# Anyone know what happens at elite preschools? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 15, 2011, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843 "2011-03-15T22:31:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/21 "2011-03-17T12:50:44Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > This is not true. It may have been true at one point, but college admissions these days are insane. I teach high school juniors and seniors, and you wouldn’t believe the quality of kid that gets turned down from Ivy League/tier I schools these days. I don’t think it’s the end of the world: they all get in somewhere good, and there are lots and lots of great options out there, but it can be pretty devastating when you’ve been one of the most celebrated kids in your class (for good reason) and you get turned down by William and Mary and Washington University, never mind about Dartmouth and Brown. > > The admissions rates for the top schools these days are in the 7-9% range, and much of the 93% that get rejected were kids you’d think had a really good shot: I’ve seen personable kids at the top of their class, with great recs and essays and four years of two sports and an NHS presidency and an Eagle scout get turned down left and right. I suspect then that the angling for positions at prestigious pre-school, kindergarten, prep, etc. is to add that little note to the kid’s “resume” that parents hope may tip the balance in university admission. Parents maybe think if Johnny has 15 years of “remarkable achievement” or getting past significant social filters, it will make the difference when they apply. I know I found the “big fish little pond” syndrome to be very true. Even in a private school I coasted to consistent 2nd or 3rd in the class with minimal work; when I got into sciences in university, I found I was just average in that crowd. I imagine the same shock must occur especially to those remarkably gifted kids from small town America. I recall at a recruiting seminar I once asked about marks vs. position at some of Canada’s bigger companies, and an HR fellow from some big company remarked that they did a survey - if they’d been hiring based only on (university) marks, most of their top managers would not have been hired. What makes you succeed in the real world has less to do with book learning and a lot to do with other qualities. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/22 "2011-03-17T13:42:17Z")
> [@xoferew](#): > > I teach at one of these schools. I think we provide a really good education - I have a large classroom and two assistant teachers for my class of 20 4- and 5- year olds. Yours is clearly not an elite preschool. No elite preschool would have a student teacher ratio greater than 5:1. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/23 "2011-03-17T16:16:09Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > Bingo. Once you get a Bachelor’s degree, high school becomes nearly irrelevant. Certainly, WHAT high school you went to and your GPA no longer matter unless you are trying to get into an old boys network somewhere. The fact that you got into college and got a degree is enough evidence that you have mastered High School level work. Once one has a PhD, even their BS/BA alma mater becomes unimportant. I’m not sure what pre-schools I attended, let alone seriously considered using them to advance my social or academic reputation. I can actually tell you what preschool I attended, it was one run by a different ELCA church than the one (also ELCA) that my family attended. Of course, I’m now kinda stuck in the middle. I’ve got a MS, so my BS work doesn’t really matter anymore, but at least when looking for my first job I also had to deal with the questioning of why not going for the PhD. ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/24 "2011-03-17T17:46:35Z")
On the one hand, my heart breaks for the kids who go to these schools and have to suffer such incredible pressure unrelentingly, from such a young age. But on the other hand, my heart breaks for all the smart kids born into middle class or poor homes, who will never have these kinds of advantages, and will surely suffer from it. Sure, if you are exceptional you can go to an ivy league college later, but who can say these kids in $20,000 a year preschools don’t have a leg up on that? I know the American Dream was always a lie, but stuff like this really shoves it your face. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/25 "2011-03-17T17:58:16Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > I > I know I found the “big fish little pond” syndrome to be very true. Even in a private school I coasted to consistent 2nd or 3rd in the class with minimal work; when I got into sciences in university, I found I was just average in that crowd. I imagine the same shock must occur especially to those remarkably gifted kids from small town America. That’s certainly what happened to me, although I was never from a small town. I was one of the top students in my fairly large, urban, high school, and was accepted at a quite prestigious college. Soon after I got there I realized that I was, as you say, just average among the students there. It was humbling. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/26 "2011-03-17T19:56:12Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > I know the American Dream was always a lie, :dubious: I would beg to differ. It’s just that it’s not absolute, that everyone will be successful. Nor is it an absolute that everyone born into poor homes will stay poor. ---
