# Anything wrong with woman having a "Sugar Daddy" & giving "girlfriend experience" & sex etc? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 29, 2015, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481 "2015-07-29T16:01:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/61 "2015-07-30T14:19:16Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Agreed 100%. And in a real world senario, from what I have seen, one party typically enters the “transaction” with the hope that it WILL develop into something more. Especially in a “But what if the guy is so lonely and can’t get a date?” scenario like offered upthread. You can’t tell me that he’s going to remain emotionally uninvested in this situation. > [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > There’s nothing illegal here, as long as they aren’t explicitly contracting to pay for sex acts. exchanging money for companionship, where sex is an implicit part of the whole package, isn’t illegal. I’m not sure that’s true. My understanding (albeit one I never had cause to investigate too deeply) is that those “You’re only paying for my TIME and if we just happen to really hit it off and have sex then that’s just something that happened!!” escort ads aren’t protecting anyone from a prostitution arrest. Cops having better things to do (and cops being more worried about streetwalkers than escorts) is what keeps them from being arrested. > [@Malthus](#): > > It may _appear_ to be the same superficially. The difference is that the relationship is the focus - if I lost all my money tomorrow, I know without a shadow of a doubt that my wife would stick by me, as I would stick by her if she lost her looks tomorrow (and, of course, vice versa). Exactly. The whole “marriage is just legal prostitution” comes across as bitter He-Man Woman Haters Club nonsense. That’s not to say that no marriage is based on that foundation but it’s not inclusive of all marriages nor of what most people would consider to be a good or healthy marriage. Anyway, back to the OP, I largely agree with those who say that if the guy’s goal is a piece of on-demand arm candy for social events and on-demand sex and they’re both on board with the plan then go for it. As a surrogate for a real relationship, it strikes me as pretty sad – pretty much the same as renting people to pretend to be your friends or renting people to pretend to be your family at the holidays. ---
**Author:** ![GrumpyBunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc8723/32.png) [@GrumpyBunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrumpyBunny)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/62 "2015-07-30T14:38:45Z")
Well, it’s not something I would want, but I can’t see any reason to outlaw it. And how would you police that versus a “real” relationship? > [@LSLGuy](#): > > It worked for him. I met some of them and it worked for them too. When he was done with any one of them he’d send them off with a nice going-away present, a new car or something. Heh, I just pictured the guy from “The Price is Right” saying, “The relationship is over…but you get a BRAND NEW CAR!” ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/63 "2015-07-30T15:03:01Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I’m not sure that’s true. My understanding (albeit one I never had cause to investigate too deeply) is that those “You’re only paying for my TIME and if we just happen to really hit it off and have sex then that’s just something that happened!!” escort ads aren’t protecting anyone from a prostitution arrest. Cops having better things to do (and cops being more worried about streetwalkers than escorts) is what keeps them from being arrested. Prostitution : the first meeting, the 2 parties meet in a motel and sit on the bed. An envelope of money is handed over. Within about 5 minutes after that, the clothes are generally off. Mistressing/Seeking Arrangement : the parties meet for a coffee date. He’s finding out if she looks like her pictures, she’s finding out if he’s rich as he says he is. A payment is made for this meeting. The parties meet at another date. And possibly and third and 4th one. Sex starts happening at the end of the 3rd or 4th date. It’s pretty clear that the money pays for more than sex. How much of it pays for the sex is not easy to calculate. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/64 "2015-07-30T15:05:25Z")
I’m mostly on the side of ‘don’t interfere with consenting adults who aren’t harming anybody.’ But there’s something I have a hard time squaring. People say that women nowadays are competing against unrealistic depictions of women in porn. If they want male attention, they feel pressured to be just as slender, alluring, flawless, hairless, and sexually experimental as the women in porn. This (I guess) is why my daily Facebook feed is interspersed with untouched, slightly chunky models underscribed with bristling comments admonishing me that “This is what REAL women look like”. Well, OK. I agree, stop yelling at me. So I’m concerned that the same dynamic would apply to prostitution. The pressure women feel to match an idealized sexual fantasy would not end in a committed relationship, or after having children, or having raised them to adulthood. Women would labor their entire lives under heightened pressure to be more sexually competitive with contract labor. Who benefits? Men, and young pretty women. That really looks like social & economic injustice to me. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/65 "2015-07-30T15:26:19Z")
