# Anyone care to know the real reason for Cheneys defense of Gitmo? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 17, 2005, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655 "2005-06-17T05:00:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/21 "2005-06-17T11:17:20Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > Like a Kennedy? Or a Santorum. Either way. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/22 "2005-06-17T11:29:38Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > Hmm…Well, who knows yet how Cheney will benefit from anything that Halliburton gets now? The revolving door needs to complete its current revolution. These things span out over a long period of time. And it depends upon who gets elected president in 2008. > > I do know that Halliburton (well, KBR, I think) was getting military contracts since before Cheney had any power, in the Vietnam war. They continued to get contracts because, well, “Thems was the guys that’s last done it…” Hence these no-bid, cost-plus contracts. It doesn’t matter if Cheney benefits or not. It’s a waste of money no matter who’s in the White House. > > The use of private contractors has increased steeply in the last few years. This has demoralized the soldiers who would otherwise be doing the same work for less than a fourth of what the contractors get paid. They see these people making so much money, and they think, “Why should I stick around in the US military?” > > And contractors aren’t subject to the same discipline and accountability as military personnel, yet they often benefit from the protection they get from our military. But didn’t you get the news? Doing things via the private sector is ALWAYS cheaper and more efficient than the gub’mint doing things! Adding an extra layer of profit into the mix reduces the cost to us, the peepul! Right? ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/23 "2005-06-17T11:41:59Z")
It only takes a few minutes at “[FactCheck.org](http://FactCheck.org)” to learn that they are less interested in “holding politicians accountable” than “criticizing ‘liberals’ and vindicating ‘conservatives’”. It’s more right-wing doublespeak. [FactCheck.org](http://FactCheck.org) is [SpinDoctor.org](http://SpinDoctor.org). ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/24 "2005-06-17T12:24:14Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > It only takes a few minutes at “[FactCheck.org](http://FactCheck.org)” to learn that they are less interested in “holding politicians accountable” than “criticizing ‘liberals’ and vindicating ‘conservatives’”. It’s more right-wing doublespeak. [FactCheck.org](http://FactCheck.org) is [SpinDoctor.org](http://SpinDoctor.org). Wow. Speaking of spin… Let’s just set aside that FactCheck is brought to us by the University of Pennsylvania’s Annenberg Public Policy Center, long one of NPR’s regular contributors and sources of funding. Let’s set aside that the front page prominently features a quote from Democratic Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan as its mission statement. Let’s set aside that the front page presently says that Republicans have inaccurately accused Democrats of delaying court appointments, and that Specter and Armey (both Republicans) are misleading America about asbestos lawsuits. Let’s set aside that our own Elucidator has repeatedly cited FactCheck, [like here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=4512679&postcount=1): “The best take on it I’ve seen comes from FactCheck, a project of the Annenberg Foundation. (I recommend that you bookmark these people, they truly seem determined to be non-partisan and factual).” Setting all that aside, the facts and documents of the article remain. Dick Cheney is not profiting from Haliburton’s activity since he left, either by salary or by stock ownership. Do you or do you not have anything substantive with which to rebut them. ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/25 "2005-06-17T12:43:12Z")
In politics it seems that if smoke is around for a while with no sign of fire, then it’s just smoke. Democrats would be going apeshit if there was really something to this. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/26 "2005-06-17T12:49:27Z")
Regarding [factcheck.org](http://factcheck.org), I’m on their email list, and it sure seems like they take on lies from both parties. If they’re supposed to biased towards dems, they need to start doing a better job, at least in their emails. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/27 "2005-06-17T12:54:16Z")
Well, I only spent a few minutes on the site, so maybe I’m wrong. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/28 "2005-06-17T13:08:04Z")
> [@Oy!](#): > > But didn’t you get the news? Doing things via the private sector is ALWAYS cheaper and more efficient than the gub’mint doing things! Adding an extra layer of profit into the mix reduces the cost to us, the peepul! Right? Well, I don’t know, I’m sure there are situations where contracting the private sector makes sense (such as very high tech stuff), but I feel it should be openly bid, and no cost-plus deals. KBR was charging not for what they provided, but for what they’d estimated they would provide, in food service, which was a lot more. My understanding is that the Pentagon wants to keep soldiers primarily for battle, and leave other stuff for contractors. But I don’t think they save that much money the way they’re handling it, seeing as soldiers have done things like food service and housing for many