by the sight of ragtag young people denouncing consumerism. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/37 "2011-10-08T17:33:40Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > Can someone explain what this “Occupy” movement is? Until I came on this thread I was unaware of these mass protests. > **[wearethe99percent.com is for sale | HugeDomains](https://www.hugedomains.com/domain_profile.cfm?d=wearethe99percent.com&utm_source=hdrhttpstest)** > > Get your very own domain easily. Fast and professional customer service. > [@](#): > > We are the 99 percent. We are getting kicked out of our homes. We are forced to choose between groceries and rent. We are denied quality medical care. We are suffering from environmental pollution. We are working long hours for little pay and no rights, if we’re working at all. We are getting nothing while the other 1 percent is getting everything. We are the 99 percent. > > Brought to you by the people who occupy wall street. Why will YOU occupy? > **[Occupy Wall Street | NYC Protest for World Revolution](http://www.occupywallst.org)** > > News and resources for protesters attending the mass demonstration on Wall Street against financial greed and corruption > [@](#): > > Occupy Wall Street Agenda Saturday, October 8 > Saturday, October 8 > 1:00pm General Assembly > 3:00pm 2nd General Assembly > 3:00pm Anti-Flag Acoustic Set > 6:00pm Open Forum: The end of the financial mind and the transformation of global class structure > 7:00pm General Assembly > [@](#): > > LIST OF PROPOSED “DEMANDS FOR CONGRESS” > > CONGRESS PASS HR 1489 (“RETURN TO PRUDENT BANKING ACT” [Return to Prudent Banking Act of 2011 (2011; 112th Congress H.R. 1489) - GovTrack.us](http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h112-1489) ). THIS REINSTATES MANY PROVISIONS OF THE GLASS-STEAGALL ACT. [Glass–Steagall legislation - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass%E2%80%93Steagall_Act) — Wiki entry summary: The repeal of provisions of the Glass–Steagall Act of 1933 by the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act in 1999 effectively removed the separation that previously existed between investment banking which issued securities and commercial banks which accepted deposits. The deregulation also removed conflict of interest prohibitions between investment bankers serving as officers of commercial banks. Most economists believe this repeal directly contributed to the severity of the Financial crisis of 2007–2011 by allowing Wall Street investment banking firms to gamble with their depositors’ money that was held in commercial banks owned or created by the investment firms. Here’s detail on repeal in 1999 and how it happened: [Glass–Steagall legislation - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass%E2%80%93Steagall_Act#Repeal) . > USE CONGRESSIONAL AUTHORITY AND OVERSIGHT TO ENSURE APPROPRIATE FEDERAL AGENCIES FULLY INVESTIGATE AND PROSECUTE THE WALL STREET CRIMINALS who clearly broke the law and helped cause the 2008 financial crisis in the following notable cases: (insert list of the most clear cut criminal actions). There is a pretty broad consensus that there is a clear group of people who got away with millions / billions illegally and haven’t been brought to justice. Boy would this be long overdue and cathartic for millions of Americans. It would also be a shot across the bow for the financial industry. If you watch the solidly researched and awared winning documentary film “Inside Job” that was narrated by Matt Damon (pretty brave Matt!) and do other research, it wouldn’t take long to develop the list. > > CONGRESS ENACT LEGISLATION TO PROTECT OUR DEMOCRACY BY REVERSING THE EFFECTS OF THE CITIZENS UNITED SUPREME COURT DECISION which essentially said corporations can spend as much as they want on elections. The result is that corporations can pretty much buy elections. Corporations should be highly limited in ability to contribute to political campaigns no matter what the election and no matter what the form of media. This legislation should also RE-ESTABLISH THE PUBLIC AIRWAVES IN THE U.S. SO THAT POLITICAL CANDIDATES ARE GIVEN EQUAL TIME FOR FREE AT REASONABLE INTERVALS IN DAILY PROGRAMMING DURING CAMPAIGN SEASON. The same should extend to other media. > > CONGRESS PASS THE BUFFETT RULE ON FAIR TAXATION SO THE RICH AND CORPORATIONS PAY THEIR FAIR SHARE & CLOSE CORPORATE TAX LOOP HOLES AND ENACT A PROHIBITION ON HIDING FUNDS OFF SHORE. No more GE paying zero or negative taxes. Pass the Buffet Rule on fair taxation so the rich pay their fair share. (If we have a really had a good negotiating position and have the place surrounded, we could actually dial