> [@Habeed](#): > > It’s pretty clear that the money pays for more than sex. How much of it pays for the sex is not easy to calculate. If any of it pay for sex, it’s prostitution but that’s neither here nor there. I was simply saying that the phrase “you’re just paying for my companionship” isn’t necessarily a defense against a prostitution arrest. However, police aren’t really interested in things like escort services and especially arrangements like in the OP because it’s a pain in the ass to prove (weighing time/effort against a Class A misdemeanor) and they’re more interested in keeping the streets clean of hookers under the lampposts for public perception reasons than they’re worried about people with websites. That doesn’t mean that it’s not still illegal, it means that no one is willing to put forth the effort to do anything about it. It’s illegal to pay for sex or to receive payment for sex. Using a bunch of coding and plausible deniability might make it harder to prove (even to the point of not being worth the effort) but it doesn’t make it less illegal. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/66 "2015-07-30T15:32:50Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > Gross income. [sub]fish[/sub]Net income ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/67 "2015-07-30T15:35:07Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > There’s nothing illegal here, as long as they aren’t explicitly contracting to pay for sex acts. exchanging money for companionship, where sex is an implicit part of the whole package, isn’t illegal. Nothing wrong with it all then. Although I think law enforcement might try to make something of it under some circumstance, but I don’t hear much about them going after escort services which make the same claim. It’s not that much different from traditional relationships, just a little more specific about what the couple expect from each other. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/68 "2015-07-30T15:37:42Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > Isn’t the rich guy having a mistress practically traditional? A “traditional” mistress relationship tends to be at least partially based on actual affection, rather than just money on one side and lust on the other. Sure, she might leave if the market crashes, but she didn’t go into it because you promised to buy her a new Ferrari every year. A “traditional” mistress usually doesn’t meet you at a convention or website specializing in paid-for sex/companionship. The relationship evolves “naturally” over time after you meet in a bar or whatever. At least, that is my understanding. I’ve never been in a relationship of that nature. I suppose the counter is that a sugar baby is just more up front about her expectations. I’ve never been in one of those relationships either, but I know a few girls who paid for college that way. ---
**Author:** ![xizor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xizor/32/102_2.png) [@xizor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xizor)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/69 "2015-07-30T15:38:27Z")
> [@dracoi](#): > > Obviously, this line is blurry in all kinds of relationships, but if you’re responding to personal ads that say “I’ll be your girlfriend for $5000/month” then it’s not a gift. I made the mistake once of answering a personal ad BEFORE googling what “GFE” meant. Luckily I did so before I met her so no real harm, but I will say the conversation went very far before any gratuity was mentioned. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/70 "2015-07-30T15:45:15Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > If any of it pay for sex, it’s prostitution but that’s neither here nor there. I was simply saying that the phrase “you’re just paying for my companionship” isn’t necessarily a defense against a prostitution arrest. It is obvious that any marriage where one partner contributes more money than the other, at least some of that money is for the sex… ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/71 "2015-07-30T15:45:40Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > Well, it’s not something I would want, but I can’t see any reason to outlaw it. And how would you police that versus a “real” relationship? Same here. It’s emotionally fraught, though, especially when people (on either side) are going into such relationships because they have few options. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/72 "2015-07-30T15:47:12Z")
> [@Habeed](#): > > It is obvious that any marriage where one partner contributes more money than the other, at least some of that money is for the sex… Setting aside your rather immature notions of what a healthy relationship is like, Illinois state law (the only one I bothered to check) actually has an explicit exemption for spousal arrangements in its prostitution laws. Which I found a little amusing. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/73 "2015-07-30T15:47:51Z")
