# AOC's "Green New Deal" pipe dream **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 8, 2019, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160 "2019-02-08T08:48:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/141 "2019-02-12T14:06:24Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > That’s it: the gay Scandinavian vegetarian who wants to end fossil fuel subsidies is the REAL enemy! :smack: Now who is being naive when confronted with certifiable guys that do get things wrong and never correct to get a narrative going? Sorry, that " :smack: " was applied to Lomborg first, (Literary, there is a chart and cartoon in the RealClimate \*\*\* cite -figure 3- where Lomborg is shown how he got one very crucial bit about ocean rise wrong, and not acknowledging it now is one of the many tactics that he uses to mislead others into thinking that the climate change issue is a “really NBD” camp.) If you had bothered to check the RealClimate cite and the early video you would had noticed the many misleading talking points Lomborg is involved with. Sure he has political and economic credentials \*\*, but messes even that when he has to press the general idea of his and other lukewarm contrarians that we should not see this as a big deal. > [@SlackerInc](#): > > Never mind all those fatcats in Texas and Oklahoma: you’ve got apostasy to root out, so your faction can be pure as the driven snow. Never mind if that might make it something less than a majority coalition: you can be smug in your moral superiority, above reproach and above the fray, while others actually run everything. Actually Lomborg is the poster child of guiding others into pipe dreams of complacency. Sure he gets things some bits right, but his repeated and never acknowledged errors that he makes in pursuit of his NBD message shows that he is what me and many others report: Just one of the late stage deniers that is only good by acknowledging the issue \*, but a lousy one to follow as he is certifiably worse in his mistakes than Ocasio-Cortez is. - In fact years ago Lomborg was torn to pieces in a few early discussions about climate in the SDMB, as noted, \*\*he is not being shredded for being an apostate, he was shredded for getting things wrong or for lying many times before. \*\* > **[Bjørn Lomborg](https://www.desmog.com/bjorn-lomborg/)** > > Bjørn Lomborg Credentials Background Bjørn Lomborg is a political scientist, economist, and the founder and president of the Copenhagen Consensus Center (CCC). Lomborg’s Copenhagen Consensus Center (CCC) was founded in 2006 in... > [@](#): > > Background > > Bjørn Lomborg is a political scientist, economist and the founder and president of the Copenhagen Consensus Center (CCC). Lomborg’s Copenhagen Consensus Center (CCC) was founded in 2006 in Denmark and registered as a non-profit organization in the United States in 2008. The center has attracted more than $4 million in funding since 2008. A DeSmog investigation found that the CCC received at least $200,000 in 2013 from “vulture capitalist” Paul Singer’s charitable foundation. [2], [1], [86] > > According to his website, [Lomborg.com](http://Lomborg.com), Bjorn Lomborg is also a visiting professor at the Copenhagen Business School. He received his Ph. D. in Political Science at the University of Copenhagen in 1994. [1] > > Lomborg is best known as the author of The Skeptical Environmentalist and Cool It, two books that downplay the risks of global warming. Despite these publications, Lomborg does not have a background in climate science and has published no peer-reviewed articles on climate change. > [@](#): > > Lomborg’s Errors > > Lomborg’s errors in his discussion of climate change have been documented by many sources including A 2010 book published by Yale University Press titled The Lomborg Deception: Setting the Record Straight About Global Warming. > > Lomborg-errors.dk is a website focused on documenting his errors, although it does not appear to have been recently updated. It also maintains a timeline documenting the events leading to Lomborg’s fame, and how he is regarded among his fellow Danes. [4] So, yeah, I will have to insist here on a very basic question: Who or what source told you to follow that misleader? \*\* Really, Lomborg’s background is in **political science** and some economics, he is not a climate scientist. \*\*\* RealClimate BTW is made by real climate scientists. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/142 "2019-02-12T16:56:50Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Let’s look at the sentence you quoted in context: You admit you’re a racist, but you reckon that’s ok because you think you’re racist in a good way. Yeah, you can get straight to fuck with that nonsense. Still, some progress made. You’ve not tried to defend the fact that you think global warming is no big deal, and that colonialism wasn’t that bad. So let’s get onto the one you want to try to wiggle out of. You’re “not adamant that we can’t have a universal health care entitlement here”. You just dismiss the Canada model out of hand, say that the UK model won’t work, and then go on to dismiss any other model on the ground that for some reason the US can’t possibly achieve the same economies of scale that everywhere that’s implemented it has achieved. