# Anybody care to predict the grade this paper will receive? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 16, 2009, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668 "2009-05-16T18:36:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/81 "2009-05-19T21:13:56Z")
> [@Death\_of\_Rats](#): > > how many if you count in base 6? Anywhere between 4 and 11, obviously. Are you new to base six? But to explain: I have four sisters who all share the same mother and father as me. I also have one half-sister; we share only a father. My best friend from elementary school and the best friend of my poetry-hating sister both called my mother Mama. All of my siblings (with the possible exception of my half-sister, whom I don’t know well) consider them siblings; they’re both in the holiday-feast hosting rotations, they both sent my mom Mother’s Day cards, and at family weddings it’s understood that they’re to be included in the immediate-family-only photos. So at least four, perhaps as many as seven. I’d say six, personally, but my four indisputable sisters insist that our half-sister has to be counted too. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/82 "2009-05-19T21:19:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Probably better, actually, since the movie version of _The Hobbit_ contains at least some of Tolkien’s original poetry, and Tolkien’s poetry is influenced to at least some degree by the poetry of _Beowulf_. She’d still be much better off with, say, Theoden’s eulogy than with “Far over Misty Mountains cold”, but at least it’d be a step in the right direction. > > I’m actually less concerned about the fact that she was trying to fake it by watching a movie instead of reading, than I am about the fact that she thought that would be effective in this particular case. Questions about the plot of _Beowulf_, yeah, it’s at least reasonable to expect that that might be similar in the book and movie, but about the poetic forms? Huh? Especially since the teacher probably chose that topic specifically to weed out the movie-watchers. Here’s what I think happened: My sister, who is a helicopter mom, always intended to horn in heavily on this assignment, just as she does virtually all the work on all the (award-winning! :mad:) science fair projects. Knowing this, my niece didn’t trouble to read the assignment carefully and thought it would be a paper she/they could bullshit their way through rather than basically a take-home test with questions like “Name seven kennings used in Beowulf. Each must refer to a different element–that is, a different character, location, idea, etc. Explain the meaning and symbolism behind that kenning.” My sister, being busy with work and facilitiating academic dishonesty, didn’t realize this until after they had watched the movie Saturday night. ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/83 "2009-05-19T21:44:05Z")
Out of curiosity, how long does your sister intend to do this? Through high school? Through college? Will your niece be including her mother in the work she brings home once she’s got her first real job? What’s her goal? If her daughter never learns to do the thinking and the work on her own, what happens when she’s inevitably on her own without the skills and education she should have developed over the years? What’s your sister’s strategy? She’s clearly going to a lot of time and trouble here, but where does she see this leading? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/84 "2009-05-19T21:51:41Z")
> [@shantih](#): > > Out of curiosity, how long does your sister intend to do this? Through high school? Through college? Will your niece be including her mother in the work she brings home once she’s got her first real job? > > What’s her goal? If her daughter never learns to do the thinking and the work on her own, what happens when she’s inevitably on her own without the skills and education she should have developed over the years? > > What’s your sister’s strategy? She’s clearly going to a lot of time and trouble here, but where does she see this leading? I have no idea. But she can’t keep it up, if only because she’s not math or science oriented and my our baby sister, my older brother, and I all refuse to abet it anymore. My favorite niece may still be at it, but only because she’s very bright, proud to call herself a nerd, and always looking for something to do; she’d do a science fair project she wasn’t assigned just for the challenge. When she was, oh, twelve or so, she used to come to me and ask me to make up algebra and geometry problems she could do for fun. But enough boasting about her. I’m not sure how long my sister can keep this up, and not sure when she or my niece will realize what a disservice they’ve done to her education. And my favorite niece, bright as she is, isn’t about to with English or history assignments. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2009, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/85 "2009-06-01T14:49:43Z")
Justice would be the niece gets an F, and when mom complains, he fails her too. Sadly, it’s hard to flunk a parent. I do find it slightly amusing that they watched the movie and then discovered it was useless, and both of them stayed up all night on the test/report. But your sister is pathetic. And your niece is royally screwed. She should be using high school to develop the study habits and skills she will need to succeed in college and life. Her mom is sabotaging her future under the guise of helping her. That’s just sad. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2009, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/86 "2009-06-01T14:53:26Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > Justice would be the niece gets an F, and when mom complains, he fails her too. Sadly, it’s hard to flunk a parent. > > I do find it slightly amusing that they watched the movie and then discovered it was useless, and both of them stayed up all night on the test/report. > > But your sister is pathetic. And your niece is royally screwed. She should be using high school to develop the study habits and skills she will need to succeed in college and life. Her mom is sabotaging her future under the guise of helping her. That’s just sad. Since someone else bumped the thread: She ultimately got a C on the assignment, which dropped her grade for the class down to a B. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2009, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/87 "2009-06-01T15:11:44Z")
