# Anyplace in the U.S.A. where Veterans are Actively Disliked? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 24, 2013, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792 "2013-03-24T03:00:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/21 "2013-03-24T16:40:41Z")
> [@\_Quiubo\_vato](#): > > Yes … everywhere! I doubt that very much. Could you be a bit more specific? ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/22 "2013-03-24T16:46:31Z")
> [@OurLordPeace](#): > > And isn’t war bad always? I think most sensible people see it as analogous to self defense with a gun, something you are willing to do but hope to never do. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone actually claim they would not support a war against actual violent foreign invasion of the USA, maybe Amish. EDIT:If someone mentions illegal aliens grrrrrrrrrrr. ---
**Author:** ![iftheresaway](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecae2f/32.png) [@iftheresaway](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iftheresaway)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/23 "2013-03-24T16:58:09Z")
> [@JerrySTL](#): > > Back around the Vietnam War, veterans weren’t appreciated in a lot of places. However since 9/11 it’s quite the opposite. I seldom mention I’m retired from the military as people start up with the “hero” crap. I’m not. I seldom take advantage of military discounts and other such benefits. > > There are some communities that have love/hate relationships when a military base is nearby. I was stationed at one place where they only wanted our money and otherwise wished we’d stay away. However I not live near Scott AFB Illinois and have never felt that way here. Hi, Jerry! I’m also just down the road from Scott, and the child/stepchild of 4 people who retired there. I agree that in this area, with Scott such a big base and very good for the area economy, most people here like the military (or at least individual members of the military). However, we’ve also seen some of our local kids come back wounded or in caskets, so at least among people my age (mid-twenties to mid-thirties), the support for members of the military doesn’t really extend to support for the war. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/24 "2013-03-24T16:59:31Z")
> [@grude](#): > > Just the other day I saw a guy argue North Korea isn’t such a bad place to live because marijuana use is not prosecuted there.:smack: Well, that becomes a completely closed argument. I have heard that the incidents of returning VN vets being called names and so forth was far more limited than once believed; there certainly were incidents but the incidence was greatly overstated. I would guess that there are vanishingly few such occurrences these days, when we’ve managed to instill respect for those in uniform separate from the wars or political motivations. Some, certainly; the terminally stupid and mentally ill are always among us. Polite disagreement based on ethics, certainly. If anything, the degree of worshipful respect for the military seems to be starting to disturb some observers; whether it’s a deliberate co-option or not, we seem to be letting our respect for uniforms blind us to the actions of the institution. (Not saying I agree; but the question is being increasingly raised, and not just by anti-military types.) ---
**Author:** ![IceQube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@IceQube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IceQube)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/25 "2013-03-24T20:27:32Z")
I love veterans because that means they’re no longer in the (godfuck) military! ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/26 "2013-03-24T20:52:25Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > Well, that becomes a completely closed argument. > > I have heard that the incidents of returning VN vets being called names and so forth was far more limited than once believed; there certainly were incidents but the incidence was greatly overstated. I would guess that there are vanishingly few such occurrences these days, when we’ve managed to instill respect for those in uniform separate from the wars or political motivations. Some, certainly; the terminally stupid and mentally ill are always among us. Polite disagreement based on ethics, certainly. > > If anything, the degree of worshipful respect for the military seems to be starting to disturb some observers; whether it’s a deliberate co-option or not, we seem to be letting our respect for uniforms blind us to the actions of the institution. (Not saying I agree; but the question is being increasingly raised, and not just by anti-military types.) The problems of VN vets getting harassed when they got home certainly happened but that was over forty years ago when the US was vastly, vastly different. Societies change dramatically quickly and in many ways the US of today is as dramatically different from the US of the late 60s as West Germany and Japan of the 1980s are from the Japan and Germany of the 1940s. Frankly, I think there was a massive overreaction to the aftermath of the Vietnam War and when people realized how badly they’d treated veterans the pendulum swung too far in the opposite direction. Someone once said in the US society is either at the military’s throats or at their feet with nothing in between. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/27 "2013-03-24T21:17:24Z")