**Author:** ![tingbudong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tingbudong/32/520_2.png) [@tingbudong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tingbudong)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/27 "2011-03-17T20:35:58Z")
> [@](#): > > I recall at a recruiting seminar I once asked about marks vs. position at some of Canada’s bigger companies, and an HR fellow from some big company remarked that they did a survey - if they’d been hiring based only on (university) marks, most of their top managers would not have been hired. What makes you succeed in the real world has less to do with book learning and a lot to do with other qualities. I believe that also say a lot about the job market in Canada. In most cases, school name doesn’t count for much when trying to land a job here. I’ve heard that it might angle in your favour in the MBA/Law world. If you are being interviewed by alumni that also might count for something (but only with Canadian schools that stress alumni connections). It’s a program over name issue up here. I often scratch my head at the private schools in Canada as their graduates usually end up at the same schools as their public school counterparts. There are a few old-boys club high schools though. I’m a product of one of our so-called “Canadian Ivy League” schools and it hasn’t helped me nail down a decent job. ---
**Author:** ![Deegeea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Deegeea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deegeea)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/28 "2011-03-17T21:22:41Z")
I remember taking those tests to get into kindergarten myself. Blocks matching, looking at pictures with missing parts and explaining what was missing, etc. In the Midwest, in 1971. It’s not a new practice or restricted to Manhattan. Then my parents got divorced and (private school now too expensive) I was switched to public school. I went from “bright enough but struggles” to “omg she’s too smart for the class” and got quickly slated into the “advanced” class (what they now call “enriched” I think). There the kids were basically the same as in the private school, but less rich and more mean 😉 I think the “mean” was more due to the age than the school, though. Due to not continuing in private school, of course, I was unable to get admitted to Ivy League universities. I mean, what other possible reason could there be? (kidding) I still got a good education, and now work at the best possible company to work for. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2011, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/29 "2011-03-17T22:22:47Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > (Why did William the Conqueror invade, and what year?) Because he believed that Edward had promised him the throne. 1066. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/30 "2011-03-18T00:24:20Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Because he believed that Edward had promised him the throne. 1066. 😃 :dubious: I bet you looked that up. ---
**Author:** ![xoferew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/e9a140/32.png) [@xoferew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xoferew)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/31 "2011-03-18T01:32:51Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Yours is clearly not an elite preschool. No elite preschool would have a student teacher ratio greater than 5:1. I use duct tape in lieu of the other two teachers. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/32 "2011-03-18T01:40:29Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > :dubious: I bet you looked that up. No. But I’m well aware of the generally useless nature of the information. ---
**Author:** ![Zany\_Zeolite\_Zipper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/4af34b/32.png) [@Zany\_Zeolite\_Zipper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zany_Zeolite_Zipper)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/33 "2011-03-19T00:50:40Z")
> [@xoferew](#): > > The other day I spent the afternoon stuffing little plastic dogs into balloons, filling them with water, and hauling them to the freezer so the kids could problem-solve how to get the dog out of the ice. It’s fun. I love my job. Okay. I have to know. How do you intend four to five year olds to get the dog out of the ice. I just can’t see you handing flammables or power tools to small children. By that age I already knew how to cook meth and reload .30-06 cartridges, but I thought quality time with Mummy in New York was different. The only other solution that springs to mind is to smash the ice open. Could you post the results on YouTube if you intend for the children to smash kilogram sized blocks of ice against the floor, walls, or themselves? Thx! ---
**Author:** ![xoferew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/e9a140/32.png) [@xoferew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xoferew)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/34 "2011-03-19T01:09:44Z")
I provide them with salt, toothbrushes, and warm water. They also come up with ideas which I let them try including shining flashlights on the ice, whacking it with a block, and poking at it with kid scissors. They ask for, but do not receive, fire. Most of them succeed, but if they are getting tired I suggest they put their ice in the sink and run warm water over it for a few minutes, which does the trick. Generally the dogs are close to one side of the balloon unless I am sadistic enough and have good enough timing to rotate the balloons after the right amount of first stage freezing. So pretty soon after they begin they will be able to touch part of the dog, which encourages them to keep going. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843/35 "2011-03-19T02:12:33Z")
> [@Zany\_Zeolite\_Zipper](#): > > By that age I already knew how to cook meth and reload .30-06 cartridges, but I thought quality time with Mummy in New York was different. All the redneck kids in my class would have been all over that animal frozen in ice problem too. Book smarts never beats a daddy (or momma) who teaches you how to use the heavy ammo around the house when it comes to brute force problems. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-know-what-happens-at-elite-preschools/574843.md?page=1)