# Any surveys that explore belief in the supernatural in depth? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 20, 2009, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595 "2009-07-20T05:40:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/1 "2009-07-20T05:40:51Z")
I’d be interested in seeing some polling - preferably the US but even other countries would be fine - where people were questioned about their belief in the supernatural to some detail. More specifically, I’d like to know how many people don’t believe in anything supernatural. You’ll often have people who will scoff at astrology or ghosts, but are deeply religious - or people who are atheists but believe in new age healing crystals. I’m curious to know what fraction of the population is firmly skeptical and does not believe in anything supernatural whatsoever. But it’d also be interesting to know that x% of the population believes in astrology, Y% believes in reflexology - or even more in depth like “only X% people who are religious also believe in ghosts”. Anyone know where I could go about finding out more about this? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/2 "2009-07-20T06:01:15Z")
Here ya go: [http://home.sandiego.edu/~baber/logic/gallup.html](http://home.sandiego.edu/~baber/logic/gallup.html) About a quarter of the US believes in none of the woo-woo stuff. > [@](#): > > A special analysis of the data shows that 73% of Americans believe in at least one of the 10 items listed above, while 27% believe in none of them. A Gallup survey in 2001 provided similar results – 76% professed belief in at least one of the 10 items. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/3 "2009-07-20T06:07:10Z")
But that survey does not ask about things like belief in God, or in some other deity or higher power. I’ll bet there are quite a lot of people in the US who adhere to a religion but who don’t believe in any of the supernatural stuff listed in that survey. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/4 "2009-07-20T07:35:02Z")
As for religion… This study finds no association between religion and paranormal beliefs: [Believe It or Not: Religious and Other Paranormal Beliefs in the United States on JSTOR](http://www.jstor.org/pss/1387987) But here we have a literature survey: the full article is available by clicking a link on that page: [Google Scholar](http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=4mS&num=50&q=author:%22Irwin%22+intitle:%22Belief+in+the+paranormal:+A+review+of+the+empirical+...%22+&um=1&ie=UTF-8&oi=scholarr) ## On page 13 of The Journal of the American Society for Psychical Research, Jan 1993, the author reports that some studies show a relationship between paranormal beliefs and religion, while others do not. Specific religious affiliation doesn’t seem to matter. Other correlates are reported in the article. More, from the Baylor survey of religion: > [@](#): > > During the past 63 years, several polls show the percentage of atheists has not changed at all, holding steady at only 4 percent of Americans who say they do not believe in God. Not only is atheism not growing in the United States, the majority of Europeans are not atheists (Ch. 14, “Atheism: The Godless Revolution That Never Happened”). Russia now claims 96 percent of its population believes in God, while a recent poll of China showed that atheists are outnumbered by those who believe in God(s). > > In both the 2005 and 2007 Baylor Religion Surveys, researchers found than 11 percent of the national sample reported they had “no religion.” Although nearly a third of the “no religion” group are atheists who reject “anything beyond the physical world,” the Baylor Religion Survey found that two-thirds of the “no religion” group expressed some belief in God and many of those are not “irreligious” but are merely “unchurched” (Ch. 17, “The Irreligious: Simply Unchurched-Not Atheists”). Delving into the actual religiousness of those who report having no religion, the Baylor Survey found that a majority of Americans who claim to be irreligious pray (and 32 percent pray often), around a third of them profess belief in Satan, hell and demons, and around half believe in angels and ghosts. [http://www.baylor.edu/pr/news.php?action=story&story=52815](http://www.baylor.edu/pr/news.php?action=story&story=52815) So about 4% of all Americans are atheists. Separating out that group from the merely unreligious requires some care when evaluating other beliefs in the paranormal. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/5 "2009-07-20T07:55:40Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I’d be interested in seeing some polling - preferably the US but even other countries would be fine - where people were questioned about their belief in the supernatural to some detail . . . But it’d also be interesting to know that x% of the population believes in astrology, Y% believes in reflexology - or even more in depth like “only X% people who are religious also believe in ghosts”. You’d need to think carefully about what exactly you are measuring here. I’m open to correction, but so far as I know adherents of reflexology do not assert any belief in the supernatural. They assert that reflexology is a natural art – i.e. it studies and exploits natural processes and natural bodily phenonoma, even if those processes and phenomena are not fully understood. No supernatural reality is asserted. The same would be true of something like ESP – we may not understand how consciousness can is transferred between individuals, but that does not mean that those who believe that it is transferred assert that this happens by supernatural means. In other words, you need to distinguish between beliefs which – you may feel – are not adequately supported by the evidence and beliefs which assert the reality of the supernatural. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/6 "2009-07-20T08:33:45Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Here ya go: > [http://home.sandiego.edu/~baber/logic/gallup.html](http://home.sandiego.edu/~baber/logic/gallup.html) About a quarter of the US believes in none of the woo-woo stuff. Cool. This is the sort of thing I’m looking for. > [@mhendo](#): > > But that survey does not ask about things like belief in God, or in some other deity or higher power. I’ll bet there are quite a lot of people in the US who adhere to a religion but who don’t believe in any of the supernatural stuff listed in that survey. Yeah, I’m especially interested in the interrelation between religion and non-religious beliefs in the supernatural. I’d be especially interested if the survey posted above accounted for any religious beliefs as a supernatural belief, and what that would reduce the number of people who didn’t subscribe to any of the listed supernatural beliefs to. > [@UDS](#): > > You’d need to think carefully about what exactly you are measuring here. I’m open to correction, but so far as I know adherents of reflexology do not assert any belief in the supernatural. They assert that reflexology is a natural art – i.e. it studies and exploits natural processes and natural bodily phenonoma, even if those processes and phenomena are not fully understood. No supernatural reality is asserted. The same would be true of something like ESP – we may not understand how consciousness can is transferred between individuals, but that does not mean that those who believe that it is transferred assert that this happens by supernatural means. > > In other words, you need to distinguish between beliefs which – you may feel – are not adequately supported by the evidence and beliefs which assert the reality of the supernatural. I can see where you’re coming from and I should’ve picked a better example than reflexology. Offhand, I thought reflexology was a form of vitalism - the manipulation of a (supernatural?) “life energy” - but that may be mistaken. On the issue of ESP, the distinction becomes fuzzier. They may assert there’s some yet as unyet discovered biological or physical mechanism, but what they advocate is practically magic. I’m especially interested in supernatural beliefs, but I’d also be interested in data in arguably non-supernatural, yet still pseudoscientific belief. ---
**Author:** ![Reno\_Nevada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Reno\_Nevada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reno_Nevada)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/7 "2009-07-20T16:25:25Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I’m especially interested in supernatural beliefs, but I’d also be interested in data in arguably non-supernatural, yet still pseudoscientific belief. I don’t have an answer for the underlying question, but I think there is a continuum from something like Reiki (healing energy) through homeopathy (psuedoscientific jargon) to chiropractic (mechanism to do **something** , but not as much as the advocates claim). ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/8 "2009-07-20T23:12:42Z")
> [@Reno\_Nevada](#): > > I don’t have an answer for the underlying question, but I think there is a continuum from something like Reiki (healing energy) through homeopathy (psuedoscientific jargon) to chiropractic (mechanism to do **something** , but not as much as the advocates claim). I think any skeptic has a good sense of what qualifies as pseudoscience or supernatural - they all share a certain mentality among their practitioners - sort of the conspiracy theory mindset where any objections you have make you part of the conspiracy, they become immune to facts or evidence, etc. The stuff has no evidence for actually working and is presented to people in generally the same way. Chiropractic is something of a weird case because it’s based on sublimation theory, which is vitalism - but not all practioners believe in it. Some feel more like they’re simply physical therapists for backs. But they don’t receive legitimate medical training or certification, and the evidence for their effect is dubious. Still, some end up actually managing to do some sort term good. But homeopathy, any sort of healing energy (crystals, therapeutic touch, acupuncture, etc), ghosts, astrology, etc - they all come from the same sort of mental weakness, even if their exact purported mechanism can vary. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/9 "2009-07-20T23:30:01Z")
