# Anything else you motherfuckers need? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 16, 2009, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231 "2009-07-16T16:51:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 108
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2141 "2009-08-12T10:41:01Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > I’m not joking and I’ve forgotten far more than most people know about pensions, insurance and the financial industry in general. SS has always been well-funded and has actually outperformed the S&P 500 over the last 15 years. Has your private arrangement done that? How the hell does SS outperform any investment when it’s not invested? What the hell does even mean? I’m in the financial services industry, and my impression from your contribution to this thread is that you lack even a basic understanding of how insurance, pensions and markets work, just to react to your first sentence here, BTW. You ignore the facts you don’t like and offer non sequiturs. SS has outperformed the S&P, eh? Well, so has my toaster! So there! ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2142 "2009-08-12T10:44:01Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > My dad worked for the government for 220 years (not counting 20+ years in the military), and rarely have I known anyone who took more pride in his work. Johnny, 22 years? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2143 "2009-08-12T12:41:45Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Johnny, 22 years? Yes, 22 years. That’s what I get when I post just before going to bed. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2144 "2009-08-12T14:15:49Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Yes, 22 years. That’s what I get when I post just before going to bed. I was gonna say… he must have gotten one hell of a nice watch at his retirement party. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2145 "2009-08-12T15:27:30Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I was gonna say… he must have gotten one hell of a nice watch at his retirement party. They pretty much stood him in front of Big Ben and said, “Here.” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2146 "2009-08-12T15:34:46Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > They pretty much stood him in front of Big Ben and said, “Here.” The first draft of that post was, “did they give him a watch, or a whole clock tower?” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2147 "2009-08-12T15:37:30Z")
Seriously, though. Dad put in two or three years in the Army, 20 years in the Navy, and 22 years in the FAA. He worked for the government all of his life. He took his job seriously, took pride in his work, and put in the extra effort to ensure his ‘customers’ were more than satisfied. So when someone comes along and says that civil servants have sloppy work habits because ‘their jobs are secure’ it pisses me off. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2148 "2009-08-12T15:44:23Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > The first draft of that post was, “did they give him a watch, or a whole clock tower?” 😃 Great minds, don’cha know. ---
**Author:** ![Dick\_Dastardly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c4cdca/32.png) [@Dick\_Dastardly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dick_Dastardly)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2149 "2009-08-12T16:25:19Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > How the hell does SS outperform any investment when it’s not invested? What the hell does even mean? I’m in the financial services industry, and my impression from your contribution to this thread is that you lack even a basic understanding of how insurance, pensions and markets work, just to react to your first sentence here, BTW. You ignore the facts you don’t like and offer non sequiturs. SS has outperformed the S&P, eh? Well, so has my toaster! So there! I’m delighted to see we now appear to be in agreement on almost everything we were differing on before! Just to explain this final point of contention, SS has over two trillion dollars invested in US government bonds, and bonds have outperformed stocks for some time now. The point I’m trying to make here is that if the campaign to privtise SS had been successful in privatising SS a few years ago them the people who had invested their 2005-era dollars in whatever equity funds had been set up to manage the SS money would not be celebrating today. SS is an oasis of security, safety and stability compared to American public and private pension funds, easily the best value for your retirement dollar you can find. What is it you do in the financial services industry? ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2150 "2009-08-12T17:11:49Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > I’m delighted to see we now appear to be in agreement on almost everything we were differing on before! Just to explain this final point of contention, SS has over two trillion dollars invested in US government bonds, and bonds have outperformed stocks for some time now. The point I’m trying to make here is that if the campaign to privtise SS had been successful in privatising SS a few years ago them the people who had invested their 2005-era dollars in whatever equity funds had been set up to manage the SS money would not be celebrating today. SS is an oasis of security, safety and stability compared to American public and private pension funds, easily the best value for your retirement dollar you can find. > > What is it you do in the financial services industry? What he’s probably doing is wishing he could get his hands on some of that SS money. And I’m not talking about the share that he will eventually receive… ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2151 "2009-08-12T19:31:54Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I am offended by this statement. My dad worked for the government for 220 years (not counting 20+ years in the military), and rarely have I known anyone who took more pride in his work. If you take offense at a statement that is that general, perhaps you should reconsider how you feel about your father’s work (which I assume didn’t last for 220 years). ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2152 "2009-08-12T19:38:10Z")
Did anyone else see the tag for the latest Threadspotting (“I can’t believe I read the whole thing”) and worry it was linking back here? > [@curlcoat](#): > > If you take offense at a statement that is that general, perhaps you should reconsider how you feel about your father’s work (which I assume didn’t last for 220 years). Haven’t you learned to read the rest of the thread before you reply, you retarded whore? It was already pointed out and admitted as a typo of 22. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2153 "2009-08-12T19:56:39Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > I read the salient points but I didn’t read the whole thing, no. I’m sure they manages to accurately convey the findings of the report in the bullet points. Okaaay… > [@](#): > > I would define “quality” here as doing a competent job for excellent value to the taxpayer/consumer. And in the case of SS and Medicare the public sector kicks the arse of the private sector. Far better value, QED. Social Security and Medicare both run in the red - you consider that to be even competent, much less excellent value? > [@](#): > > So now you agree it’s well-funded, excellent! It’s very well run, a 1% overhead compared to up to a third for some mutual funds. And it outperformed almost all of those funds and the S&P 500 over the last 15 years. You keep ignoring that it is a ponzi scheme. > [@](#): > > SS isn’t a pension scheme, it’s an insurance scheme, and that’s how all insurance schemes work. They take in premiums and pay out claims and take a profit while maintaining a fractional reserve\*. That isn’t quite true. Insurance companies (at least medical - I have no experience with other forms) are required to have that reserve _before_ they start taking in premiums. Otherwise, they will not have the money available to pay claims should enough come in prior to their building a reserve. Such as is happening with SS. And SS isn’t insurance, it is a pension that is paid out when someone becomes disabled, retires, or to survivors when someone dies under certain circumstances. I suppose an argument could be made to say that all pensions are insurance policies, but that is as close as SS gets to being insurance. > [@](#): > > \*By comparison, Medicare’s strengths leap off. A comprehensive set of predicable benefits; universal access for those who qualify by age or disability, regardless of pre-existing conditions; free choice of physician, other providers, and hospitals anywhere in the country; simplified administration costing only about 3 percent in overhead compared to overhead five to nine times higher for private insurers; and a binding social contract that people can count on. “simplified administration” is all they say? What does that mean? That it is simpler to administer only one benefit for each procedure? That it is significantly easier to deal with Medicare than the average private insurance company? What? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2154 "2009-08-12T20:05:36Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Haven’t you learned to read the rest of the thread before you reply, you retarded whore? It was already pointed out and admitted as a typo of 22. You are such an asshole. One tiny mention of his typo and you call me a retarded whore? Must be nice to be perfect… :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2155 "2009-08-12T20:59:49Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > You are such an asshole. One tiny mention of his typo and you call me a retarded whore? Must be nice to be perfect… It’s the Pit and I don’t like you, so I’m calling you nasty things because I find it enjoyable. You vapid bitch. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2156 "2009-08-12T21:00:43Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > And SS isn’t insurance, it is a pension that is paid out when someone becomes **disabled** , retires, or to survivors when someone dies under certain circumstances. I suppose an argument could be made to say that all pensions are insurance policies, but that is as close as SS gets to being insurance. SSI (not the same as SSDI, but also administered by the Social Security Administration) is paid to, among others, disabled children who never worked a day in their lives. That’s not a pension. That’s insurance (or a handout, or something, but it sure isn’t a pension). ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2157 "2009-08-12T21:41:37Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > It’s the Pit and I don’t like you, so I’m calling you nasty things because I find it enjoyable. You vapid bitch. Such a pathetic life. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2158 "2009-08-12T21:43:12Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > SSI (not the same as SSDI, but also administered by the Social Security Administration) is paid to, among others, disabled children who never worked a day in their lives. That’s not a pension. That’s insurance (or a handout, or something, but it sure isn’t a pension). I consider it a handout, but since some private pensions do the same thing (or they used to, back when unions flourished), I’d say that SS is closer to a pension. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2159 "2009-08-12T21:53:01Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Such a pathetic life. Hey, it’s \*\*my \*\*taxes paying your SSDI, you parasitic rich slut. Go ask your sugar daddy to buy you another car or something. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2009, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/2160 "2009-08-12T22:06:27Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > I consider it a handout, but since some private pensions do the same thing (or they used to, back when unions flourished), I’d say that SS is closer to a pension. Tell us more about these private pensions that gave money to people who were neither former employees of the company that owned the plan nor dependents of a former employee who had earned a pension. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231.md?page=107) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231.md?page=109)