# Any Pro-Choice People Think Abortion is Morally Wrong? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 16, 2014, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305 "2014-07-16T21:39:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/21 "2014-07-17T00:32:06Z")
> [@Aangelica](#): > > I do not believe the government should be making my personal moral choices for me at all - whether it be with regard to abortions or sexual fidelity or the attendance (or lack thereof) at a specific church. I am a grown adult, and therefore making my personal moral choices is up to _me_, thank you very much. > > Many, many people make choices I believe to be morally wrong (or at least questionable). This does not mean that I think the government ought to be involved in the decision-making process. > > Whether or not a specific act is moral or not is a personal one, whether we’re discussing abortion or pet adoption or charitable giving or sexting with that hot guy in the office. It is the very _definition_ of “YMMV”. What if your personal moral choice is that having sex with children is perfectly fine? The government make moral choices all the time. Most are based on consensus, but the governmen enforces that consensus (no murder, no robbery). You may be an adult, but that doesn’t mean your moral choices don’t affect others or are good for anyone but you. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/22 "2014-07-17T00:42:56Z")
Yes and no. My opinion of the morality of an abortion varies greatly depending on the length of the term. IMO, early-term abortions are morally questionable, and I’d prefer people didn’t get them, but I’m uneasy with the state preventing them by force, with all that that entails. When you’re talking about a 32-week-old, I think that’s a very different kettle of fish, and I find the arguments in defense of partial-birth abortion ridiculous. I’m still uneasy with the state getting involved, though I find it a lot more defensible; I definitely find it morally abhorrent. IOW, I think we’ve gone backwards since the days when “quickening” was the legal dividing line. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/23 "2014-07-17T01:58:56Z")
I’m pro-choice, but I could never have had an abortion, because I believe that life begins at conception. That belief is both religiously based and scientifically. Maybe logically too. It can’t be pinpointed just when “life” does begin, because the age at which a fetus can be viable keeps getting pushed back. But I also believe in free will. Back in 1992 I voted for the Perot/Stockdale ticket for President, because of a statement by Adm. Stockdale during the vice presidential debate. When asked his position on abortion, instead of giving a weasel worded response like Gore and Quayle did, he stated _“I believe that what a woman does with her own body is her business. Period”_ He repeated the _“Period”_ when the moderater seemed surprised at such a short response. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/24 "2014-07-17T02:09:35Z")
I hate the labels pro-choice and pro-life. I’m both. I think abortion is morally wrong, but I believe in free and open access to abortion because it’s better than the alternative. If I knew someone personally who was important to me (my sister is basically the only woman I know who falls into this category), and she was considering abortion, I’d try to talk her out of it. I’d offer to adopt the kid. I’d offer to help pay for the child care if she didn’t want to adopt the child to me, etc. I’d strongly urge her not to get an abortion, but if she wanted to in the end, I’d let it go and support her decision. I have no idea what it’s like to have a life growing inside me against my will, and as a man, I never will. It’s not my place to pass judgment on someone who chooses abortion, and I sure as hell don’t want the government trying to prevent it. I think gambling is immoral too, but I don’t want that illegal. In short, there are lots of things that are immoral, but I don’t want the government to have anything to do with trying to stop it. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/25 "2014-07-17T02:13:36Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > It’s called “pro-choice” and not “pro-abortion” for a reason. > > I knew a woman in the army who got pregnant to avoid going to Iraq. Six weeks after her unit deployed, she got an abortion. I don’t care what side of the aisle you stand on, that’s fucking _cold_. In a way, yes. But in another way, maybe her not going to Iraq resulted in fewer dead people overall. ---
**Author:** ![mage-girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@mage-girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mage-girl)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/26 "2014-07-17T03:17:03Z")
I am pro-choice, though given the fact that I rarely date or have relationships, I probably won’t need an abortion personally. I regard abortion as a necessary evil, and would only okay it after the first trimester in extreme circumstances. Ideally, everyone who had sex would have the forethought to use reliable protection if they weren’t prepared for a child at the moment. In the real world, however, people don’t always think that far ahead. It’s a shame, but that’s where we are. We shouldn’t make a child pay for their parents’ lack of responsibility by forcing them to be born to parents who either don’t want them or just plain are unequipped to care for them. Saying that any unwanted children would just be immediately adopted is naive. There are thousands of children being cared for by the state that no one wants already. My minister friend used to say that we live in a fallen world. I think this problem is an example of that being the case. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/27 "2014-07-17T03:27:30Z")
