# Anything else you motherfuckers need? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 16, 2009, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231 "2009-07-16T16:51:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 61
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1201 "2009-07-22T01:28:54Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > No, it would be the responsibility of his parents. So… because they’re dead he can just twist in the wind? > [@](#): > > You know, those people who decide to bring yet another life into the world, without needing to ask permission of anyone? Yes, the legally married, employed full-time people who decided to have a child that, tragically, was born with a birth defect. Want to know a secret? _You paid for his healthcare all along!_ That’s right! From _day one_ because his daddy was a Marine drill sergeant which means not only his paycheck but also all his family’s healthcare was paid by taxpayers. Like YOU. Ha-ha! > [@](#): > > And now you want us all to pay for the healthcare of all these people without asking too. Do I? Let me see… hmm… yes, yes I DO want to you pay for it! > [@](#): > > I am not supported by taxpayers, I am supported by my husband and the “investment” I was forced to make for 38 years. I am nothing like those who live off the government for most of their lives. And I certainly have never demanded some service that others will have to foot the bill for. Bullshit. SSDI is paid for by FICA taxes. You’re living off other people’s tax money. Of course, if you actually realized that your head would probably explode. Damn good thing you were forced to pay taxes, too - else you wouldn’t be getting shit right now, would you? If you feel that strongly about sucking off the public tit why don’t you send your monthly check back, huh? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1202 "2009-07-22T01:33:59Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > No. It has nothing to do with the subject at hand and I am tired of you demanding I prove everything I say. YOU demand people prove what they say… but you won’t do it yourself. You are a hypocrite. > [@](#): > > Despite all the pain and limitations I live with, I have a good life with a great husband, and the satisfaction of knowing that I have done the best that I possibly could over the years. And yet, it is inconceivable to you that someone else might have “done the best they could” and yet find themselves in need of help. > [@](#): > > No, you are all black and white - either I fully support a UHC for all without question, or I must be evil. Um… yeah, basically. I think it is a moral evil that this country _doesn’t_ have an adequate medical support system for ALL citizens. UHC or you’re evil. Yes, that’s what I believe. It took you this long for you to figure it out? > [@](#): > > Someday you will grow a brain and realize the big difference between getting back something a person paid into, and just sucking money out of the system without giving back. The fact I am adult and have a functional brain allows me to identify you as one of the latter. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1203 "2009-07-22T01:36:50Z")
> [@LeeshaJoy](#): > > I hope by “investment” you don’t mean Social Security. Those taxes weren’t saved up for you; they went _directly_ to people who were getting SS benefits at that time. Likewise, any SS money you currently receive comes from _people who are currently paying taxes,_ so you are, by definition, “supported by taxpayers.” That is EXACTLY what **curlcoat** means - she has this delusion that the money she paid in FICA taxes all those years was put away in a little box marked **curlcoat**. She’s ignorant, what can I say? “Fighting Ignorance since 1973 - it’s taking longer than we thought.” See exhibit **curlcoat** ---
**Author:** ![keturah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e95f7d/32.png) [@keturah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/keturah)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1204 "2009-07-22T01:40:23Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > It is neither your responsibility nor your right to take care of me or anyone else who has not abdicated self responsibility. We live in a free country, which means I have the right to live my life as I see fit, as long as it doesn’t interfere with anyone else’s life, liberty or pursuit of happiness. Therefore, I am very much not interested in having you decide how I need to be “cared for”. I’m afraid that you gave up that right when you accepted SSDI. You can’t keep claiming to be against the system when you accept the benefits from that system. You do understand that the money you paid in was not held for you personally, right? Additionally, you have said that you will accept the money even if it surpasses the amount that you have paid in. ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1205 "2009-07-22T02:20:31Z")
Hey, curlcoat, how 'bout that $500,000 dollars? You got that much socked away, right? Just in case, right? ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1206 "2009-07-22T02:49:28Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > I am not supported by taxpayers, I am supported by my husband and the “investment” I was forced to make for 38 years. I am nothing like those who live off the government for most of their lives. And I certainly have never demanded some service that others will have to foot the bill for. Bullshit, lady. Read the history of Social Security and the funding strategies of it. You are most certainly being supported by the taxes of others. Granted, you paid into the same program in dedicated taxes in the past, to become eligible for it. But it’s not a pension plan, it’s a tax and an entitlement program for the retired and disabled. I agree your hard work and contributions made you eligible for it, and that you’re entitled to the benefits of it. What you’re wrong about is that it’s your “investment.” Further, as an inhabitant of Orange County, you’re benefitting from a highway system paid for in part by federal taxes and in part by taxes on all Valifornians. And I had not heard that Orange Bounty was self-sufficient in energy production or in water – so you’re damn well benefiting from things paid for in part by others. That’s what living in a 21st century first world society entails. I don’t begrudge you ti – the only thing I object to is your view that you’re entitled to what other taxpayers have paid for that you take for granted, like the freeway system, the aqueducts and other water distribution facilities, the power grid, while taking a crap on those who are less fortunate than yourself and who may need other government services. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1207 "2009-07-22T03:10:46Z")
Geez, what a thread! How can a country describe itself as developed and progressive and NOT have a system of UHC? It’s really simple: a truly healthy society cares for all members, not just the wealthy and the so-called successful. It understands that there needs to be safety-nets in place to ensure that everyone is afforded the most basic of human needs: food, shelter and health services. That so many people in a country like the US cannot access the latter is a terrible indictment upon the actual level of development and progressiveness it claims. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1208 "2009-07-22T03:30:38Z")
> [@Jenaroph](#): > > Hey, curlcoat, how 'bout that $500,000 dollars? You got that much socked away, right? Just in case, right? Be patient. She hasn’t read that far yet. I agree with Idle Thoughts. She will continue to answer posts until everyone gives up. What page are we on, now? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1209 "2009-07-22T04:08:52Z")
> [@NinetyWt](#): > > For any system, there are going to be people who learn how to “game” it. There are plenty of books on “what day to go to Disney World to get the shortest lines” to “how to play the stock market” to “how to study for the LSAT”. Some of these things are, obviously, more egregious than others. > > The thinking person regards all that as “noise” in the system. It’s unavoidable, although efforts to minimize it are a must. That and what’s this about me suddenly “gaming the system?” The only assistance I’m currently receiving is unemployment, and trust me, it ain’t that much. (And, for those who are too stupid and who have the memory of a house fly, the Medicaid which was mentioned was only temporary to pay off the bills from when I was in the hospital two years ago. Once they were paid, that was it.) > [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > All I know is that there is pretty much nothing that entertains me more than an unemployed, Social Security/Disability collecting, Orange County housewife complaining about poor people taking all her money. I’m just surprised she has the time to contribute here at all in between nail appointments and bon-bon jags. Did anyone else suddenly get an image of Peggy Bundy? Except Peggy’s a hell of a lot more intelligent. (Just leave her to her delusions.) In closing: _It was once said that the moral test of Government is how that Government treats those who are in the dawn of life, the children; those who are in the twilight of life, the elderly; and those who are in the shadows of life, the sick, the needy and the handicapped._ -Hubert Humphrey ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1210 "2009-07-22T04:20:27Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Really? You will starve without it? You’ve mentioned retirement funds and a husband in the past so presumably not. No, you don’t actually _need_ the money, though yes, you are _entitled_ to the money. You don’t _need_ that money nearly as much as some of the people you loathe and despise need their benefits just to survive. See, that’s the difference between you and me - actually, unfortunately the difference between me and apparently a majority of those living in the US. I plan ahead and know what we will need to have a hope to have a comfortable future. So, no, I don’t need that money _right now_, but since I can no longer contribute to a 401K at work or get a pension from an employer, I am taking my social security early so we don’t have to touch any of the assets we are counting on to fund our retirement in order to pay bills now. I also have no idea how long I will live - I may not make it to 65. I should leave my husband in debt just because you think it’s disgusting that I am getting SSDI? > [@](#): > > All these people you are bitching about qualify for their programs just as much as you qualify for SSDI. No, they don’t. If you had paid any attention at all instead of jumping to conclusions, you would have noticed that the only people I have a problem with are those who just take and never put anything in, and those who demand another government handout because they couldn’t be bothered to consider something as important as healthcare a priority. You still cannot come up with a real life scenario where a person or couple who do not qualify for Medicaid are unable to afford private insurance, without there having been irresponsibility themselves or if they are young, their parents. Far too many people think they “deserve” this, that and everything because the ads on the TVs tell them they do, so they go buy it all on credit. Those are the people that I am getting tired of bailing out. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1211 "2009-07-22T04:36:25Z")