up taxes on millionaires, billionaires and corporations even higher…back to what they once were in the 50’s and 60’s. > > CONGRESS COMPLETELY REVAMP THE SECURITIES AND EXCHANGE COMMISSION and staff it at all levels with proven professionals who get the job done protecting the integrity of the marketplace so citizens and investors are both protected. This agency needs a large staff and needs to be well-funded. It’s currently has a joke of a budget and is run by Wall St. insiders who often leave for high ticket cushy jobs with the corporations they were just regulating. Hmmm. > > CONGRESS PASS SPECIFIC AND EFFECTIVE LAWS LIMITING THE INFLUENCE OF LOBBYISTS AND ELIMINATING THE PRACTICE OF LOBBYISTS WRITING LEGISLATION THAT ENDS UP ON THE FLOOR OF CONGRESS. > > CONGRESS PASSING “Revolving Door Legislation” LEGISLATION ELIMINATING THE ABILITY OF FORMER GOVERNMENT REGULATORS GOING TO WORK FOR CORPORATIONS THAT THEY ONCE REGULATED. So, you don’t get to work at the FDA for five years playing softball with Pfizer and then go to work for Pfizer making $195,000 a year. While they’re at it, Congress should pass specific and effective laws to enforce strict judicial standards of conduct in matters concerning conflicts of interest. So long as judges are culled from the ranks of corporate attorneys the 1% will retain control. > > ELIMINATE “PERSONHOOD” LEGAL STATUS FOR CORPORATIONS. The film “The Corporation” has a great section on how corporations won “personhood status”. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SuUzmqBewg](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SuUzmqBewg) . Fast-forward to 2:20. It’ll blow your mind. The 14th amendment was supposed to give equal rights to African Americans. It said you “can’t deprive a person of life, liberty or property without due process of law”. Corporation lawyers wanted corporations to have more power so they basically said “corporations are people.” Amazingly, between 1890 and 1910 there were 307 cases brought before the court under the 14th amendment. 288 of these brought by corporations and only 19 by African Americans. 600,000 people were killed to get rights for people and then judges applied those rights to capital and property while stripping them from people. It’s time to set this straight. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/38 "2011-10-08T17:41:21Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > Can someone explain what this “Occupy” movement is? Until I came on this thread I was unaware of these mass protests. **They** can’t even tell you, man. Which late night show had a skit this week mocking them? > [@](#): > > “What do we what?” > “We’re not sure!” > “When do we want it?” > “Now!” I certainly sympathize with the frustration that the protesters feel because I’ve been bitten by this horrible economy too (hence [my search for a p/t job](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14329163&postcount=148) to get the ends closer to meeting), but they make the Tea Party’s goals look very polished in comparison, and you know that despite conservative leanings I’m not one of _those people_ either. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/39 "2011-10-08T21:27:37Z")
The Tea Party comparisons are certainly apt. I remember all of those Tea Party occupations. Those tea partiers were there day and night… weeks at a time… braving the tear gas… hundreds of arrests. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2011, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883/40 "2011-10-08T22:57:55Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > That D-T employee and Herman Cain have both expressed that these protesters need “to find jobs.” I think that’s the point. These people are fighting for jobs. The money is all on Wall Street and banks and lobbies and politicians, but there are no jobs. That’s the point of this: Stop the corporate greed and start creating jobs. Close the tax loopholes for the wealthy, and stop this unemployment-inducing austerity. The private sector isn’t hiring, the public sector is being bullied into slashing jobs, but people on Wall Street and in the upper levels of corporate America are rolling in dough. Speaking as a former Big-4 (D&T/PWC/E&Y/KPMG) consultant, I find it interesting how people who most likely worked pretty hard in school and work long hours for a company where their job is basically helping companies run better and are part of the regulatory process is considered the “bad guy” I don’t see these angry people doing anything or demanding anything that ultimately will create more jobs [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-occupiers-99-ers-here/598883.md?page=3)