# Anybody else jumping on the Zeitgeist bandwagon? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 2, 2012, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138 "2012-08-02T02:45:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/61 "2012-08-02T22:28:06Z")
:smack: [QUOTE=XT] Hell, look at those mad idiots in North Vietnam as an example. How would getting rid of evil capitalism fix the problem, even if we had magic production? [/QUOTE] Gods know why I typed ‘North Vietnam’ there. Obviously, I meant ‘North Korea’. That’s what I get for posting from my iPad and on the run. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/62 "2012-08-02T22:32:16Z")
Ya know, I don’t think I was thinking big enough. In magictopia I don’t just want beachfront property, I want my own private island along with a private, underwater maglev tube to transport me to the mainland for wild parties. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/63 "2012-08-02T22:35:24Z")
Huh…I always wanted to have a multitude of scantily clad love muffins throwing little pickles at me while I’m standing on a large pyramid in my sun god robes… I can get that, right? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/64 "2012-08-02T22:39:27Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > You’re still ignoring the main counterargument - how do we transition to this system. Your argument seems to be that if we start acting as if we live in a post-scarcity world, we will somehow magically achieve a post-scarcity world. You really haven’t addressed how, as a society, we make that transition. Yeah, that’s been my biggest problem with these people. I find it perfectly believable that we can eventually have a more-or-less post scarcity\* society; but we have to _get there_ somehow. They seem to think we can build everything from advanced AI to an automatic economy by sheer willpower, without all that tedious research and experimentation and development. \*By that I mean some things like particular plots of land or original artworks are by nature scarce, and no economy could keep up with _literally_ unlimited demand. But I do think that a sufficiently advanced and automated economy could supply everyone with whatever they want _within reason_. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/65 "2012-08-02T22:39:32Z")
Once the Zeitgeist Bowel Movement really gathers steam, we can all have whatever we want. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/66 "2012-08-02T22:45:01Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Huh…I always wanted to have a multitude of scantily clad love muffins throwing little pickles at me while I’m standing on a large pyramid in my sun god robes… > > I can get that, right? With advanced enough technology, sure; they’d just be androids or virtual reality simulations. Right now…well, I’m sure we could produce a bevy of (creepy, uncanny-valley dwelling) computerized sex dolls with built in pickle guns. And you’d have to find your own pyramid. “Hi…there…stud…muffin…_click_” _\_ ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/67 "2012-08-02T22:49:27Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Once the Zeitgeist Bowel Movement really gathers steam, we can all have whatever we want. [That’ll be one hell of a bowel movement.](http://www.comedycentral.com/video-clips/y3omtb/futurama-bowel-battle) ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/68 "2012-08-02T22:51:18Z")
I said earlier that I realized this was a fantasy. In fact, I am 99% sure I will never see it in my lifetime. However, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be talking about it. I mean the point is to bring awareness. Most people don’t even seem to consider this type of thing. They’re too caught up in reality. I would think the trainsition to this type of thing would be gradual where we continually create abundance and focus less and less on money. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/69 "2012-08-02T23:09:36Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > Most people don’t even seem to consider this type of thing. They’re too caught up in reality. I have never wanted to use another poster’s text as my signature, but I’m seriously tempted by this. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/70 "2012-08-02T23:18:44Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > I said earlier that I realized this was a fantasy. In fact, I am 99% sure I will never see it in my lifetime. However, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be talking about it. We are talking about it. We’re pointing out the great whopping holes in it. Honestly, if you expect something to work, then you need to first find the holes in it and then figure out how to plug them. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/71 "2012-08-02T23:19:47Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Huh…I always wanted to have a multitude of scantily clad love muffins throwing little pickles at me while I’m standing on a large pyramid in my sun god robes… > > I can get that, right? Eventually. But in the beta testing phase, there may be a problem with the velocity of the pickles. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/72 "2012-08-03T00:57:21Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > I have never wanted to use another poster’s text as my signature, but I’m seriously tempted by this. Go ahead. I would be honored. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/73 "2012-08-03T01:50:28Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Eventually. But in the beta testing phase, there may be a problem with the velocity of the pickles. They finally fixed the “supersonic death pickles” bug in 2.2.3, but being hit by one while wearing sun god robes still makes you clip through walls. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/74 "2012-08-03T02:00:02Z")
Ok so everybody had their fun picking apart my vision. And thats fine I realize its unrealistic. But who here has considered the implications of capitalism? I mean we have war, huge income inequality, pollution, climate change, inefficiency, scarcity, Billions starving, millions dying, waste of life, a whole culture centered around competition that breeds distrust. I mean look at patents. We pay money to own information for the well-being of a few. When it could be shared and built upon for the benefit of everybody. Where’s your criticism for the status quo? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/75 "2012-08-03T02:11:55Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > But who here has considered the implications of capitalism? > > I mean we have war, huge income inequality, pollution, climate change, inefficiency, scarcity, Billions starving, millions dying, waste of life, a whole culture centered around competition that breeds distrust. Why are these things the fault of capitalism? > [@](#): > > I mean look at patents. We pay money to own information for the well-being of a few. When it could be shared and built upon for the benefit of everybody. The purpose of patents is to encourage invention, innovation, progress. Which is kinda necessary for your vision to be realized. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/76 "2012-08-03T02:38:16Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > Ok so everybody had their fun picking apart my vision. And thats fine I realize its unrealistic. But who here has considered the implications of capitalism? > > I mean we have war, huge income inequality, pollution, climate change, inefficiency, scarcity, Billions starving, millions dying, waste of life, a whole culture centered around competition that breeds distrust. Not a one of these things is unique to capitalism or even modern society. Honestly, you sound extremely uninformed and uneducated about the World and specifically, economics. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/77 "2012-08-03T02:39:08Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Why are these things the fault of capitalism? > > The purpose of patents is to encourage invention, innovation, progress. Which is kinda necessary for your vision to be realized. Reality check. We live in a capitalist system and these are the problems we face. As for the patents, maybe that was a bad example. I don’t really know. Let’s let that one go. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/78 "2012-08-03T02:40:20Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > Reality check. We live in a capitalist system and these are the problems we face. And we would face them under every other government and economic system that has ever been tried as well. As we most certainly have. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/79 "2012-08-03T02:45:55Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > As for the patents, maybe that was a bad example. I don’t really know. Let’s let that one go. Do you realize that it’s obvious to everybody that you don’t have a reasoned argument and you’re clutching at straws? In short, you’ve come up with a conclusion and now you’re trying to find facts to fit it. That’s backwards. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138/80 "2012-08-03T02:47:53Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > And we would face them under every other government and economic system that has ever been tried as well. Well, no; there _have_ been extremely egalitarian societies where competition and material inequality were pretty much nonexistent. And climate change is new, and of course we by definition couldn’t have _had_ “billions starving” before our population passed 2 billion. Not that that many people _are_ actually starving, fortunately. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-else-jumping-on-the-zeitgeist-bandwagon/630138.md?page=5)