> [@grude](#): > > Just the other day I saw a guy argue North Korea isn’t such a bad place to live because marijuana use is not prosecuted there.:smack: But it’s got to be the last fucking place you’d want to have the munchies. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/28 "2013-03-24T21:38:09Z")
Even during the Viet Nam war, the only openly displayed dislike I personally witnessed of a soldier was aimed at an officer who was speaking in favor of Johnson’s war policies. Mostly returning Viet Nam vets tried to melt quickly back into civilian life. I worked with a guy who had recurring nightmares about the war, but even though I and many people around him were opposed to the war, he was given only encouragement. The Amish would hate the violent acts a soldier might have performed, but they would not hate an individual, even if they believed the person had sinned. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/29 "2013-03-25T02:45:25Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Arguably communities dominated by pacifist religious groups (such as Amish communities) although I don’t you’d see the Amish calling the soldiers “baby-killers” or anything. “Amish country” was one of the things that popped into my mind, but I actually know some Amish people and, while pacifists, they are very friendly and open and really aren’t interested in hating anybody. If anything, they would appreciate that you are interested in what they have to say and tell you to study God’s word. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/30 "2013-03-25T02:46:56Z")
> [@BigAppleBucky](#): > > … > > The Amish would hate the violent acts a soldier might have performed, but they would not hate an individual, even if they believed the person had sinned. This is a good summary of the typical Amish viewpoint. Getting Amish people mad at you is very very difficult. ---
**Author:** ![flodnak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/838e76/32.png) [@flodnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flodnak)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/31 "2013-03-25T08:03:48Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > “Amish country” was one of the things that popped into my mind, but I actually know some Amish people and, while pacifists, they are very friendly and open and really aren’t interested in hating anybody. If anything, they would appreciate that you are interested in what they have to say and tell you to study God’s word. Related to this, there is a persistent rumor in Lancaster County in Pennsylvania that the Mennonites (a religion closely related to, but not the same as, the Amish religion) who run Shady Maple Smorgasbord and the supermarket connected to it have refused to serve active duty military members in uniform because, of course, Mennonites are pacifists and hate war and therefore… hate soldiers? The rumor has gotten bad enough that they’ve put up [a page about it on their website.](http://www.shady-maple.com/smorgasbord/military-rumors/) (Yes, some Mennonites are cool with using the Internet.) Basically, their take is that they, as pacifists, would not serve in the military themselves, but they welcome anyone who wants to patronize their business. Do Quakers get this kind of nonsense, I wonder? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/32 "2013-03-25T12:36:08Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > The problems of VN vets getting harassed when they got home certainly happened Yes, there are many many documented accounts proving that Vietnam vets were spat upon whenever they ventured out in public, and had to carry umbrellas wherever they went. Being humble pacifists, none ever sought retribution for such behavior. It was a dark, dark day in America. Today of course it is different, excessive veteran-worship nauseates all right-thinking people, seeing that the media is full of nothing but flowery praise for the military and veterans, overlooking all charges of war crimes and misbehavior. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/33 "2013-03-25T12:40:02Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > Berkley? Read Country Joe McDonald’s account of[his efforts to build](http://www.countryjoe.com/memorial.htm) the Berkeley Vietnam Veterans Memorial… > [@](#): > > How this war protester came to develop a memorial honoring Berkeley’s war dead as a means of promoting healing from the Vietnam War is partly my own story, but my efforts would have achieved little if my story had not resonated in the lives of those many people who contributed to the project, welcomed its presence, and thus fulfilled its intent. > > Perhaps the two most important facts about my life that are relevant to the Berkeley Vietnam Veterans Memorial is that, first, I grew up in Southern California with American Communist Party members as parents and realized that Americans are often divided by political ideology. Second, I enlisted in the U.S. Navy at the young age of seventeen and served for three years in the U.S. military. By the time large numbers of American combat troops were dispatched to Vietnam in 1965, I was both the child of a radical leftist family and an honorably discharged veteran. Both these experiences left me feeling victimized. I had no love for the leaders of the American military or of the American Left, but I also was not mystified by either entity. I felt a deep camaraderie