# Anybody willing to admit that HIS side is crueler in the sex wars? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 9, 2006, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737 "2006-03-09T20:37:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/1 "2006-03-09T20:37:37Z")
I have a female friend who always complains that men are so cruel, but from my POV, women are alot harsher towards men in regard to superficial criticism. Case in point, [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7173715&postcount=6) post gave me the idea for this thread, where a poster named the “most unattractive man” she could think of by name, and disected the failings of his appearance in a completely matter-of-fact way. Also, in [recent news](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/02/26/AR2006022601095.html), there’s the story of that group of women who bond over sharing the same sperm doner. Even the lesbians in that story employed a high-school-esque criteria in chosing a stud. Tall (6’4"), athletic, and Caucasian of a direct heritage (German). One woman even flat out states that his athleticism was much more important than intelligence. Why, we even had a lesbian poster on [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=269043) years ago who expressed bubble-headed frustration at the fact that her tall, athletic, European doner’s sperm was snatched up by someone else (bubble-headed because she seemed to think that her preferences were unique). Reducing the value of a man down to purely physical stats seems pretty harsh, and its all done so matter-of-factly from these people in a way I’ve never seen from a man. Anyway, examples of superficiality isn’t the point. AFAIK, most people think that other sex is crueler, and that they have to put up with worse than the other side does. What I want to know is does anyone think his or her own sex harsher to the other side, in general, than vice-versa, or are we all wrought with tunnel vision, inflating offenses to us and downplaying those to the other side? ---
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/2 "2006-03-09T20:39:23Z")
And I hope nobody jumps down my throat for merely admitting to the existance of a sex war… ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/3 "2006-03-09T20:51:48Z")
I opened the thread with what I thought of as a meaningful reply already forming in my head…but all your examples seem to pertain to sex objectification (“lookism”). Is it your intention to confine discussion of what you term “the sex wars” to the business of selecting mates (dates, sperm donors, whatever) on the basis of visual appearance? That’s certainly not the centerpiece of what I think of as “the sex wars”. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/4 "2006-03-09T20:52:28Z")
Gay men win hands down. ---
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/5 "2006-03-09T21:06:12Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > I opened the thread with what I thought of as a meaningful reply already forming in my head…but all your examples seem to pertain to sex objectification (“lookism”). Is it your intention to confine discussion of what you term “the sex wars” to the business of selecting mates (dates, sperm donors, whatever) on the basis of visual appearance? That’s certainly not the centerpiece of what I think of as “the sex wars”. Yeah, I was soley talking about objectification, but it can be expanded. What you you think of being the centerpiece of the sex wars? Economics? Can “cruelty” describe the economic disparity between the sexes? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/6 "2006-03-09T21:16:24Z")
… I don’t think either side is crueler. It’s individuals; sometimes it’s moments; sometimes combinations of individuals. I know utter fucks in both genders and all kind of sexual orientations. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/7 "2006-03-09T21:42:42Z")
> [@pizzabrat](#): > > Reducing the value of a man down to purely physical stats seems pretty harsh, and its all done so matter-of-factly from these people in a way I’ve never seen from a man. Hmmm…I wonder who coined “36-24-36”? Apparently it’s a scientific fact that a ratio of 1.5 between the proportions is most desirable and who’s in charge of science? Could it be…MEN? j/k But I would agree with **Nava**. I don’t think any generalizations can be made. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/8 "2006-03-09T21:53:38Z")
::SHRUG:: I’ve known some cruel men, I’ve known some cruel women. I know some kind men, I know some kind women. People can be cruel. ---
**Author:** ![MissMossie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@MissMossie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MissMossie)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/9 "2006-03-09T21:59:29Z")
Is the gender specific pronoun in the subject on purpose? Are you only looking for men to admit that their side is crueler? As far as who is actually crueler, I’m with the past three posters, I don’t think you can make generalizations of either side. ---
**Author:** ![Anastasaeon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Anastasaeon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anastasaeon)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/10 "2006-03-09T22:54:57Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > … I don’t think either side is crueler. > > It’s individuals; sometimes it’s moments; sometimes combinations of individuals. > > I know utter fucks in both genders and all kind of sexual orientations. This is the answer. I agree. There is no “side”, there are no “wars”, only in some people’s heads. They are the people that perpetuate the myth, while the rest of us deal with people on an individual basis. ---
**Author:** ![Gozu\_Tashoya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/7993a0/32.png) [@Gozu\_Tashoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gozu_Tashoya)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2006, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/11 "2006-03-09T23:52:22Z")
Just wanted to say that I am of the “no generalizations” camp, and to say that this: > [@pizzabrat](#): > > Why, we even had a lesbian poster on [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=269043) years ago who expressed bubble-headed frustration at the fact that her tall, athletic, European doner’s sperm was snatched up by someone else. …makes for a very odd picture. ---
**Author:** ![Ghanima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Ghanima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ghanima)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2006, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/12 "2006-03-10T00:17:20Z")
Well, I think women in general are capable of being far crueler to each other than men are to each other. But between women and men, I think it’s about equal. I think this is because the perceived cruelties are largely in our heads. And both sexes are guilty of judging each other based on looks. ---
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2006, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/13 "2006-03-10T00:19:29Z")
> [@MissMossie](#): > > Is the gender specific pronoun in the subject on purpose? Are you only looking for men to admit that their side is crueler? Not at all. It’s a constraint of the English language. ---
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2006, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/14 "2006-03-10T00:29:30Z")
Anyway, I’m kind of embarrassed about starting this thread now. It hindsight it doesn’t even make sense, and is pointless. The question isn’t even conducive to real discussion. I guess I just felt like venting about sperm donor story (and that ancient post it reminded me of). I wasn’t even really offended by the Woody Allen post. I hope I can get the mods to close it. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2006, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/15 "2006-03-10T00:38:38Z")
> [@pizzabrat](#): > > What I want to know is does anyone think his or her own sex harsher to the other side, in general, than vice-versa, or are we all wrought with tunnel vision, inflating offenses to us and downplaying those to the other side? I think you should turn off the t.v. the next time Bravo has a “Misanthropic Films of [Neil LeBute](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001438/) Marathon” and take a nice long shower instead. 😉 Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2006, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anybody-willing-to-admit-that-his-side-is-crueler-in-the-sex-wars/347737/16 "2006-03-10T00:39:17Z")
> [@pizzabrat](#): > > I hope I can get the mods to close it. I’ll go ahead and close it. If you think of a better way to phrase the OP to lead to the discussion you would like, feel free to open a new one. Thread closed at the OP’s request.