# Anyone following the Casey Anthony trial? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 29, 2011, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652 "2011-05-29T12:50:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2011, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/261 "2011-06-27T12:55:33Z")
Something big may happen this morning. Ann Fennell is the defenses death penalty expert. First time she’s been in court since jury selection. Probably a motion to dismiss a juror or maybe the jury? Casey is smiling and doesn’t seem concerned. Ann wouldn’t be there unless she’s needed to argue death penalty issues. ---
**Author:** ![sugaree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@sugaree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugaree)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2011, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/262 "2011-06-27T13:23:04Z")
Casey looks pretty serious to me. Hunching over her papers a lot. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2011, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/263 "2011-06-27T13:43:52Z")
Wow, they arranged three psychiatric doctors to examine Casey in one weekend? This judge works fast. Knocked the insanity plea right out of the park. Still think Ann has a motion too. She’s not there for the heck of it. Ann only argues death penalty issues. usually during the death penalty phase of the trial. I guess that comes later today. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2011, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/264 "2011-06-27T17:20:19Z")
Reading about this trial has been a wakeup to me. I never realized how badly isolated prisoners are in jail. Every letter Casey received or wrote is in the public record. They are posted on [wftv.com](http://wftv.com) and probably other places. Every jail visit with parents or other people were videotaped and released. They are on wftv and youtube. Even contacts with other prisoners is monitored. They’ve interviewed several prisoners that talked to Casey. It is pretty dehumanizing. Really, a prisoner is still being interrogated the entire time they are in jail. Every word spoken, at any time is monitored. It only stops if the person gets bail. Even then, wiretaps can be placed on phones and tracking devices on cars. The only private conversation is with an attorney. Even then jail guards are watching for visual cues. Some of this seems to violate attorney/client privilege. [http://www.wftv.com/pdf/25605645/detail.html](http://www.wftv.com/pdf/25605645/detail.html) Regardless of guilt this type of spying seems pretty extreme. Locking someone up for nearly three years and denying them any conversation seems inhuman. Especially since our system says someone is innocent until found guilty by a jury. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2011, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/265 "2011-06-27T17:27:39Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Reading about this trial has been a wakeup to me. I never realized how badly isolated prisoners are in jail. Every letter Casey received or wrote is in the public record. They are posted on [wftv.com](http://wftv.com) and probably other places. Every jail visit with parents or other people were videotaped and released. They are on wftv and youtube. Even contacts with other prisoners is monitored. They’ve interviewed several prisoners that talked to Casey. > > It is pretty dehumanizing. Really, a prisoner is still being interrogated the entire time they are in jail. Every word spoken, at any time is monitored. It only stops if the person gets bail. Even then, wiretaps can be placed on phones and tracking devices on cars. > > The only private conversation is with an attorney. Even then jail guards are watching for visual cues. Some of this seems to violate attorney/client privilege. > [http://www.wftv.com/pdf/25605645/detail.html](http://www.wftv.com/pdf/25605645/detail.html) > > Regardless of guilt this type of spying seems pretty extreme. Locking someone up for nearly three years and denying them any conversation seems inhuman. Especially since our system says someone is innocent until found guilty by a jury. You also have the right to remain silent. This case is hardly a banner case to be concerned about the accused’s rights. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2011, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/266 "2011-06-27T17:32:00Z")
Is that true for all prisoners, or just high profile cases like this one? Prisoners charged with the more serious crimes? ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2011, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/267 "2011-06-27T17:38:33Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > Is that true for all prisoners, or just high profile cases like this one? Prisoners charged with the more serious crimes? I’d say its true for all prisoners but clearly high profile ones will have a little more scrutiny - having read the PDF that was linked to above - it sounds as if a standard report based on CYA of the gaurd in his treatment of the prisoner and less to do with any assumptions of guilt/innocence on the guards part. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/268 "2011-06-28T03:34:41Z")
Bizarre testimony. A psychic tells Private detective Dominic Casey to search the woods on Suburban Drive in Nov. Hoover and fellow Keystone Cop Hoover were practically stepping on the bones and didn’t see them. The video they shot even showed the log the cops had to move later. That Hoover guy came off very sleazy. Tried selling pics to National Enquirer. Casey wasn’t much better. This case attracted a lot of money grubbers. I hope the psychic doesn’t testify next. ---
**Author:** ![MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MPB_in_Salt_Lake)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/269 "2011-06-28T04:02:28Z")
Unless it’s a conference between a prisoner and a lawyer, why shouldn’t the jail or prison monitor the conversations between prisoners and their visitors? Think of all the potential issues that could come up if a prisoner was able to tell his visiting buddy where to find (and of course destroy) a murder weapon that he had stashed, or the name and description of a witness that needed to be “taken care of” before the trial started… ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/270 "2011-06-28T08:52:05Z")