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/143 "2019-02-12T17:17:12Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > the gay Scandinavian vegetarian who wants to end fossil fuel subsidies is the REAL enemy! See, I’m trying to work out if this fallacy is more of a non sequitur (on the grounds that the person’s sexual preferences, nationality and diet have absolutely no fucking relevance here) or an ad hominem (as I’m guessing you’re trying to imply that the fact that he’s gay, Scandinavian and vegetarian make his argument more worthy. It’s a relatively little known fact that “to the person” fallacies don’t just mean negative traits) Either way it’s complete fuckwittery, but what’s new there. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/144 "2019-02-12T21:55:22Z")
Gary, people have from time to time accused me of trying to make these Pit threads all about me. I always counter that I’m just responding to others who are flinging their shit at me like monkeys in a cage. Thank you for perfectly illustrating my point. You really need to examine your priorities, in the age of Trump and McConnell (thankfully no longer of Ryan), when you relentlessly attack someone who always votes Democratic; who gives money (from his limited supply) every two years to the DCCC, DSCC, the state DFL, and to various individual Democrats running in competitive races; and who also volunteers for GOTV every two years, knocking on doors and calling people to exhort them to go to the polls and cast a DFL ballot. Someone who vociferously opposes virtually every GOP proposal or initiative. Seriously, Mark Shields is right once again about Democrats and circular firing squads. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/145 "2019-02-12T22:04:54Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Gary, people have from time to time accused me of trying to make these Pit threads all about me. I always counter that I’m just responding to others who are flinging their shit at me like monkeys in a cage. Thank you for perfectly illustrating my point. > > You really need to examine your priorities, in the age of Trump and McConnell (thankfully no longer of Ryan), when you relentlessly attack someone who always votes Democratic; who gives money (from his limited supply) every two years to the DCCC, DSCC, the state DFL, and to various individual Democrats running in competitive races; and who also volunteers for GOTV every two years, knocking on doors and calling people to exhort them to go to the polls and cast a DFL ballot. Someone who vociferously opposes virtually every GOP proposal or initiative. Seriously, Mark Shields is right once again about Democrats and circular firing squads. :smack: Virtually every, other than ones dealing with healthcare, the environment, or racial equality. Those you rail against, but then, complain that people are disagreeing with you because you claim to be a democrat. It’s the usual cop-out for you. “How dare you criticize me for being a racist, I voted for Obama!” (I bet you would have voted for him a third time if you could have, amiright?) But, you do seem to be enjoying having shit flung at you, so, as you are standing there, covered in shit, well, that means you’re winning? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/146 "2019-02-12T22:09:57Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > You really need to examine your priorities, in the age of Trump and McConnell (thankfully no longer of Ryan), when you relentlessly attack someone who always votes Democratic; who gives money every two years to the DCCC, DSCC, the state DFL, and to various individual Democrats running in competitive races; and who also volunteers for GOTV every two years, knocking on doors and calling people to exhort them to go to the polls and cast a DFL ballot. Someone who vociferously opposes virtually every GOP proppsal or initiative. Oh good, you’re back to “Hey I’m on your side really” as a defense. As previously pointed out, ad hominem is no better a support for a position than it is a criticism. I could no more give a flying fuck about which party you reckon is yours, your donations, or your volunteering than I could about your nationality, sexuality or diet. You are, by your stated beliefs, a sniveling idiot with delusions of adequacy. If you want to prove otherwise, I suggest you do it by not hiding behind causes you think will make you look worthy. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/147 "2019-02-12T22:27:14Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Virtually every, other than ones dealing with healthcare, the environment, or racial equality. More bullshit. Please cite the posts where I have supported “GOP proposal(s) or initiative(s)” “dealing with healthcare, the environment, or racial equality”. :dubious: (Hint for you: I didn’t say “I support all the proposals floated by people on the left wing of the Democratic Party”, only that I oppose virtually everything the GOP supports.) ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/148 "2019-02-13T01:18:12Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > More bullshit. Please cite the posts where I have supported “GOP proposal(s) or initiative(s)” “dealing with healthcare, the environment, or racial equality”. :dubious: _crickets_ Yeah, that’s what I thought. Your silence speaks volumes. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/149 "2019-02-13T12:59:58Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > And in this case it’s just ten or fifteen minutes of audio! So it’s shorter than any of those other things, and can–again–be consumed while busy doing other things. Not really, and not with the same level of comprehension I can expect from the written word. If a written text contains a word I do not know, I can look it up easily. If a speech in English contains a word I don’t know, or some mumblings, I’m SOL. I can read an amount of text equivalent to a 15 minute speech in about 2 minutes, so kiss my ass. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/150 "2019-02-13T13:45:56Z")