Where the \*Hell \*is my Ducati? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1212 "2009-07-22T04:55:22Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Yes, that is, for example, a reason we have public schools open to all regardless of income, so such children can get the education their deadbeat parents wouldn’t give them on their own. Likewise, it makes sense to make sure those children also have the care they need remain healthy, as healthy workers are more likely to be _able_ to work and pay taxes to support our society - unlike disabled people, something you have personal experience with, yes? We are already doing that. How many of those children that grow up in subsidized housing, living on welfare even finish school much less become contributing members of society? > [@](#): > > Well, then, maybe you should educate yourself about those laws prior to opening your mouth in a discussion about bankruptcy and proving yourself to be an ignorant tool. No, “medical expenses” is not the only reason you can declare bankruptcy. Speaking of ignorant, did you not notice that I said “a _few_ reasons that folks are allowed to use”? I am obviously aware that medical expenses is not the only reason they can use. > [@](#): > > You can buy an SUV for $10K? Where? What planet? $10,000 down and “easy monthly payments”. Or heck, maybe they bought two, like my across the street neighbors who cannot afford their mortgage and so only put $5000 each down. Or maybe they bought it used. > [@](#): > > Actually, if someone requires a fairly sophisticated wheelchair to get around they may not be able to use a normal car. Quadriplegics, for example, pretty much have to be transported in vans, And how often do you think that this is a reason why someone had to declare bankruptcy? This is a big part of your problem - you assume that everyone who is having financial problems due to medical expenses must be a total innocent who would never go blow money on cars or houses they couldn’t afford instead of making sure their family has insurance. Or wants to be a “free spirit” like a friend of mine, who has his own business and works when he feels like it. He’d rather spend the money to drive cross country at least twice a year than get himself an insurance policy. So, he just doesn’t go to the doctor unless he really has to - at least he is only putting himself at risk. > [@](#): > > Yes, because it causes me great emotional distress to watch someone starve to death. > Absolutely. You see, water-borne diseases such as typhoid and cholera and various diarrhea-inducing maladies can spread to those of us with money to take care of ourselves, And where is all this money to pay for it going to come from? Our population keeps growing, and our tax situation is making more of them poor people every day (as well as their own stupid spending practices). You have to be realistic about these things, not just a sob sister. We pay to feed folks and make sure that all of our water is clean already and we are deeply in debt. You want to add to this? > [@](#): > > Sure. Cause, personally, I don’t want to have to walk past any more corpsicles on my way to somewhere else ever again. Oh, wait - people don’t freeze to death in Southern California, so I guess that doesn’t happen anywhere… carry on. I wouldn’t know since I never saw any “corpsicles” in Washington either. > [@](#): > > You know, even in Chicago the well-to-do take advantage of subsidized mass transit. Even the poor use the roads. Don’t be an idiot. I was obviously talking about subsidized bus passes and taxi fare. Perhaps you don’t have those in Chicago. > [@](#): > > Tell me, is it hard work being such a hypocrite? I wouldn’t know. [QUOTE=curlcoat] and the list goes on. Does it occur to you that the ability of the taxpayer to pay for these things isn’t infinite? [/QUOTE] I noticed that you didn’t bother to answer this one, most likely because you don’t want to deal with the reality that there is only so much money to go around. Or, did you just want us to up the national debt to pay for these things? > [@](#): > > Well, sure, we’ll give you the right to give “a chunk of your income to pay for healthcare for all”, in fact, that is _exactly_ what we want! 😃 Aparently you have no idea what the difference between a right and a demand is. > [@](#): > > It’s not just ONE other country, it’s a LOT of other countries - UK, France, Germany, Denmark, Finland, Australia… bunches more. In fact, by NOT having UHC we get lumped in with such attractive places as China, India, um… let’s see… Zimbabwe, Somalia… Now, which one of any of those countries has the same population, land mass, private insurance companies and crap record of government run healthcare that we have? What is the percentage of poor to middle class to wealthy in UK, France, Germany, Denmark, Finland, Australia? What is their overhead for healthcare? See, you can’t just point at them and assume that because it works (?) there, it will work here. > [@](#): > > Retiring boomers will be going onto MEDICARE which is _already_ UHC for those over 65. Why is it OK for everyone over 65 to have a UHC in this country, but not anyone under 65? Because most folks over 65 don’t work so they don’t have the ability to get a group plan thru their employer, nor will they have the income to buy private since most retirees “earn” less than when they were working. Of course, that is you once again trying to turn aside a question you can’t answer, which was have you considered what is going to happen when a large section of our society retires and probably won’t be able to pay high taxes to support your UHC? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1213 "2009-07-22T05:14:08Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Oh boy, I just now saw the part where **curlcoat** claimed that her $10k of credit card limit is an excellent “reserve” in case she ever has a big medical emergency. HAW, HAW, HAW! First of all, the idea that having a high credit card limit is a good “reserve” for emergencies, and second, the idea that $10k would likely cover a major medical emergency. Pardon me… I have to find something to wipe my eyes, I’m laughing so hard. Perhaps you could read the whole thing so you don’t look like such an idiot? The discussion was on inability to pay medical bills at all. I also have far more in reserve than that - I could pull $200,000 out of our house if I had to, even after the crash, because we have made paying down the mortgage a priority. However, I would start with the credit cards because it is far easier to negotiate with them than with a bank that holds your equity loan. Perhaps you have never had an uninsured medical emergency you could afford to pay for? Remember that dog with the cancer? Aside from the disrespect over his importance, his treatment cost 10’s of thousands, wasn’t covered by any insurance and he went to specialtists that demanded payment at the time of service. Using our credit cards, which have low interest, was the safest way for us to pay for his treatment. Of course, we were able to pay it off fairly quickly by rearranging our budget, so we didn’t end up having to pay all that much in interest. But even so, it is far better to risk your credit rating than your house. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1214 "2009-07-22T05:26:18Z")
> [@Fuji](#): > > That’s not how I started off, you shit-brained mouthbreather. _You_ were the first one to throw out insults in our exchange in this thread, in your typical smarmy fashion. To you? > [@](#): > > In the case of your argument [_sic_], X = “having children” and Y = “government programs”. If this were true, then birth rates would be highest in those countries with advanced social welfare programs. However, as I showed earlier, the US has a birth rate _39.6% higher_than the European Union - which has 200 million more people than the US at a similar level of economic development, though with far more extensive social programs, including UHC. Ah. Another one that tries to take focus off of the real subject. Which is the birth rate among those living on welfare in the US, not other countries. For one thing, I said free government handouts and you show no stats on how many of the folks in the EU countries are getting their UHC for free. Nor any stats on how many of them are also getting free or reduced cost housing and food. > [@](#): > > Looking at the rest of the world, it can be seen that the world’s highest birth rates are found in the most impoverished and desperate nations. Which, of course, is for a totally different reason. So either you are too dumb to realize that or you are too dumb to even know that. > [@](#): > > You’re being disingenuous when you say, “I haven’t said that welfare cheats are bringing down the Republic”, because while you didn’t use that _exact_ phrasing, you certainly have expended an inordinate amount of energy denouncing “welfare cheats” as being both a major cause of present fiscal difficulties as well as a reason for the unfeasability of UHC in the US. And yet, “the Republic” stands. > [@](#): > > You’re being an imbecile when you assert that the fact that UHC works in other countries means nothing with regards to whether or not it would work in the US. It may not be conclusive evidence in favor of UHC in the US, but it certianly indicates a likelihood that it would. I take it that you haven’t bothered to notice that I say that _only_ claiming that UHC works in other countries is useless. > [@](#): > > Why can’t you at least be honest and admit that you’re against UHC, no matter what evidence and arguments are produced to support its passage? I am not against a UHC that I do not have to participate in. My sole problem with a UHC in the US is being forced to pay for it and/or have it for my only insurance option. > [@](#): > > The people who are born here might possibly be a “big tax drain” (I don’t accept that that is necessarily the case), but even if they are, they’re US citizens and thus legally equal members of the same society of which you also belong (despite your juvenile protestations). > > And again, you continue to show more of your trademark ignorance here. Try googling “illegal immigration Europe” some time before you spout off about why UHC wouldn’t work in the US. Spain and Italy, especially, have severe problems with illegal immigration, and yet still manage to provide UHC for their inhabitants. What does any of that have to do with what I said? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1215 "2009-07-22T05:28:38Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > You don’t _know_ from big medical bills. My dad spent a month in the hospital - most of it in intensive care - while they tried to keep him from dying from complications of an infection in his colon.\* The total hospital bill was over $500,000. That’s half a million dollars. Could you put that on your credit cards? I didn’t think so. No, but as I said upthread I could make a big dent in it and there are very few health providers that won’t take payments for the rest. Your father did not have insurance? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1216 "2009-07-22T05:31:36Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > The (new) topic with the most replies became the “I hate children” one only because she posted 340+ posts in it alone. Most of it was people arguing with her throughout the whole thing. And she still got the last word in that topic. She’ll probably have the last word in this one too, becauseshe never stops replying as long as people are replying to her. Any time you have the immature need to have the last word, you let me know. Otherwise, I will continue to assume that this board is the same as any other - people post, people respond. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1217 "2009-07-22T05:32:33Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > We are already doing that. How many of those children that grow up in subsidized housing, living on welfare even finish school much less become contributing members of society? Why don’t you look that up and get back to us? > [@](#): > > And how often do you think that this is a reason why someone had to declare bankruptcy? This is a big part of your problem - you assume that everyone who is having financial problems due to medical expenses must be a total innocent who would never go blow money on cars or houses they couldn’t afford instead of making sure their family has insurance. This is a big part of your problem-- you assume that everyone who is having financial problems due to medical expenses must be a freeloader or a spendthrift or a loser. > [@](#): > > We pay to feed folks and make sure that all of our water is clean already and we are deeply in debt. You want to add to this? Social programs that provide food and drinking water to poor people are [not why this country is in debt.](http://useconomy.about.com/od/fiscalpolicy/p/US_Debt.htm) You pulled that out of your ass. > [@](#): > > I noticed that you didn’t bother to answer this one, most likely because you don’t want to deal with the reality that there is only so much money to go around. Or, did you just want us to up the national debt to pay for these things? I’d rather we ended the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and used that money to pay for it. Or raised taxes on the wealthiest 1% of Americans. Something like that. > [@](#): > > See, you can’t just point at them and assume that because it works (?) there, it will work here. You can’t hand wave away the fact that those countries have better overall national health than the United States either, can you? Nor the fact that it does work, on a national scale, in many places. If we can’t use evidence that it works in other countries, and we can’t try it here, how can we say it will work here? What would prove it to you? > [@](#): > > Because most folks over 65 don’t work so they don’t have the ability to get a group plan thru their employer, nor will they have the income to buy private since most retirees “earn” less than when they were working. Too bad. They should either keep working so they can pay for their COBRA, or go without it. Why are they entitled to free health care? Aren’t they being irresponsible, if they haven’t saved up their money for this contingency that they knew was coming? This would be your line for everyone else, why not senior citizens also? > [@](#): > > Of course, that is you once again trying to turn aside a question you can’t answer, which was have you considered what is going to happen when a large section of our society retires and probably won’t be able to pay high taxes to support your UHC? What makes you think that taxes on the middle class will be raised to fund UHC? Cite please? ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1218 "2009-07-22T05:43:34Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Perhaps you could read the whole thing so you don’t look like such an idiot? The discussion was on inability to pay medical bills at all. I also have far more in reserve than that - I could pull $200,000 out of our house if I had to, even after the crash, because we have made paying down the mortgage a priority. However, I would start with the credit cards because it is far easier to negotiate with them than with a bank that holds your equity loan. > > Perhaps you have never had an uninsured medical emergency you could afford to pay for? Remember that dog with the cancer? Aside from the disrespect over his importance, his treatment cost 10’s of thousands, wasn’t covered by any insurance and he went to specialtists that demanded payment at the time of service. Using our credit cards, which have low interest, was the safest way for us to pay for his treatment. Of course, we were able to pay it off fairly quickly by rearranging our budget, so we didn’t end up having to pay all that much in interest. But even so, it is far better to risk your credit rating than your house. You don’t sound middle class to me. Sorry, you sound rather wealthy. I say this as a very thrifty person with low debt, but shit. Considering that you don’t work, you folks have a ton of money. Maybe you need to rethink what it means to be “middle class.” Most middle class people could not afford to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a dog. I’m not trying to be mean, that’s just a fact. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 10:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1219 "2009-07-22T10:30:42Z")
I have to say I am really, thoroughly impressed by the depths of curlcoat’s idiocy/delusion. Is it really possible to be so unaware of what SS is in this day and age? But let’s play devil’s advocate here. Let’s assume that SS works exactly how curlcoat thinks it does. If so, can you answer me this curlcoat: Have you made a note of exactly how much you have paid into SS over the years so that you can stop cashing the cheque when you have taken out exactly what you have put in? Do you have a projected date for when this will (or, indeed, did) happen? ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2009, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231/1220 "2009-07-22T10:52:59Z")
OK, the latest I’m seeing against UHC is that is is a “States rights” issue and that there is no “constitutional authority” to enact UHC. Have these already been mentioned here? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231.md?page=60) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-else-you-motherfuckers-need/503231.md?page=62)