> [@mage-girl](#): > > Saying that any unwanted children would just be immediately adopted is naive. There are thousands of children being cared for by the state that no one wants already. I personally don’t think it’s a good idea for a woman to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term just because of adoption, but as I understand it, unwanted newborns are indeed snapped up right away. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/28 "2014-07-17T03:28:15Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Sure. > > I think most people fall into this category, at least a little bit. > > This is why you hear people say they want abortions to be safe, legal and **rare**. > > I’m not religious and am pro-choice. However, it’s not like I’m cheering when I hear there’s been another abortion. To me any abortion represents a failure. Someone should have probably been on birth control. Or the birth control failed. Or they were with the wrong person and realized it too late. Or they were raped. Or something else, all of it unfortunate. > > I don’t know if I’d go quite so far as to call abortion immoral, but it’s certainly not desirable. But that doesn’t mean I want to ban it. The benefits to not having millions of unwanted kids far outweigh any queasiness I have about the morality of abortion. > > This is why I don’t often participate in abortion debates. > > * * * > > Prolifers: Abortion is murder! > > Me: So what? Even if I concede that I still think it’s a good idea to have it available because the alternative is worse. > > Prochoicers: Stop helping. > > * * * > > In a perfect world no one would need an abortion, but that’s not reality. > > It’s like soft drinks with sugar. No one should be drinking that poison. It shouldn’t even exist. But it’s not like I want to ban it. I’m not some monster like Michael Bloomberg. Thanks - you’ve very much saved me the effort of trying to phrase how I feel about it. The only thing I’d add to this - I feel that abortion is the lesser of two undesirable things the other bringing an unwanted / unaffordable kid into the world. We hear for pets, and the idea is well accepted - if you can’t commit to caring for the pet, then don’t get one - whether that pet is in a shelter, you buy it or whatever is irrelevant to the discussion, if the parent, for whatever reason, feels that are unable to care for a child, then don’t bring a child into the world. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/29 "2014-07-17T03:44:23Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Sure. > > I think most people fall into this category, at least a little bit. > > This is why you hear people say they want abortions to be safe, legal and **rare**. I don’t consider it morally wrong (you could probably come up with some scenario that I would consider morally wrong) and I still want abortion to be rare. Because it’s more dangerous, expensive, and traumatic than not being pregnant in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/30 "2014-07-17T04:02:53Z")
I think it’s it’s less morally wrong than bringing an unwanted child into the world. In my opinion, there’s not much worse than that, because of how it affects an innocent baby. There’s nothing easy about adoption and there’s a whole minefield of potentially horrendous things that can go awry. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/31 "2014-07-17T04:11:33Z")
> [@Aangelica](#): > > I do not believe the government should be making my personal moral choices for me at all - whether it be with regard to abortions or sexual fidelity or the attendance (or lack thereof) at a specific church. I am a grown adult, and therefore making my personal moral choices is up to _me_, thank you very much. > > Many, many people make choices I believe to be morally wrong (or at least questionable). This does not mean that I think the government ought to be involved in the decision-making process. > > Whether or not a specific act is moral or not is a personal one, whether we’re discussing abortion or pet adoption or charitable giving or sexting with that hot guy in the office. It is the very _definition_ of “YMMV”. I’m not even going to read any further; this is the complete answer right here. ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/32 "2014-07-17T05:55:41Z")
I’m definitely in that camp. Abortion is one of the most morally wrong things I think you can possibly do. If I think about it too much, it makes me angry. But, you know, it’s just not worth having the government legislate and enforce what I think is morally right or wrong. A lot of my current political positions are based on that nowadays. Gay marriage, legal marijuana, etc. There’s a lot of ways I support my position, including the fact that I wouldn’t like it if some other morality was legislated, so there’s no reason to expect mine to be legislated either. Laws should protect people and property… … and most of our society doesn’t see unborn babies as people. OK, fine. Do what you want. See, I’m thinking about it and I’m already upset… ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/33 "2014-07-17T12:52:37Z")
I was just at my wife’s 11 week ultrasound, and I think it’s nearly impossible for someone who is pro-choice (myself) to not have qualms after that experience. I think the pro-choice camp who would equate abortion with tonsillectomy is pretty rare and that most pro-choice people recognize that there is a degree of immorality in it. I wish everyone in the world would use birth control if they didn’t want to be pregnant, and I wish birth control was 100% effective. But, I’m glad that abortion is legal. ---
**Author:** ![JackieLikesVariety](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackielikesvariety/32/296_2.png) [@JackieLikesVariety](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JackieLikesVariety)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/34 "2014-07-17T13:05:06Z")
I am pro-choice and I do not think abortion is morally wrong. I think trying to take away women’s rights is morally wrong. and counter-productive. ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/35 "2014-07-17T13:39:46Z")
