# Anyone else surprised (dismayed?) by Las Vegas? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 9, 2023, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948 "2023-03-09T21:07:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2023, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/161 "2023-03-15T15:27:39Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > with properties all over the place. Including Las Vegas. They run the casino inside Virgin Hotel (formerly the Hard Rock casino.) The Palms hotel and casino is owned by the San Manuel tribe out of SoCal. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2023, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/162 "2023-03-15T15:41:06Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > I’ll also add that only Nevada and New Jersey (only Atlantic City) allow Vegas-style casinos, other than those Indian ones. Washington allowed non-native casinos. They had the table games, roulette, etc. They tried to get slots, but that was not allowed. So, not _exactly_ Vegas, but pretty close (especially for those of us who don’t play slots) I think the smoking ban really hurt their business (smokers found their way to tribal casinos that allowed smoking) and COVID seems to have wiped out the remaining ones. (I’m sure some are still operating, but the ones near me are gone) ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2023, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/163 "2023-03-15T15:51:20Z")
[Sebastian Maniscalco](https://youtu.be/Vt7_aLij6mc) has made an entire career out of being surprised and dismayed about Las Vegas. I do agree with him, that city is a troubling sign for our country. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2023, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/164 "2023-03-15T16:49:37Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > I’ll also add that only Nevada and New Jersey (only Atlantic City) allow Vegas-style casinos, other than those Indian ones. I don’t believe that’s true any more. Many states now have commercial (non-Indian) casinos. There’s one just down the road from me. > **[Gambling in the United States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambling_in_the_United_States)** > > In the United States, gambling is subject to a variety of legal restrictions. In 2008, gambling activities generated gross revenues (the difference between the total amounts wagered minus the funds or "winnings" returned to the players) of $92.27 billion in the United States. > The American Gaming Association, an industry trade group, states that gaming in the U.S. is a $240 billion industry, employing 1.7 million people in 40 states. In 2016, gaming taxes contributed $8.85 billion in state and ... ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/165 "2023-03-16T09:11:03Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Washington allowed non-native casinos. They had the table games, roulette, etc. They tried to get slots, but that was not allowed. So, not _exactly_ Vegas, but pretty close (especially for those of us who don’t play slots) > > I think the smoking ban really hurt their business (smokers found their way to tribal casinos that allowed smoking) and COVID seems to have wiped out the remaining ones. There are a couple in Lakewood, just south of Tacoma, that are still in business. I poked my head into one once because I was getting a tire replaced one morning and was trying to find somewhere to get some hot food, and was extremely unimpressed by what I saw. Tribal casinos, on the other hand, have everything you can find in Vegas except bubble craps, electric blackjack tables, and stadium blackjack, all of which I prefer to the traditional variety because the pace is slower and there’s less pressure from tablemates when you’re placing your bets. (I’d give anything to make that bubbly computer voice in the bubble craps machine shut up, though. “YOU CAN BE THE SHOOTER! PUSH THE BUTTON! COME ON, **PUSH THE BUTTON!** ” It makes my gorge rise.) WA had a referendum almost 20 years back that would have allowed any business that sells pulltabs to operate Class B slot machines, but it failed by a nearly 2-to-1 margin, on a the back of a huge “Won’t somebody PLEASE think of the children?!” ad campaign. I would’ve voted for it, but I only moved to WA a few weeks before the 2004 election and chose to vote absentee in CA rather than trying to re-register that close to an election. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/166 "2023-03-16T14:28:35Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > There are a couple in Lakewood,… I grew up in Lakewood before it was Lakewood. Where are the casinos? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/167 "2023-03-16T15:35:14Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I poked my head into one once because I was getting a tire replaced one morning and was trying to find somewhere to get some hot food, and was extremely unimpressed by what I saw. They are certainly depressing. I like to play blackjack, but these places are filled with people who seemed to be betting money they couldn’t afford to lose. But lose they did. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/168 "2023-03-16T16:09:44Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > They are certainly depressing. I like to play blackjack, but these places are filled with people who seemed to be betting money they couldn’t afford to lose. But lose they did. But…the all the commercials on TV all the time for the Indian casinos show only young, beautiful people enjoying a luxurious time at the spa, at the pool, at the golf course, and winning…winning all the time. I have not been to one of these establishments, but it makes it look like there are 2 very attractive and scantily clad women for every chiseled dude. Are you suggesting that is false advertising?? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/169 "2023-03-16T16:22:06Z")