I just want to know how good that copy of Star Trek was. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2009, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/88 "2009-06-01T17:25:05Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Since someone else bumped the thread: > > She ultimately got a C on the assignment, which dropped her grade for the class down to a B. Can you find out if the teacher wrote any notes on the paper, or if s/he just graded it from the video? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2009, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/89 "2009-06-01T19:38:58Z")
> [@ShibbOleth](#): > > Can you find out if the teacher wrote any notes on the paper, or if s/he just graded it from the video? You may have missed an earlier update, so I’ll recap. After they watched the movie, my sister actually read the assignment, which was more of a take-home test. There were specific questions like “name three kennings used for the sea in Beowulf” and so forth–things with concrete answers you could not simply bullshit your way through, and for which the movie was completely unhelpful. I expect they ended up using Cliff Notes or whatever. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2009, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/90 "2009-06-01T19:48:37Z")
So, speaking of kennings, I was reading about a few of them, and apparently, “onion of war” was a kenning used for “sword”. WTF was that all about? ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2009, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/91 "2009-06-01T20:35:04Z")
Getting stabbed makes you cry? ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/92 "2009-06-02T00:55:21Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Seriously, dude, what the hell is your problem? > > I’m not repeating something that a friend of a friend told me his cousin heard about. I repeated, somewhat sheepishly, something that I myself did. > > I don’t recall ever hearing about such an instance of academic wiggling before college. It was just something I had in mind to do if I ever really needed to, which I decided was practical only because of the lack of blue book use and the small size of the liberal arts faculty at my college making it possible for me to get a rep for being anal retentive in that particular way. > > It would never have worked in the business school, which is where I really needed it more than once. I waited as long as I did because, hell, I was an upperclassman and wanted to see if it would work. I figured the worst thing that could happen would be the teacher making me take the test over again, and by that time I knew that this teacher was the only one who’d fall for it. Additionally, it’s a pretty obvious technique. I came up with it independently at university well before Snopes as well… ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/93 "2009-06-02T01:15:36Z")
> [@Ogre](#): > > So, speaking of kennings, I was reading about a few of them, and apparently, “onion of war” was a kenning used for “sword”. > > WTF was that all about? WAG – one ingredient to throw into the stewpot of war. ---
**Author:** ![zagloba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/977dab/32.png) [@zagloba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zagloba)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/94 "2009-06-02T02:06:03Z")
> [@Ogre](#): > > So, speaking of kennings, I was reading about a few of them, and apparently, “onion of war” was a kenning used for “sword”. > > WTF was that all about? “I tied an onion to my belt, which was the fashion at the time” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/95 "2009-06-02T07:35:28Z")
My advice on your niece and her mother: it’s not so much the child you need to watch your back around, but the mother. I learned this reading Beowulf. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/96 "2009-06-02T11:04:13Z")
Beowulf was a book!!!1111!!! Kidding. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/97 "2009-06-02T11:05:42Z")
**Skald** When the paper is done, do what you have to do and scan it for all of us to peruse it. ---
**Author:** ![Wheelz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wheelz/32/5718_2.png) [@Wheelz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wheelz)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/98 "2009-06-02T13:49:21Z")
**Skald** , after the OP I was going to ask if your sister and niece might just be having a laugh at your expense… They had to know how effectively this scenario would push your buttons. Sadly, after reading the rest of the thread I can be fairly sure that’s not the case. Not having kids myself, I’m not in a position to judge. I’ll just say I don’t understand helicopter parenting. My folks never did it, and I don’t recall any of my friends’ parents being like that. Are times really that different now? I like to think I turned out fairly OK, and in fact screwing up from time to time probably did me some good in the long run. I don’t see what kind of favor these parents think they’re doing for their kids. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/99 "2009-06-02T14:19:01Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Heh–the only paper I nearly failed in high school was _because_ I’d read the source material. We were supposed to write a research paper on an author and quote from at least three sources about the author. I reluctantly dug up three critics’ takes on Vonnegut and put their quotes in, but the bulk of the paper was my (adolescent) analysis of themes in Vonnegut. > > The teacher called me in for a conference explaining that I hadn’t really fulfilled the assignment. It wasn’t until she realized that I’d never read Vonnegut before and had read 10 of his novels in the course of researching him that she relented. > > She wasn’t my favorite teacher. I don’t get it. What exactly was she saying you did wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2009, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668/100 "2009-06-02T14:35:16Z")
> [@Shirley\_Ujest](#): > > **Skald** When the paper is done, do what you have to do and scan it for all of us to peruse it. The assignment’s turned in and graded, Shirley, as school’s out this week. (And maybe was last week, but I’m not sure of the schedule these days.) I’m not sure whether she got it back. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-care-to-predict-the-grade-this-paper-will-receive/496668.md?page=6)