> [@Great Antibob](#): > > It’s certainly possible to be in a situation where there are no morally clean options, and I’m on board with the idea that abortion is often the least morally questionable option available. This is close to my view. I’m morally opposed to abortion, but I don’t think I could counsel someone not to have one. Especially if I’m unwilling to raise their child. I had a friend who got pregnant because she was too stupid to use birth control. Twice. Her life would have been better if she had had abortions, but she chose to keep the children, and raise them in poverty, squalor, and abuse with mentally ill, violent, or absent fathers. Instead of achieving her full potential. She lived in a state that offered free birth control to all women to combat this very thing from happening, so I’m not sure what more can be done until the ability to get pregnant is something that’s turned on, instead of turned off. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/36 "2014-07-17T15:11:43Z")
I think _some_ abortions are morally wrong. Not all of them. The person in charge of making that assessment is the pregnant person. Like all of us, she’s probably going to consider some abortions appropriate and some not. She’s the one with the most at stake when it’s her (potential / hypothetical) abortion that’s at stake. ---
**Author:** ![phouka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c5a1d2/32.png) [@phouka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phouka)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/37 "2014-07-17T15:12:04Z")
I am pro-choice. I am pro-sex ed. I am pro-subsidized birth control. I am pro-abstinence, pro-masturbation, pro-sex positive attitudes, pro-GGG, pro-porn, and pro-enthusiastic consent. I am not pro-abortion. It is far too simple-minded to say “abortion is immoral” when the spectrum of abortions and their causes is so vast. I refuse to condemn a woman for abortion when she was brought up with no information about sex, conception, or contraception and taught that sex is inherently disgusting and demeaning outside of marriage but magically transformed into a holy act when it’s done inside marriage. I refuse to condemn any woman for abortion when she’s a member of a society which believes that efforts to avoid conception are her responsibility and _only_ her responsibility. I refuse to condemn any person for abortion when the reality of bringing a child into this world means that you are more likely to be poor, sick, deprived of social connections, a victim of domestic abuse, and less likely to secure better work with better benefits. I think that if we really and truly believed abortion was immoral, we would stop wringing our hands over pictures of butchered fetuses and start addressing the reasons why there are unwanted pregnancies. If we really believe abortion is immoral, we would look at evidence-based solutions which prevent the need instead of shaming and punishing the women who seek abortion. These solutions are straight forward and unambiguous: - comprehensive, age appropriate sex education for all children - subsidized birth control, including sterilization, available to everyone, male and female - mentoring programs, faith-based and otherwise, for those at-risk of unwanted pregnancy - subsidized pre-, peri-, and post-natal care as well as maternal care - legal job protections and benefits for parents, including substantial paid and/or subsidized new parent leave of absence - subsidized day care for all pre-school children and subsidized summer day care for school aged children Most unplanned pregnancies take place because neither the man nor the woman have a competent working knowledge of how contraception works. Most women who get an abortion do so because they don’t have the financial and/or social resources to raise a child. If you want them to carry their child to term, you have to make those resources available to them. Otherwise, you’re using another person’s private tragedy to play Pharisee. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/38 "2014-07-17T15:28:11Z")
I really don’t. A few years ago I started to realize how much of the pro-choice discourse about abortion carried an undertone of ‘I’m OK with it as long as the woman feels bad’ or ‘I’m OK with it as long as the woman has an excuse that satisfies me personally’ and I realized I strongly disliked that. The pro-choice position is supposed to be choice, not justifications and guilt. I also think the pro-choice position is morally justified on its own and doesn’t need to cede the high ground that way; that strikes me as foolish. > [@Stringbean](#): > > People, particularly women, who are “adamantly” pro-choice disgust me frankly. It’d be unfair of me to say comments like this provide motivation, but it kinda does- and not because you’re calling pro-choice people disgusting. It’s not for you to say how women should think. ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/39 "2014-07-17T15:46:37Z")
In my heart I believe abortion is murder or as damn close as it can be – but I vote pro-choice as often as possible. I’m a guy and I’m never going to face any of the issues women face every day and I’m not about to force my impression of God on someone else - His relationship with you may be very different from mine. I feel best sticking to “the Great C’s” (Great Commission and Greatest Commandment) and leaving all the other details involved alone. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2014, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305/40 "2014-07-17T16:05:40Z")
If you leave your door unlocked and a thief comes in, he is still a thief and you have a moral right to defend your belongings. A fetus is another person, who has found his way into the body of a woman, and she has a moral right to say Not in my body, even if that entry is facilitated by her careless neglect. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-pro-choice-people-think-abortion-is-morally-wrong/693305.md?page=3)