# Anyone See Dave Chappelle's New "Sticks & Stones"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 29, 2019, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434 "2019-08-29T20:17:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/41 "2019-09-04T14:21:53Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > :dubious: Comedians whine about audiences not liking their shitty mean jokes. Film at eleven. > > There are plenty of people doing awesome comedy. Chapelle? Not so much. Pobrecito. on the other hand, everyone loves comedy until the comedian jokes about them. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/42 "2019-09-04T14:28:26Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > on the other hand, everyone loves comedy until the comedian jokes about them. I think it’s possible to find something unfunny (or offensive) without it being about you. In this case, I didn’t go away mad, I just went away bored. Which is perhaps worse since at least “mad” gives me something to do and a reaction to how I spent that hour. Going away bored just means I wasted my time on it. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/43 "2019-09-04T15:01:36Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > Way to miss the point. Audiences have always tantrumed about “shitty jokes” like you’re doing here, that’s fine, that’s the job. > > What’s new, and what his point was, is that the easily offended snowflakes now try to destroy careers instead of just not buying tickets to any more shows like a sane person. Oh, please. The put Lenny Bruce in an actual jail for his routine. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/44 "2019-09-04T15:24:48Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > Way to miss the point. Audiences have always tantrumed about “shitty jokes” like you’re doing here, that’s fine, that’s the job. > [@EllisDee](#): > > No, see, that’s very clearly _not_ what his point was _at all_. You’ve already said that you didn’t understand his Michael Jackson routine; isn’t it possible you didn’t understand this point either? > > LHOD arguing about this based on what “he’s heard” as opposed to actually watching the show so he can comment on it intelligently is pretty perfect for this, though. > [@EllisDee](#): > > It was LHOD’s comment about Chapelle’s “shitty jokes” in a show _he didn’t watch_ that seemed tantrum-y to me. First, watching the special gives him royalties. I don’t want to put money in the pocket of the outrage generating machine. If someone tells me I’m misunderstanding, that he’s not actually saying shitty things about trans people, I might check it out; but from what I’ve seen of his previous specials, I don’t find him at all funny, and find him to be kind of an asshole. Second, you think my calling him an asshole is a “tantrum”? What would you call your behavior, then? Your reaction is way funnier than anything I’ve seen Chapelle do. > [@jz78817](#): > > on the other hand, everyone loves comedy until the comedian jokes about them. Meh. Mulaney’s jokes about timid white dudes strike me to my core, and are fucking hilarious. What, do you suppose, is the difference between Chappelle mocking trans folks, and Mulaney mocking white dudes? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/45 "2019-09-04T15:48:02Z")
Just finished it. He misses a few, and not his best work, but seriously? WTF is the controversy about. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/46 "2019-09-04T16:54:03Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Meh. Mulaney’s jokes about timid white dudes strike me to my core, and are fucking hilarious. What, do you suppose, is the difference between Chappelle mocking trans folks, and Mulaney mocking white dudes? I think I see the problem. “making jokes about” is not automatically equivalent to “mocking.” It’s like when guys are breaking balls amongst each other. You can (or should be able to) tell the difference between a silly joke about you/someone, and when they’re ridiculing you because they _actually hold you in contempt_. I’ve only heard a few clips from this show so far, but none of what I’ve heard so far rises to the level of the latter. > [@Miller](#): > > Oh, please. The put Lenny Bruce in an actual jail for his routine. relative privation fallacy. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/47 "2019-09-04T18:19:23Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > I think I see the problem. “making jokes about” is not automatically equivalent to “mocking.” It’s like when guys are breaking balls amongst each other. You can (or should be able to) tell the difference between a silly joke about you/someone, and when they’re ridiculing you because they _actually hold you in contempt_. I’ve only heard a few clips from this show so far, but none of what I’ve heard so far rises to the level of the latter. That would genuinely change my mind. What I’ve heard from other folks is that he shows genuine contempt toward trans folk. If I thought the dude was pretty funny, I might watch it myself to form my own opinion. As it is, I don’t enjoy his comedy, and so I’ll just make my opinion a little less firm :). ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/48 "2019-09-04T18:34:59Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > relative privation fallacy. Read for context. ---