> [@Smid](#): > > Just a thought about expectation on Vegas, as in how Brits (or indeed most countries outside the US view it)… We’ve already got gambling. Plenty of it. Different versions, and the sadness of it, so we’re often not in Vegas to actually gamble, or not in the same way, and the type of desperate gamblers we’d know, wouldn’t make it Vegas… As others have noted, in the U.S., it varies state-by-state. 50 years ago, about the only place where there were legal casinos in the U.S. was in Nevada (primarily Vegas); in 1977, New Jersey legalized casinos in Atlantic City. Some states had state-level lotteries, and certain sports (horse racing, dog racing, and jai alai) had legal betting in certain states. When I was growing up in Wisconsin in the 1970s and 1980s, the _only_ legal gambling that the state had was bingo games, and those had to be run for charitable purposes (typically by churches). In the late '80s, that state opened up more forms of gambling, with a state lottery, a few casinos (still limited to Native American tribes), and greyhound racing (which only lasted a few years, before the tracks went out of business). As has been noted, states have greatly opened up various forms of gambling in recent decades, nearly always in pursuit of greater revenues. The most recent frontier has been sports wagering, which has exploded in the past five years (after a Supreme Court ruling ended a federal ban on it), and is now legal in most states. Even with gambling legal in most states now, Vegas still has that allure for many people, even though its original point of difference (legal gambling) isn’t much of a differentiator anymore. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/170 "2023-03-16T17:07:17Z")
In some cases it’s just absurd. Like the Indian casinos in Oklahoma just north of the DFW Metroplex or the riverboat gambling in Shreveport/Bossier City (east in Louisiana). The commercials show really hot women and all this sort of idealized nightlife and high roller type stuff. Which is patently not true; everyone I know who goes to those casinos is older and of a more… working class bent. I mean, if you want nightlife with hot people, DFW has plenty of that without driving an hour to some sketchy casino in Oklahoma. The _only_ reason to go up there would be the gambling, and possibly to see some second-rate acts that are playing there, and not in the Metroplex proper for some reason. And that’s part of my confusion about Vegas; I sort of figured that with the latter-day ubiquity of gambling, that Vegas would be some sort of _high-end_ version of that kind of thing- where the people with cash go to gamble, while the trashy kinds stay home and go to Shreveport, Durant, Pine Bluff, etc… But it’s the _same_ stuff, with the same trashy people, just all of it writ larger and trashier. I guess I had a bit of the Groucho Marx “I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member” thinking going on- I was prepared to be impressed by places that I could barely afford, or couldn’t afford, etc… and was disappointed when that wasn’t the case. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/171 "2023-03-16T17:13:28Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I guess I had a bit of the Groucho Marx “I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member” thinking going on- I was prepared to be impressed by places that I could barely afford, or couldn’t afford, etc… and was disappointed when that wasn’t the case. Based on some other responses in the thread, it sounds like some such high-end places _are_ there in Vegas, but may not be immediately obvious or accessible to someone who isn’t in the know, and isn’t what the Strip is about. (I also would not be surprised that, if the truly rich and famous want to go to a fabulous destination where gambling is a major part of the draw, for many of them, it’s not in Vegas, nor in the U.S. - it might be Monaco, Macau, etc.) ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/172 "2023-03-16T17:43:51Z")
> [@bump](#): > > But it’s the _same_ stuff, with the same trashy people, just all of it writ larger and trashier. Here’s where I beg to differ. For part of Vegas, sure. You’d have to pay me to set foot in Excalibur, for example. Which is why I don’t go there. Not knocking the people who do - everybody can find their niche in town. Mine is Wynncore, mainly because I’m not rich and therefore the Sky Suites at MGM are a bit out of my price range. Whole different universe from Downtown or the more down-scale places on the Strip. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/173 "2023-03-16T18:34:38Z")