years, and they surely can be trained to do security, such as Blackwater and Dimecorp (sp?) are doing. Those companies just hire ex-military anyway. At least that’s how it seems to me; correct me if I’m wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Twin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/85f322/32.png) [@Twin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Twin)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/29 "2005-06-17T13:19:34Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Wow. Speaking of spin… > > Let’s just set aside that FactCheck is brought to us by the University of Pennsylvania’s Annenberg Public Policy Center, long one of NPR’s regular contributors and sources of funding. Let’s set aside that the front page prominently features a quote from Democratic Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan as its mission statement. Let’s set aside that the front page presently says that Republicans have inaccurately accused Democrats of delaying court appointments, and that Specter and Armey (both Republicans) are misleading America about asbestos lawsuits. Let’s set aside that our own Elucidator has repeatedly cited FactCheck, [like here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=4512679&postcount=1): “The best take on it I’ve seen comes from FactCheck, a project of the Annenberg Foundation. (I recommend that you bookmark these people, they truly seem determined to be non-partisan and factual).” > > Setting all that aside, the facts and documents of the article remain. Dick Cheney is not profiting from Haliburton’s activity since he left, either by salary or by stock ownership. Do you or do you not have anything substantive with which to rebut them. **Liberal** , you can’t let the facts get in the way of yet another Gitmo/Halliburton pitting from the usual suspects. Your voice of reason is too much for the echo chamber. Heck, check out the pathetic ramblings in the Durbin pit thread… ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/30 "2005-06-17T13:38:05Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Well, I only spent a few minutes on the site, so maybe I’m wrong. One who spent only a few minutes on this site might ask **Liberal** to stop blindly sticking up for the Democratic Party that he follows religiously… ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/31 "2005-06-17T13:45:27Z")
> [@](#): > > that he follows religiously… That is not fair. **Lib** is not interested in supporting the sectarion nature of _religion_ and it is unfortunate that you would accuse him of doing so even analogously. OK. OK. I’ll quit. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/32 "2005-06-17T13:45:48Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > One who spent only a few minutes on this site might ask **Liberal** to stop blindly sticking up for the Democratic Party that he follows religiously… Really. I’m sick of his liberal whining and endless Bush bashing. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/33 "2005-06-17T13:51:26Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Really. I’m sick of his liberal whining and endless Bush bashing. To be fair, **Reeder** is trying to bash Cheney. This time. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/34 "2005-06-17T13:58:29Z")
Oh come on, facts in a **Reeder** rant thread are like putting “Anita Bryant’s Greatest Hits” on continous rotation at a LAMBDA fund-raising dinner dance. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/35 "2005-06-17T14:02:31Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Setting all that aside, the facts and documents of the article remain. Dick Cheney is not profiting from Haliburton’s activity since he left, either by salary or by stock ownership. Do you or do you not have anything substantive with which to rebut them. Not directly profiting. One could argue that the ex-Big Cheese of a corporation would remain kindly disposed toward it and make smooth its path whenever the occasion presented itself. There’s also **guizot’s** point about the revolving door. But no, it’s correct to say that Cheney takes no direct profit (or indirect via stock held in trust) profit from Halliburton’s feeding at the public trough. That still leaves us with plenty of other reasons to despise the man, though. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/36 "2005-06-17T14:04:28Z")
What’s not factual about it? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/37 "2005-06-17T14:06:49Z")
Everything. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Uncommon\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Uncommon\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uncommon_Sense)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/38 "2005-06-17T14:16:36Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Oh come on, facts in a **Reeder** rant thread… > Regards, > Shodan What facts? ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/39 "2005-06-17T14:22:31Z")
> [@Lord Ashtar](#): > > To be fair, **Reeder** is trying to bash Cheney. This time. I was talking about Liberal, as a jest of making snap judgments at a glance (based, in this case, on his username). ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2005, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655/40 "2005-06-17T14:24:43Z")
The article doesn’t mention, is it known if there were bids on this contract? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-care-to-know-the-real-reason-for-cheneys-defense-of-gitmo/308655.md?page=3)