# Any Trump supporters here? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 23, 2015, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349 "2015-09-23T22:34:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Stoneburg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@Stoneburg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoneburg)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/61 "2015-09-30T15:31:58Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Actually the most ideologically consistent racists are not patriots or nationalists since they elevate the supremacy of race over that of country. Interesting. Well I guess a white supremacist born in a non-white country would be unlikely to be a patriot. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/62 "2015-09-30T18:03:59Z")
The apartheid-supporting whites in South Africa would have challenged that point. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/63 "2015-09-30T18:08:38Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > Because in the liberal mind, there is no difference between racism and patriotism. Another supposed mind-reader of liberals… what’s the deal with all these conservative psychics? And why are they so terrible at it? ---
**Author:** ![Stoneburg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@Stoneburg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoneburg)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/64 "2015-09-30T18:55:42Z")
I actually had a dream about mr Trump tonight. Very weird… We were a group of people traveling in two cars, where I was in the front car with three other people. When we stopped at a rest stop Donald who was obviously traveling in the car behind us came over and offered everyone in my car a nice pastry, and I ended up switching cars to ride in his. He was very nice and happy. Somehow this ended with us arriving at a place where mr Trump was shot in the forehead by someone, and I had to apply first aid bandaging his head. He was unconscious but apparently not dead, and we were getting him to a hospital when I woke up. Does attempting to rescue him in a dream count as being a supporter? It was trés strange… ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/65 "2015-09-30T19:40:54Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Hmm. I am not solely responsible for countering his popularity. But I can’t help the way I feel, and if you are going to sit there and honestly try to tell me a significant portion of Trump supporters are not racist, I am simply not going to believe you. > [@inscrutable](#): > > Because in the liberal mind, there is no difference between racism and patriotism. It is certainly the case that a significant portion of Trump supporters are racists – in fact, [the organized White Nationalists are positively excited to have found their man in him](http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/08/31/the-fearful-and-the-frustrated). > [@](#): > > When the Trump storm broke this summer, it touched off smaller tempests that stirred up American politics in ways that were easy to miss from afar. At the time, I happened to be reporting on extremist white-rights groups, and observed at first hand their reactions to his candidacy. Trump was advancing a dire portrait of immigration that partly overlapped with their own. On June 28th, twelve days after Trump’s announcement, the Daily Stormer, America’s most popular neo-Nazi news site, endorsed him for President: “Trump is willing to say what most Americans think: it’s time to deport these people.” The Daily Stormer urged white men to “vote for the first time in our lives for the one man who actually represents our interests.” > > Ever since the Tea Party’s peak, in 2010, and its fade, citizens on the American far right—Patriot militias, border vigilantes, white supremacists—have searched for a standard-bearer, and now they’d found him. In the past, “white nationalists,” as they call themselves, had described Trump as a “Jew-lover,” but the new tone of his campaign was a revelation. Richard Spencer is a self-described “identitarian” who lives in Whitefish, Montana, and promotes “white racial consciousness.” At thirty-six, Spencer is trim and preppy, with degrees from the University of Virginia and the University of Chicago. He is the president and director of the National Policy Institute, a think tank, co-founded by William Regnery, a member of the conservative publishing family, that is “dedicated to the heritage, identity, and future of European people in the United States and around the world.” The Southern Poverty Law Center calls Spencer “a suit-and-tie version of the white supremacists of old.” Spencer told me that he had expected the Presidential campaign to be an “amusing freak show,” but that Trump was “refreshing.” He went on, “Trump, on a gut level, kind of senses that this is about demographics, ultimately. We’re moving into a new America.” He said, “I don’t think Trump is a white nationalist,” but he did believe that Trump reflected “an unconscious vision that white people have—that their grandchildren might be a hated minority in their own country. I think that scares us. They probably aren’t able to articulate it. I think it’s there. I think that, to a great degree, explains the Trump phenomenon. I think he is the one person who can tap into it.” > > Jared Taylor, the editor of American Renaissance, a white-nationalist magazine and Web site based in Oakton, Virginia, told me, in regard to Trump, “I’m sure he would repudiate any association with people like me, but his support comes from people who are more like me than he might like to admit.” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/66 "2015-09-30T19:43:03Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > Because in the liberal mind, there is no difference between racism and patriotism. There is certainly a difference between patriotism and nativism, and Trump’s appeal is mainly to the latter. ---
