# Anything else you motherfuckers need? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 16, 2009, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231 "2009-07-16T16:51:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 46
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/901 "2009-07-20T06:00:05Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > I don’t know why I bother providing cites, since you, like Carol Stream, neither read them nor give a fuck about facts, but [you’re wrong](http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2008-01-21-immigrant-healthcare_N.htm) about the illegal aliens. The only government funded care they are eligible for is Medicaid for ER bills. That is the only thing they are _legally_ eligible for. Do you think that folks that come here illegally suddenly start running their lives by the letter of the law? Hint - the answer is no. > [@](#): > > This is irrelevant. No, it’s not. Children born to parents that assume that the government will take care of them grow up to also assume that the government will take care of them. Something needs to be done to break that chain. > [@](#): > > We all know what you think of poor children. My opinion of children has nothing to do with their financial situation. > [@](#): > > However, like with illegal immigrants who are urgently ill, society as a whole believes that children should receive medical care, whether their parents are irresponsible, shiftless losers or not. Most people think that is the humane way to deal with the situation. Aside from “A Modest Proposal,” what would you suggest for the children who, through no fault of their own, are born to parents who cannot afford or are not eligible for insurance? Seriously, forget about their parents what you think of them and try to give a fact based answer to the question. None of this has anything to do with what I said. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/902 "2009-07-20T06:01:23Z")
> [@leander](#): > > You know the answer to that. She has no desire to work. She doesn’t have to. She can sit on her lazy ass all day long, snarking on people and judging people from the comfort of her parent’s home. She’s someone managed to convince a bunch of people here that that’s okay, mostly because they all loathe Carol and they want to believe her bullshit. Nope, I do not care much about her job history, while it may be important to you even the OP is disregarding anecdotal evidence. So, I do stick with what is clear, it is just a coward move to distract all by concentrating to what is only anecdotal evidence that even if you think is important it is useless for this discussion. Except, maybe to show all how cowardly you guys are when it is clear that you do not have any reply to the evidence presented. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/903 "2009-07-20T06:01:35Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Just checking the stereotype. > > Your posts fit the profile of someone who lives behind the Orange Curtain. Snort. You are an idiot. Wanting someone to fit a stereotype is not the same thing as them actually fitting it. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/904 "2009-07-20T06:05:22Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > That is the only thing they are _legally_ eligible for. Do you think that folks that come here illegally suddenly start running their lives by the letter of the law? Hint - the answer is no. Well, I did. So the answer is yes. > [@](#): > > No, it’s not. Children born to parents that assume that the government will take care of them grow up to also assume that the government will take care of them. Something needs to be done to break that chain. Not all are like that in your cartoon world. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/905 "2009-07-20T06:09:05Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Snort. You are an idiot. Wanting someone to fit a stereotype is not the same thing as them actually fitting it. Do you really think that you are not demonstrating how it fits now? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/906 "2009-07-20T06:09:58Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > You may be right, but do you really think that your hypotheticals make up enough of that statistic to render it insignificant to this debate? Even, say, 30% is, IMO, an appalling number that reflects a deep-rooted problem. According to someone that works in the bankruptcy “industry” in [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=523593&page=4) thread, post #192 ( I don’t know how to link to specific posts), credit card debt is why folks go bankrupt, not health issues. \*"In my area of the country, which includes very low income and very high income areas, the biggest cause of bankruptcy is credit card debt. Period. Say I have 100 new cases in a month. 90% of those are from people with tens of thousands in credit card debt. And while it is possible that they are paying meds with their Visa, they ain’t doing it with their WalMart, Target and mall store cards."\* See, the thing to do in subjects like this is to debate from facts, not emotions. As much as some folks would like to believe that every person unable to afford insurance is just a poor struggling hard worker, the reality is that many of them just choose to spend their money on other things. These are the folks that we should be spending billions of dollars on to experiment with a UHC? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/907 "2009-07-20T06:12:22Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > So kids should suffer and die from preventable and treatable conditions because you have a bad view of their parents? > > ITT:either a sociopath or a troll. Ah, another one that jumps to the most negative conclusion based on a point made on another subject. And people like you are deciding national policy. Sigh. ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/908 "2009-07-20T06:15:30Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > And those kids - why are their parents pumping out children they cannot afford? The answer is - because they know the government will pay for them and they “deserve” or “have the right” to have those kids when they want them, with no consideration if they can afford to raise them. Hmmm… so let me follow this line of reasoning. More free shit = more mewling bastards. Too bad the [stats](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2054.html) don’t back you up. The US has a birth rate of 13.82 per 1,000 population, whereas the European Union, whose member nations all provide some form of UHC for their respective populations, has a birth rate of 9.9. Another swing and a miss for the **curl** ster… ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/909 "2009-07-20T06:15:38Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > According to someone that works in the bankruptcy “industry” in [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=523593&page=4) thread, post #192 ( I don’t know how to link to specific posts), credit card debt is why folks go bankrupt, not health issues. > > \*"In my area of the country, which includes very low income and very high income areas, the biggest cause of bankruptcy is credit card debt. Period. > > Say I have 100 new cases in a month. 90% of those are from people with tens of thousands in credit card debt. And while it is possible that they are paying meds with their Visa, they ain’t doing it with their WalMart, Target and mall store cards."\* > > See, the thing to do in subjects like this is to debate from facts, not emotions. As much as some folks would like to believe that every person unable to afford insurance is just a poor struggling hard worker, the reality is that many of them just choose to spend their money on other things. These are the folks that we should be spending billions of dollars on to experiment with a UHC? I remember finding that logic flawed, even if only 10% of the bankruptcy cases are indeed caused by health care costs,\*\* it is something that is not happening on other developed nations. \*\* Credit cards in any case are used to pay heath care costs. Even if only 100 families were affected by this, it is 100 cases too many. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/910 "2009-07-20T06:20:26Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > I don’t give a fuck about her personal situation. It doesn’t concern me, and it doesn’t concern you. She doesn’t owe any of us any explanations, apologies, or justifications. I don’t care if she’s a liar. Any one of us could be making shit up as we go here, you realize that, right? I prefer fact-based arguments to ad hominem attacks whenever possible. Are you all out of facts? If so, isn’t there something else you could be doing than picking on some person of acknowledged mental and physical disability on the internet? This right here seems to be a snapshot of the pro-UHC mindset. They don’t care if the people can pay for health insurance or their medications or whatever themselves because they think that all people in this country should have the same coverage no matter what their financial situation is. No, noone owes _us_ any explanation but if they are trying to get free money/services out of taxpayer funded programs they jolly better be prepared to explain why they need it and why they can’t pay for it themselves. And IMO, the answer had better not be because I wanted to spend my money on other things. I fail to see why their desire to spend their money on other things trumps my desire to do the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/911 "2009-07-20T06:22:49Z")
One more thing, Target cards are credit cards, Target made a switch from store only cards to Visa/Target ones several years ago, so I would not trust that cite. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/912 "2009-07-20T06:24:02Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > This right here seems to be a snapshot of the pro-UHC mindset. They don’t care if the people can pay for health insurance or their medications or whatever themselves because they think that all people in this country should have the same coverage no matter what their financial situation is. No, noone owes _us_ any explanation but if they are trying to get free money/services out of taxpayer funded programs they jolly better be prepared to explain why they need it and why they can’t pay for it themselves. And IMO, the answer had better not be because I wanted to spend my money on other things. I fail to see why their desire to spend their money on other things trumps my desire to do the same thing. Some people can’t purchase health insurance. I believe you’ve been shown this before, but you are too blindly angry to accept it. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/913 "2009-07-20T06:28:04Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Ah, another one that jumps to the most negative conclusion based on a point made on another subject. And people like you are deciding national policy. Sigh. People who bother to vote have at least\* some \*say on national policy. You’ve stated, repeatedly, that you don’t. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/914 "2009-07-20T06:29:01Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > This right here seems to be a snapshot of the pro-UHC mindset. They don’t care if the people can pay for health insurance or their medications or whatever themselves because they think that all people in this country should have the same coverage no matter what their financial situation is. No, noone owes _us_ any explanation but if they are trying to get free money/services out of taxpayer funded programs they jolly better be prepared to explain why they need it and why they can’t pay for it themselves. And IMO, the answer had better not be because I wanted to spend my money on other things. I fail to see why their desire to spend their money on other things trumps my desire to do the same thing. AFAIK the current plan is mostly targeted to cover the Americans that do not have coverage now. I have no problem on checking if they can pay for their medicine and make changes to their coverage based on that. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/915 "2009-07-20T06:29:30Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Well, I did. So the answer is yes.. What the hell are you talking about? No, the illegals do not suddenly start living by the letter of the law - one of the reasons they come here is because we have all of these programs that give things to them, such as MediCal, DentiCal, ADC, subsidized housing and all the rest. All they need is forged papers to get them, or the use of someone else’s ID. Or one legal person providing a place where they can all live. Covering all these people who pay little or no tax is killing California. > [@](#): > > Not all are like that in your cartoon world. Which is why I didn’t say “all”. Unlike you, I do not see the world in black and white. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/916 "2009-07-20T06:29:47Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > This right here seems to be a snapshot of the pro-UHC mindset. They don’t care if the people can pay for health insurance or their medications or whatever themselves because they think that all people in this country should have the same coverage no matter what their financial situation is. No, noone owes _us_ any explanation but if they are trying to get free money/services out of taxpayer funded programs they jolly better be prepared to explain why they need it and why they can’t pay for it themselves. And IMO, the answer had better not be because I wanted to spend my money on other things. I fail to see why their desire to spend their money on other things trumps my desire to do the same thing. So–you haven’t qualified for that permanent disability yet, have you? The temporary thing ran out some time ago. How much do you spend on dogfood every month? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/917 "2009-07-20T06:34:24Z")
> [@Fuji](#): > > Hmmm… so let me follow this line of reasoning. More free shit = more mewling bastards. > > Too bad the [stats](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2054.html) don’t back you up. The US has a birth rate of 13.82 per 1,000 population, whereas the European Union, whose member nations all provide some form of UHC for their respective populations, has a birth rate of 9.9. > > Another swing and a miss for the **curl** ster… God, so much stupidity and so little time - I really need to get to bed. 1. I didn’t say anything like “More free shit = more mewling bastards” 2. Do you honestly think that birth rates for the _whole country_ apply to whether or not we have a UHC? 3. I note that you fail to include any information on those other countries WRT whether or not they have generations of welfare cheats and/or whether or not installing a UHC did anything about that. Since that was the subject of the post you responded to ya know… ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/918 "2009-07-20T06:37:54Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > I remember finding that logic flawed, even if only 10% of the bankruptcy cases are indeed caused by health care costs,\*\* it is something that is not happening on other developed nations. > \*\* Jesus. Other developed nations are not the US. There are other things, really important things, that we don’t share with those nations other than a UHC. > [@](#): > > Credit cards in any case are used to pay heath care costs. Even if only 100 families were affected by this, it is 100 cases too many. So, you think we should go with this billion dollar experiment because there might be 100 families that went bankrupt _only_ because of health care costs? Dontcha think it might make more sense to work on insurance reform? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/919 "2009-07-20T06:39:47Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Some people can’t purchase health insurance. I believe you’ve been shown this before, but you are too blindly angry to accept it. I am not angry. If anything I am disgusted. As for being unable to purchase insurance, that is a temporary condition - which can be avoided - for anyone who chooses to not demand that someone else pay their way. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2009, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/920 "2009-07-20T06:41:31Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > People who bother to vote have at least\* some \*say on national policy. You’ve stated, repeatedly, that you don’t. I don’t any more because folks like those who blindly support something based on a couple of sound bites greatly outnumber those who actually put some thought into things. For example, my state’s Prop 8… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231.md?page=45) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231.md?page=47)