> [@bump](#): > > The _only_ reason to go up there would be the gambling, and possibly to see some second-rate acts that are playing there, and not in the Metroplex proper for some reason. There’s a band I like, and the closest they came to Boston was one of the big casinos down in Connecticut. I saw them there a few times. I remember reading something, years ago, that said the best way to win in Vegas was to take advantage of the cheap drinks, food, and shows, and never gamble. I’ve pretty much held to that since. When the Encore casino was built in Boston, I was hoping some good acts would come. I’ve been there, and they don’t really have any performance space that I could find. I’ve heard they’re planning to expand and add one. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/174 "2023-03-16T18:47:34Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > There’s a band I like, and the closest they came to Boston was one of the big casinos down in Connecticut. A few years ago, I won tickets to see comedian Ron White. He was performing at the theater at a casino in Hammond, Indiana – a stone’s throw over the state line from Chicago, and one of several casinos that were built there in the '90s, when Indiana first legalized casinos, in hopes of generating tax revenue from Chicago residents. My wife and I went to the show, and we got there early enough that we had time to wander around the casino for a little while. It felt as dire as the Oklahoma casinos that @bump mentioned – lots of people who probably weren’t particularly wealthy, feeding money into slot machines, all in a haze of cigarette smoke. (White’s show was excellent, however. 😃 ) ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/175 "2023-03-16T18:51:09Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > (I also would not be surprised that, if the truly rich and famous want to go to a fabulous destination where gambling is a major part of the draw, for many of them, it’s not in Vegas, nor in the U.S. - it might be Monaco, Macau, etc.) Agree. And I think that’s where the mythic imagining of casinos is rooted - exotic locales. Probably from the 60’s era James Bond movies which sometimes featured casinos, gaming (usually roulette, craps or blackjack), hot women, high rollers, tuxedos, stacks of chips, risky bets that pay off, etc. Today’s casinos for the masses like to advertise all those things, as well as the spa, the golf course, the fine dining, the perceived classiness and exclusivity, and of course everyone’s beautiful and always winning! But as others are mentioning here, the real experience at these places is different from the image. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/176 "2023-03-16T18:52:42Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > the best way to win in Vegas was to take advantage of the cheap drinks, food, and shows, and never gamble. I’ve pretty much held to that since. The problem is, aside from comped drinks for people gambling, there isn’t much in the way of cheap anything any more. At least not while I was there in January this year. And even with the comped drinks, they’re enforcing a minimum amount of gambling if you want to keep getting drinks. That’s not a burden if you’re actually there to gamble, but if you’re just trying to game the system for cheap drinks, it’s a lot harder now. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/177 "2023-03-16T21:03:10Z")
Yeah, the shows are definitely not cheap. At least, the good ones. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/178 "2023-03-16T21:10:47Z")
Comped drinks are watered down well booze and knock-off mixers. Stick with bottled beer. Or…one could just go to a bar and pay for your drinks like an adult. If you can’t afford to drink the amount you drink at those prices, maybe you’d better back off the booze a bit. (This has been a drill. If this had been an **Actual Rant** ®, masks would have dropped from the overhead compartment and there would have been a large flashing sign saying “BULLSHIT!!” We now return you to your previously interrupted thread.) ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/179 "2023-03-16T23:00:56Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Where are the casinos? There’s one just off the 84th St exit and another on South Tacoma Way near the park & ride. I think the latter mainly caters to the local Asian clientele. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2023, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948/180 "2023-03-16T23:07:38Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Or…one could just go to a bar and pay for your drinks like an adult. If you can’t afford to drink the amount you drink at those prices, maybe you’d better back off the booze a bit. I do this, but I didn’t do it as much on the strip in Vegas when I visted because it’s generally more expensive there than it is where I live. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-surprised-dismayed-by-las-vegas/980948.md?page=10)