and respect for the rank and file of both organizations, but 1 had a healthy knowledge of the capacity of both for betrayal and friendly fire- A life mission did, however, emerge from these experiences that I never was to abandon: to protect those who cannot defend themselves and to remain dedicated to the cause of justice and the dream of peace. ---
**Author:** ![AlohaBear32](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47774/32.png) [@AlohaBear32](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlohaBear32)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/34 "2013-03-31T08:39:17Z")
Post WWI and WWII Black Soldiers were rather treated harshly in the South, to the point that some of them were lynch while In their uniform…though to be fair that was more a matter of hating the skin color of the soldier vs hating the Military Service…however the military service garnered them no respect either it seems. Aside from that, can’t think of many current places where veterans are openly hated or disliked per se. Although they are not cheered on airplanes (when returning home from overseas duty) as oft as they used to be… ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/35 "2013-03-31T11:15:39Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > I think we can count a university as a community.And there are lots of campuses which are actively opposed to the military as an institution, and anyone who participates in it as an invidividual. ROTC programs have been taboo for years at many of the most elite Ivy League schools. ROTC was banned from a lot of colleges due to the military’s sexual orientation discrimination. When I was at law school, it was a somewhat prominent issue. I don’t what’s happened with more recent developments in the law. Regardless, I think that most schools’ career services’ opposition to ROTC was not due to general anti-militarism, but due to specific prohibitions on allowing any recruiter on campus that discriminated based on race, gender, sexual orientation, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/36 "2013-03-31T12:37:35Z")
> [@\_Quiubo\_vato](#): > > By the way, I just registered. How do you start a new thread on here? :o Go to the specific forum (IMHO, GD, GQ…) where you want to place the thread. There will be a [New Thread] button to the left, above the list of threads. ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2013, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/37 "2013-04-01T05:11:59Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > If anything, the degree of worshipful respect for the military seems to be starting to disturb some observers; whether it’s a deliberate co-option or not, we seem to be letting our respect for uniforms blind us to the actions of the institution. (Not saying I agree; but the question is being increasingly raised, and not just by anti-military types.) In the lead-up to the Iraq war, the Right went a long way in exploiting the backlash against Vietnam-era abuse of the troops. They sort of put the cart before the horse in making the war all about the troops and their need for support rather than our leaders and their decision making. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2013, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/38 "2013-04-01T13:56:14Z")
> [@sqweels](#): > > In the lead-up to the Iraq war, the Right went a long way in exploiting the backlash against Vietnam-era abuse of the troops. They sort of put the cart before the horse in making the war all about the troops and their need for support rather than our leaders and their decision making. Which interplayed with the “spitting image” myth which also over-emphasized the supposed dislike for the troops rather than the leadership. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2013, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/39 "2013-04-01T17:03:36Z")
> [@Darth\_Panda](#): > > ROTC was banned from a lot of colleges due to the military’s sexual orientation discrimination. When I was at law school, it was a somewhat prominent issue. I don’t what’s happened with more recent developments in the law. > > Regardless, I think that most schools’ career services’ opposition to ROTC was not due to general anti-militarism, but due to specific prohibitions on allowing any recruiter on campus that discriminated based on race, gender, sexual orientation, etc. ROTC was kicked off of most campuses due to Vietnam era anti-military sentiments. The modern issue of gay rights was an issue for recruiting and the eventual reinstatement of on-campus ROTC. I always found it funny that Stanford would take ROTC money, but the Navy and Marine guys had to drive to Berkeley for the military portion of their education. ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2013, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792/40 "2013-04-01T17:40:37Z")
I’m in a _very_ crunchy, left/progressive-leaning town, and I haven’t seen any animosity exhibited towards veterans. Then again, patriotic displays and chest-thumping are quite rare here, and you won’t see the same veneration of veterans as you might find in a small Midwestern town. There’s a lot of veteran’s groups in town, but they tend to have a more pacifist nature; poetry circles, community gardens, “safe spaces”, and so on. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyplace-in-the-u-s-a-where-veterans-are-actively-disliked/653792.md?page=3)