**Author:** ![inscrutable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a88e4f/32.png) [@inscrutable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inscrutable)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/67 "2015-09-30T22:19:26Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > There is certainly a difference between patriotism and nativism, and Trump’s appeal is mainly to the latter. Do you hate America, or just the white people whose ancestors worked, fought, and died to create and defend it? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2015, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/68 "2015-09-30T22:27:14Z")
This is not going to end well, is it? ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/69 "2015-10-01T00:04:26Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > Do you hate America, or just the white people whose ancestors worked, fought, and died to create and defend it? I don’t know. Have you stopped beating your wife? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/70 "2015-10-01T00:21:51Z")
Kinda depends. Some of my ancestors fought and died killing _each other_ for this great and wonderful country. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/71 "2015-10-01T00:28:55Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > There is certainly a difference between patriotism and nativism… To quote old Karl — and however much of the Adversary he was part of, one loves him for it — when someone, may have been Liebknecht, remarked as they were out on a stroll, that as he got older, he hated less and less: “Really ? _Really_ ?” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/72 "2015-10-01T01:20:59Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > Do you hate America, or just the white people whose ancestors worked, fought, and died to create and defend it? ☹ Do I have to **choose?!** ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/73 "2015-10-01T01:24:23Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > I don’t know. Have you stopped beating your wife? :mad: I’ll stop beating her when she wises up, thank you very much! ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/74 "2015-10-01T01:34:53Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > Do you hate America, or just the white people whose ancestors worked, fought, and died to create and defend it? Are we talking about the ones who invaded Canada and Mexico? The ones who performed genocide on the Indians? The ones who fought to support slavery? None of them were my ancestors. ---
**Author:** ![Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/regallag_the_axe/32/445_2.png) [@Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Regallag_The_Axe)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/75 "2015-10-01T05:24:50Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > And actually, when there’s any change at all, [people tend to become more liberal as they age](http://news.discovery.com/human/psychology/voter-conservative-aging-liberal-120119.htm). > [@Claverhouse](#): > > To quote old Karl — and however much of the Adversary he was part of, one loves him for it — when someone, may have been Liebknecht, remarked as they were out on a stroll, that as he got older, he hated less and less: > > “Really ? _Really_ ?” I don’t want to continue the hijack, but… The two don’t have to be mutually exclusive. A man I greatly respect once said, “As I’ve gotten older I’ve become more tolerant but less patient.” ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/76 "2015-10-01T07:28:46Z")
The Marxian reminisce was not in reference to that but to BrainGlutton’s spurious assertion of difference between nativism and patriotism. Which may be imaginary things but which are deadly. Actually nativism is the more reasonable, since tribes exist; whereas counties do not even exist in the abstract except as forms of convenience. Actually the old are divided into two camps: those who lose fire for the things they once held dear; and those now freed from the conventions — the last ranging from ordinary politeness to bladder control in old people’s homes. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/77 "2015-10-01T09:27:04Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > Actually nativism is the more reasonable, since tribes exist; whereas counties do not even exist in the abstract except as forms of convenience. Nativism, in this context, just means being anti-immigrant. He’s contrasting it with patriotism, which can easily embrace immigration. What patriotism I have definitely does. I’m also not clear what you meant when saying “countries do not even exist in the abstract.” A country is a political entity, defined by geographical location. They are usually (but not always) autonomously governed. In other words, the fact that we have the federal government shows that the U.S. is a country. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/78 "2015-10-01T09:41:46Z")
Unlike a person, a state is protean and abstract since it can command but is infinitely changeable; a country is protean and purely imaginary since it’s borders, peoples, will, beliefs and desires are not only changeable, but exist solely in the onlooker’s mind. Usually interpreted as conforming exactly to the onlooker’s fondest likings. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/79 "2015-10-01T10:11:36Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > The tide turning against the TP is generational-cultural attrition. It is inevitable and inexorable and irreversible. But it works slooooow. You have an optimistic view of the young, which I envy you. When I was young in the 60s I figured our generation would put an end to the extreme right in time. As if! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2015, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/any-trump-supporters-here/732349/80 "2015-10-01T14:29:11Z")
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