The only thing that puzzles me about this thread is why anyone _doesn’t_ have the OP on ignore. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/151 "2019-02-13T13:47:24Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > See, I’m trying to work out if this fallacy is more of a non sequitur (on the grounds that the person’s sexual preferences, nationality and diet have absolutely no fucking relevance here) or an ad hominem (as I’m guessing you’re trying to imply that the fact that he’s gay, Scandinavian and vegetarian make his argument more worthy. It’s a relatively little known fact that “to the person” fallacies don’t just mean negative traits) > > Either way it’s complete fuckwittery, but what’s new there. Yep, there is that, I have to add that I was not aware of Lomborg being gay or vegetarian, as you pointed out that is really meaningless for the matter at hand. What it should be important is to be able to see who is propping up lukewarmers that mislead others and to check how do their peers see him. We can see that the real crickets come from the OP not wanting to reveal who told him that Lomborg was an important guy to defend and to ignore his (in generall) misleading efforts. As we know, Lomborg is not a climate scientist or was an expert in the economics of the issue. So could one assume that close peers such as serious political and economical organizations would had, at least, a lukewarm opinion of Lomborg, no? Oh dear… > **[Bjorn Lomborg’s lukewarmer misinformation about climate change and poverty -...](https://www.lse.ac.uk/GranthamInstitute/news/bjorn-lomborgs-lukewarmer-misinformation-about-climate-change-and-poverty/)** > > On 27 August, the ‘New York Post’ published an article by Dr Bjorn Lomborg that was filled with misrepresentations and... > [@](#): > > Bjorn Lomborg’s lukewarmer misinformation about climate change and poverty > > On 27 August, the ‘New York Post’ published an article by Dr Bjorn Lomborg that was filled with misrepresentations and false claims, under the headline ‘How the war on climate change slams the world’s poor’. > > Dr Lomborg is the world’s most active ‘lukewarmer’. He does not deny the physics of the greenhouse effect, but instead cherry-picks information to deny that the risks of climate change are large enough to justify strong and urgent action. > > He has been promoting the article heavily on social media, including Facebook, Linked In and Twitter. In particular, Dr Lomborg highlighted his article with a tweet that states: “A new study has found that strong global climate action would cause far more hunger and food insecurity than climate change itself”. > > However, the paper to which Dr Lomborg referred, on ‘Risk of increased food insecurity under stringent global climate change mitigation policy’ by Dr Tomoko Hasegawa and co-authors, did not reach the conclusion that he suggested. > [@](#): > > Neither of the figures cited is credible. His estimate of the supposed cost of the European Union implementing its nationally determined contribution to the Paris Agreement was taken from the written testimony (PDF) solicited from Dr Lomborg in December 2015 by Republican climate change deniers on the United States House of Representatives Committee on Science, Space, and Technology. However, he has never explained how the figure was calculated, but claimed that it was based on a study for the Stanford Energy Modeling Forum, which produced results differing markedly from Dr Lomborg’s number. > > Dr Lomborg’s suggestion that the European Union’s contribution would only reduce global warming by 0.09 Fahrenheit degrees by the end of the century is based on a fundamentally flawed paper in which he assumed that all efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions are abandoned after 2030. His paper has been debunked many times, but he continues to cite it. > [@](#): > > Dr Lomborg now has a long track record of being an unreliable and inaccurate source of information about climate change. He devotes most of his writing efforts to churning out polemics for the opinion columns of newspapers which fail to fact-check his false claims. It is no surprise that his latest article appears in the ‘New York Post’. It is owned by News Corporation, whose stable of newspapers, including ‘The Australian’, ‘The Times’ and the ‘Wall Street Journal’, promote climate change denial while the parent company boasts of its efforts to reduce its greenhouse gas emissions. From **The London School of Economics and Political Science** , news and commentary section in 2018. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/152 "2019-02-13T14:23:23Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > _crickets_ > > Yeah, that’s what I thought. Your silence speaks volumes. Yeah, it speaks the volumes that I am not at your beck and call. Some of us have a life outside of here. I play around with you guys when I have time and am feeling a bit bored during the day, but I do not devote any more time here than I have to spend at this desk. Your impatient post speaks volumes about your pathetic desperation for attention, and a belief that people care far more about what you say and think than anyone actually does. > [@SlackerInc](#): > > More bullshit. Please cite the posts where I have supported “GOP proposal(s) or initiative(s)” “dealing with healthcare, the environment, or racial equality”. :dubious: (Hint for you: I didn’t say “I support all the proposals floated by people on the left wing of the Democratic Party”, only that I oppose virtually everything the GOP supports.) The easiest way to do that would be to simply make a link to your user profile. You fight against Democratic proposals dealing with healthcare, the environment, and racial equality. If you are fighting against those then you are supporting the opposition. I’m not sure what is so hard for you to understand about that. Global warming not being a big deal is a GOP position, and it is yours. UHC not being able to function in the US is a GOP position, and it is yours. Racism is a GOP position, and you support that. Can you show a single post where you have supported the democratic position on any of these matters? _crickets_ ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/153 "2019-02-13T20:45:37Z")
I already did exactly that, just upthread. :rolleyes: > [@Nava](#): > > I can read an amount of text equivalent to a 15 minute speech in about 2 minutes, so kiss my ass. :smack: Why do people keep comparing the speed of podcasts to that of reading? I listen to a lot of podcasts, but never at a time when I could read something. That time (again, while cooking, working out, or driving/biking/walking somewhere) is in competition with music, not with written text. GIGO, there’s no conspiracy here despite your dark intimations. I honestly don’t know where exactly I heard about Lomborg, but it was in the mainstream media. Not from whatever dark corners you are implying. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/154 "2019-02-13T21:55:56Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Why do people keep comparing the speed of podcasts to that of reading? Because, as I explained already, reading (especially reading electronic texts online) is the standard and most efficient way for people to access information **that they want to analyze and/or debate accurately and in detail** (especially via online forums). Reading electronic versions of text on the internet is what you do when you want to be able quickly and accurately to quote or dispute or corroborate a particular statement in the text, to skim and cross-reference within the text, to check the documentation of statements within the text, to survey and understand the overall structure of the text, to connect parts of the text with visual/graphical interpretations of data, and so forth. All of those things are far more time-consuming and cumbersome to do with an audio recording of a podcast, unless you’ve memorized the entire spoken text of the podcast verbatim (which in itself takes quite a bit of time for most people). > [@SlackerInc](#): > > I listen to a lot of podcasts, but never at a time when I could read something. That time (again, while cooking, working out, or driving/biking/walking somewhere) is in competition with music, not with written text. Then your ability to critically debate or analyze the content of the podcasts is limited to whatever fragments of it you are able to accurately remember after listening to it, while also being somewhat distracted by the requirements of cooking or exercising or traveling. Unless, that is, you go back to the podcast recording, probably multiple times and with some kind of transcription device, and churn through it laboriously extracting all the relevant details that you missed or forgot from your original hearing of it. (And thanks for putting in that work to transcribe part of the Pesca podcast, btw. Your transcription work is appreciated, but I’m pretty sure it wasn’t particularly fast compared to reading a text that’s already in written form, and you most likely couldn’t combine it with cooking/working out/driving etc.) For the _n_th time, we are comparing podcast-listening to reading **in terms of their usefulness as a basis for informative debate and analysis**. There is absolutely nothing wrong with you or anybody else liking to listen to an interesting podcast as an alternative to music while you’re otherwise occupied. But there is a whole lot wrong with **you expecting other people to meaningfully discuss the content of the podcast based solely on (inevitably) incomplete and erroneous memories of having listened to it once.** TL;DR: Yes, you (generic “you”) certainly can listen to a podcast conveniently and efficiently as a one-off “infotainment” experience while busy with something else. **But you can’t retain enough of the content of the podcast that way to make you capable of discussing its statements in an intelligent, informed and accurate manner.** ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/155 "2019-02-13T22:07:01Z")
I just don’t _get_ podcasts. I’ve tried. After about 30-45 seconds, it starts to feel like I’m being lectured. And when I get lectured, I tune out very quickly. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/156 "2019-02-13T22:09:16Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > :smack: Why do people keep comparing the speed of podcasts to that of reading? I listen to a lot of podcasts, but never at a time when I could read something. And when you are sitting in front of the computer engaging in message board discussions, that is the time you COULD read something. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/157 "2019-02-13T22:12:07Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > I just don’t _get_ podcasts. I’ve tried. After about 30-45 seconds, it starts to feel like I’m being lectured. And when I get lectured, I tune out very quickly. That too. As I noted, even if you **enjoy** listening to informative exposition instead of reading it, listening is a far less efficient and less convenient way of accessing the information in usable form. And many people don’t even enjoy the listening experience in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2019, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/158 "2019-02-14T00:22:13Z")