**Author:** ![tullsterx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tullsterx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tullsterx)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/49 "2019-09-04T18:54:38Z")
I liked it and I’ve seen most all of Dave Chappelle’s stand up comedy and Stick and Stones is fairly consistent will all the rest. I don’t always agree with him, I think he’s wrong about a lot of stuff, but, he’s not a mind-slave to political correctness. He thinks for himself and I respect that. That’s true of many comedians that I like. Doug Stanhope, Louis CK, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/50 "2019-09-04T20:04:50Z")
> [@tullsterx](#): > > I don’t always agree with him, I think he’s wrong about a lot of stuff, but, he’s not a mind-slave to political correctness. He thinks for himself and I respect that. As opposed to some other people unnamed as of yet, who actually are “mind-slaves to political correctness” and “don’t think for themselves”? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/51 "2019-09-04T20:05:15Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > on the other hand, everyone loves comedy until the comedian jokes about them. That’s a perfect summation. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/52 "2019-09-04T20:10:41Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > That’s a perfect summation. Except that, by my count, all of the people in this thread complaining about Chapelle’s routines concerning trans people and the #MeToo movement are cis men. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/53 "2019-09-04T20:41:25Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Except that, by my count, all of the people in this thread complaining about Chapelle’s routines concerning trans people and the #MeToo movement are cis men. Ok, technically you are right! ---
**Author:** ![tullsterx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tullsterx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tullsterx)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/54 "2019-09-04T21:07:33Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > As opposed to some other people unnamed as of yet, who actually are “mind-slaves to political correctness” and “don’t think for themselves”? That’s exactly right. I’m glad you understand. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/55 "2019-09-04T21:08:48Z")
> [@tullsterx](#): > > That’s exactly right. I’m glad you understand. Yes, I understand that it is a figure crammed full of straw. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2019, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/56 "2019-09-05T00:24:25Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Ok, technically you are right! And also I said that I’m totally fine with comedy that mocks me as a timid white dude, especially when it’s another timid white dude doing it. So he’s also right on substance. But other than being technically right and right on substance, he’s wrong. > [@Acsenray](#): > > Yes, I understand that it is a figure crammed full of straw. That ain’t straw. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2019, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/57 "2019-09-05T01:38:44Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > That would genuinely change my mind. What I’ve heard from other folks is that he shows genuine contempt toward trans folk. > > If I thought the dude was pretty funny, I might watch it myself to form my own opinion. As it is, I don’t enjoy his comedy, and so I’ll just make my opinion a little less firm :). You haven’t watched it, don’t intend to watch it, but still feel comfortable enough to disparage it based on second-hand information. That’s not a great look. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2019, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/58 "2019-09-05T02:28:23Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > And also I said that I’m totally fine with comedy that mocks me as a timid white dude, especially when it’s another timid white dude doing it. So he’s also right on substance. > > But other than being technically right and right on substance, he’s wrong. > > That ain’t straw. I don’t think we need protected classes in comedy or as subjects of comedy. That said, it is a tricky space to navigate. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2019, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/59 "2019-09-05T02:49:09Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > That ain’t straw. Well, there’s probably something sticky keeping that straw together. Something that’s also easily available on a farm. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2019, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434/60 "2019-09-05T10:54:19Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > You haven’t watched it, don’t intend to watch it, but still feel comfortable enough to disparage it based on second-hand information. > > That’s not a great look. Glad you think so! > [@octopus](#): > > I don’t think we need protected classes in comedy or as subjects of comedy. That said, it is a tricky space to navigate. Nobody is asking for protected classes. People are asking for comedians not to be shitty, as in, don’t mine laughs from reinforcing stereotypes of folks who have faced violent oppression. If you’re trans, or if you’re well-steeped in the experiences of being trans through some other means, and you can make great insightful surprising jokes that reflect the experience of being trans, that’s very different from making jokes from the outside of the experience. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-see-dave-chappelles-new-sticks-stones/839434.md?page=4)