> [@](#): > > Chiropractic is something of a weird case because it’s based on sublimation theory, which is vitalism - but not all practioners believe in it. Some feel more like they’re simply physical therapists for backs. But they don’t receive legitimate medical training or certification, and the evidence for their effect is dubious. Still, some end up actually managing to do some sort term good. Correction: They’re not required to receive medical training or certification, but some do anyway. Really, what the profession needs is for the legitimate practitioners (and there are a few) to take a stand against the quacks amongst them. Another caveat with surveys like this is that what constitutes “belief” can vary from person to person, or from idea to idea. Consider a pure Deist, for example, who believes that God exists and created the Universe, but that He has not meddled at all in it since its creation. Does such a belief qualify as “supernatural”? Or what about someone who thinks that leprechauns probably don’t exist, but hasn’t completely ruled out the possibility? Does that count as “belief”? ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/10 "2009-07-21T01:51:25Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I think any skeptic has a good sense of what qualifies as pseudoscience or supernatural - they all share a certain mentality among their practitioners - sort of the conspiracy theory mindset where any objections you have make you part of the conspiracy, they become immune to facts or evidence, etc. The stuff has no evidence for actually working and is presented to people in generally the same way . . . I’d be less than impressed with a sceptic who lumped “pseudoscience or supernatural” together as a single category. They are quite different – indeed, strictly speaking, mutually exclusive – categories. Science is the study of the natural universe, and pseudoscience makes the claim that what it studies is natural. Whereas the supernatural, as the name suggests, is something outside the natural. I see no reason to expect any correlation, positive or negative, between belief in pseudoscience and belief in the supernatural. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/11 "2009-07-21T03:22:34Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > I’d be less than impressed with a sceptic who lumped “pseudoscience or supernatural” together as a single category. They are quite different – indeed, strictly speaking, mutually exclusive – categories. Science is the study of the natural universe, and pseudoscience makes the claim that what it studies is natural. Whereas the supernatural, as the name suggests, is something outside the natural. > > I see no reason to expect any correlation, positive or negative, between belief in pseudoscience and belief in the supernatural. I disagree entirely. First, often they overlap. Are those “ghost hunters” running around with magnetic field detectors people who believe in psuedoscience or the supernatural? They claim that using technological gadgets and talking about “energy fields” and such makes them scientists, but they’re chasing ghosts, which are clearly supernatural. What’s astrology? Could it be pseudoscience because they attempt to describe a system of predictions which they falsely believe to be methodologically scientific? Or is it supernatural because there’s no scientific mechanism by which the things they measure could have any meaningful effect on people? Are you seriously suggesting that the people who believe in bigfoot, UFOs, and free energy machines have no overlap between the people that believe in ghosts, psychics, and faith healing? They all have the same cause - a credulous mind. Where the desire to believe in something fantastic, to see whatever hidden meaning you want in a chaotic existance, overrides your need for credible evidence for your beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/12 "2009-07-22T10:07:10Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > So about 4% of all Americans are atheists. Separating out that group from the merely unreligious requires some care when evaluating other beliefs in the paranormal. It always amazes me to see this number. 4%. 1 out of 25 people. Just bizarre to me. I wonder what the percentage of people is where religion plays pretty much no role in their life, but they’re afraid to admit that they’re atheists because they think it’s somehow a dirty word, or if they’re playing some sort of pascal’s wager where they don’t want to fully admit no belief in god just in case, even though that’s how they run their life. I wonder, then, among atheists, how many don’t believe in the paranormal. It seems intuitive to me that anyone who’d rationally shrugged off religion would be more likely to shrug off any sort of claim without evidence - but personally I’ve seen lots of atheists who seem to fill the religion hole in their life with new agey stuff. If 4% of is our starting point, I wonder how many of those are entirely and consistently skeptical. Half? A small fraction? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/13 "2009-07-22T13:01:59Z")
> [@](#): > > …the Baylor Survey found that a majority of Americans who claim to be irreligious pray (and 32 percent pray often), around a third of them profess belief in Satan, hell and demons, and around half believe in angels… That is _seriously_ weird. How is this explicable? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/14 "2009-07-22T17:40:03Z")
“Irreligious” can just mean that they don’t adhere to any _organized_ religion. There’s still plenty of room there for disorganized belief and/or worship. ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-surveys-that-explore-belief-in-the-supernatural-in-depth/503595/15 "2009-07-22T18:29:15Z")
I remember the Wall Street Journal referencing such a study- it said that secular people are _more_ likely to believe psuedoscience. The WSJ does have an agenda when it comes to religion, but I can see the logic of it: a defined belief system will exclude things outside the system, with no wiggle room. If Sally truely believes that when people die they go straight to the next world, then she will not believe in ghosts. Whereas someone with a more nebulous belief system would be open to anything.