My wife has made far more than me for the vast majority of our relationship. Notwithstanding my unbustable bedroom chops, it certainly wasn’t for the sex. > [@](#): > > It’s emotionally fraught, though, especially when people (on either side) are going into such relationships because they have few options. FWIW, the sugar babies I knew had plenty of options. One was a successful model - successful in the local sense, at least as she earned as much as $100/hour to look good at car shows, parties, and the like, and only had to work about 15-20 hours a week to pay her bills. The other was a bank teller. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/74 "2015-07-30T16:12:16Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > In the “traditional” set-up, one married for reasons of family advancement, and then acquired a mistress on the side (more or less acknowledged depending on the culture at the time). > > In the OP, it is unmarried people (mostly I assume men) acquiring a “paid girlfriend” in lieu of marriage to anyone. My understanding is that quite often, “sugar daddies” are, in fact, married. However, the traditional mistress wasn’t supposed to be into it only for the money. Or was she? ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/75 "2015-07-30T16:14:02Z")
“Haha marriage is just prostitution” is a clever line, but not a great reflection of reality. If you have a wife today, she probably works. If you had a wife 50 years ago, she probably was engaged full time in housekeeping. If you had a wife 100 years ago, the two of you probably worked side by side on a farm. Outside of the very rich, households have never really had idle labor just sitting around. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/76 "2015-07-30T16:20:44Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > My understanding is that quite often, “sugar daddies” are, in fact, married. Undoubtedly. But that’s not what is being asked about in the OP. To quote: > [@](#): > > Objectively is there anything wrong or immoral about an adult woman entering into a relationship with a non-married adult man where she is paid a monthly stipend and (in addition) regular shopping sprees, fine dinners, etc. for being (effectively) a professional girlfriend to a well off man? In the context of her girlfriend duties she attends to his sexual and emotional needs and is available for him to take around on his schedule. This arrangement may involve her living in his residence or in a separate place of her own paid for by the man. > [@](#): > > However, the traditional mistress wasn’t supposed to be into it only for the money. Or was she? Again, that may well be true; the OP is asking about a “paid GF”, which seems to be all about the money. The relationship discussed in the OP is more like substituting a paid “girlfriend” for a guy (and I assume it could work with other gender/sex combos) who is otherwise unattached, to _take the place_ of such attachments. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/77 "2015-07-30T17:48:51Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > It’s not that much different from traditional relationships, just a little more specific about what the couple expect from each other. Yea, this. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/78 "2015-07-30T18:29:57Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > … > > > [@LSLGuy](#): > > > > It worked for him. I met some of them and it worked for them too. When he was done with any one of them he’d send them off with a nice going-away present, a new car or something. > > Heh, I just pictured the guy from “The Price is Right” saying, “The relationship is over…but you get a BRAND NEW CAR!” I realize you’re mostly kidding, but you fell into the trap so many others in this thread have. It was actually simply “Your services are no longer needed by the company. Your last day is today. Here is your severance payment. Good luck.” The word “relationship” has no place in arrangements like these. Using that word simply imports a bunch of inapplicable baggage from other aspects of our culture. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/79 "2015-07-30T18:34:18Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > I realize you’re mostly kidding, but you fell into the trap so many others in this thread have. > > It was actually simply “Your services are no longer needed by the company. Your last day is today. Here is your severance payment. Good luck.” > > The word “relationship” has no place in arrangements like these. Using that word simply imports a bunch of inapplicable baggage from other aspects of our culture. Well, I have a relationship with my employer and with the cat sitter, etc. It’s a generic word for me. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481/80 "2015-07-30T18:46:43Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Well, I have a relationship with… the cat sitter New category of porn in 3, 2, 1… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anything-wrong-with-woman-having-a-sugar-daddy-giving-girlfriend-experience-sex-etc/726481.md?page=5)