Meter reader Roy Kronk is supposed to testify tomorrow. He found Caylee in August, 2008. But only saw a skull in a bag from several yards away. Called 911 three times before a deputy met him at the scene. Deputy did a half ass job of looking and left. The area was under water and I guess he didn’t want to get wet. The deputy got fired later for lying about how thoroughly he searched. Kronk found the body again in Dec, 2008. (taking a pee in the woods). This time it was dry and he was close enough to poke the bag with the stick. Odd story. But, for me the scattering of the bones indicates the skeleton was disturbed by animals and the water. They found tiny bones over a large area and in a trash pile. Some buried deep in the mud & leaves. I see no way anybody could replicate that. The defenses theory of Kronk moving the body in August is nuts. Even in August those bones were scattered and under water. There’s no way Kronk could have collected them. It took a team of people over a week to clear vegetation, and sift the dirt for those tiny bones. That was after the water was gone. Anyhow, crazy or not. That’s what the defense is expected to argue Tuesday. The prosecution should easily rebut this defense theory. > **[Casey Anthony's former fiance takes stand out of jury's presence](http://edition.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/06/28/florida.casey.anthony.trial/)** > > Casey Anthony's former fiance testified outside the presence of jurors in her capital murder trial Tuesday, saying she once told him her brother Lee Anthony had groped her while she was sleeping. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/271 "2011-06-28T13:44:47Z")
The defense seems fixated on the theory that there was a conspiracy with respect to hiding the body. I think that’s a bit far fetched to assume there was someone, presumably Kronk, hiding and rehiding poor little Caylee’s remains while all this was going on merely because he thought a little fame would accompany his eventual discovery. Nice smoke screen though. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/272 "2011-06-28T15:43:37Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The only private conversation is with an attorney. Even then jail guards are watching for visual cues. Some of this seems to violate attorney/client privilege. > [http://www.wftv.com/pdf/25605645/detail.html](http://www.wftv.com/pdf/25605645/detail.html) In what specific way do you believe this violates attorney/client privilege? ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/273 "2011-06-28T15:52:17Z")
A conversation is not entirely verbal. Body language, gestures, and specific things the attorney does (showing items, writing notes) are all part of the meeting. I found it surprising a jailer can get away with spying and taking notes as a client meets with their attorney. Maybe things have deteriorated to the point that is acceptable. It’s been over 20 years since I took criminal justice in college. A lot of the stuff we studied isn’t actually practiced real world. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/274 "2011-06-28T15:57:21Z")
Kronk is being an ass on the stand. Splitting hairs and they are having to drag testimony out of the guy. Even reading the police call log to force him to acknowledge details. That’s not making him look good to the jury. He sounds like someone hiding something. That is helping the defense. The A-hole got over 20 grand for finding Caylee. He sure was chatty with the press and in his deposition back in dec 2008. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/275 "2011-06-28T16:18:06Z")
chatty Kronk on GMA [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/FEvhZkDxuF0/hqdefault.jpg "Roy Kronk Good Morning America Discovering Caylee's Remains : HE SAYS WE!") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEvhZkDxuF0) I already caught one lie today on the stand. This guy was fascinated with the case. In the deposition he details this theory about a swamp being a great place to find Caylee. He wanted that reward. Which is fine. Rewards encourage people to help in crime cases. He lied on the stand today claiming he had no interest in the case. Legal Analyst Bill Shaefer Dissects Kronks’ Interview [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/k3dRC4KHvsI/hqdefault.jpg "RAW VIDEO: Legal Analyst Kronks' GMA Interview A Defense Victory") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3dRC4KHvsI) ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/276 "2011-06-28T19:26:09Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Kronk is being an ass on the stand. Splitting hairs and they are having to drag testimony out of the guy. Even reading the police call log to force him to acknowledge details. That’s not making him look good to the jury. He sounds like someone hiding something. **That is helping the defense**. Unpack this for me a bit … Kronk was merely the body-finder (as opposed to a trained investigator). How is his testimony helpful to either the prosecution or the defense? There’s something I’m missing. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/277 "2011-06-28T19:51:57Z")
Speaking for myself, I find it irritating that Kronk’s answers on the stand were constantly contradicted by his written statements to police and in his deposition. This went on throughout his three hour testimony. As a juror, I’d wonder what was the guy hiding? Why not speak truthfully? This was the biggest event of the guys life. He was on national media. He’s not going to forget these details of his discovery. Maybe the guy is just an a-hole that doesn’t want to cooperate with the defense questioning. I noticed his answers were sharper and more focused when Linda cross-examined him. Not trusting the person that found the body could plant reasonable doubt in my mind. He wasn’t candid about wanting the reward. As a juror, I’d probably still vote guilty. But my vote might be swayed by debates in the jury room. Something just seems off with Kronk. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/278 "2011-06-28T20:15:47Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Not trusting the person that found the body could plant reasonable doubt in my mind. Doubt about what? If the body is positively ID’ed … not sure what Kronk’s testimony brings to the table for either side. Kronk may have found the body … but he doesn’t know a whole lot more about the body (forensically) than the people sitting at home? Does he? Or is there concern that Kronk may be complicit in the crime somehow? Or may have tampered with the remains? Dunno where his testimony is supposed to lead. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/279 "2011-06-28T20:19:21Z")
Kronk is just another guy who Casey has tossed under her bus. It’s getting really crowded under there. I’m feeling sorry for the jury. They are under supervision all the time. They only get their cell phones when they can be supervised with them. Even the TV they watch is censored. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2011, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652/280 "2011-06-28T20:21:53Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Unpack this for me a bit … Kronk was merely the body-finder (as opposed to a trained investigator). How is his testimony helpful to either the prosecution or the defense? There’s something I’m missing. Me too. It’s really confusing. The talking heads are saying the defense wants to show that the area was disturbed long before the body was found in December. If Kronk moved things around in August, it confuses the testimony about duct tape stuck to the skull, plant growth, etc. And who does that guy look like? Somebody on a sitcom – I can picture him but can’t think of the show. It’s the hair. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-following-the-casey-anthony-trial/583652.md?page=15)