You’re right: I guess that’s why podcasts are a tiny niche that will fade away soon enough. Oh, wait: > **[The Podcasting Revenue Boom Has Started](https://www.strategy-business.com/article/The-Podcasting-Revenue-Boom-Has-Started)** > > As advertising revenues begin to catch up with the growth of the medium, podcasting is building the infrastructure of a billion-dollar media industry. > [@](#): > > The number of podcast listeners — defined as those who have listened to at least one podcast in the past month — surged to 78 million by the end of 2017, up from 23 million in 2013, according to the E&M Outlook​. Simultaneously, the podcast universe has exploded to more than 500,000 shows, and the quality of the content and production values have gone up, as well. And those 78 million are disproportionately younger adults. If anyone digs up this thread in 20 or 30 years, you naysayers are going to look silly. Or at least like old-fogey sticks-in-the-mud. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > Global warming not being a big deal is a GOP position, and it is yours. Nice try at goalpost moving, but from what I can see the GOP position is that global warming is not really happening, or that if it is it’s just part of natural climate cycles–that it isn’t a result of human industrial activity, and therefore there is nothing we can do to change it. I strongly disagree with all of that, and I have said so repeatedly. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > Global warming not being a big deal is a GOP position, and it is yours. UHC not being able to function in the US is a GOP position, and it is yours. Racism is a GOP position, and you support that. > Can you show a single post where you have supported the democratic position on any of these matters? > _crickets_ Nope, no crickets here. Indeed, I can show far more than a single post. Buckle in: > [@Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, on How to Pay for Medicare for All](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/500): > > I’m \*not \*adamant that we can’t have a universal health care entitlement here. I believe it is a human rights imperative that we do. > [@Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, on How to Pay for Medicare for All](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/380): > > Still, we pay too much and it’s wrong to have millions uninsured. I should know, because I was one of the ranks of the uninsured for well over a decade. And then I rejoiced at the passage of Obamacare > [@Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, on How to Pay for Medicare for All](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/380): > > The upshot: We need to do better by our citizens and make access to health care universal. > [@Political Compass says Obama is on the far right](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-compass-says-obama-is-on-the-far-right/638820/42): > > While they were in those seats, they voted for Pelosi and the rest of the Democratic leadership, whcih makes a big difference; and they agreed to an admittedly watered-down compromise version of HCR which is still a half a loaf and still better than none. The Republicans who replaced them would not have voted for any kind of HCR, so how can you say it makes no difference? Those were as far left as those districts were ever going to go: our best case scenario. > [@Political Compass says Obama is on the far right](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-compass-says-obama-is-on-the-far-right/638820/42): > > To me, public policy as concerns race prejudice is one of the most important ways in which I judge presidents. So before LBJ, there’s really only one president who impresses me, and that’s Ulysses Grant. (Truman gets an honourable mention for desegregating the armed forces, and JFK gets an “incomplete” but I have my doubts about whether he would have gone as far as LBJ did.) And the fact that Grant was president more than a half century earlier than FDR says that the “for their time” standard is not a fair yardstick after all. > [@Who counts as a "Southerner"?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-counts-as-a-southerner/667540/82): > > The fact still remains that some states have a history in modern times and living memory of pushing toward progress and others have a track record of resisting it. The vast majority of white Mississippians seem hellbent on fighting tooth and nail against modernity; but then they whine that they are being “stereotyped” when anyone else points this out. Can’t have it both ways, guys. > [@Who counts as a "Southerner"?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-counts-as-a-southerner/667540/80): > > LBJ racked up a huge blowout win nationally against Goldwater, but in Mississippi he got 12 percent of the vote. Johnson also lost Georgia, South Carolina, and Louisiana, but he at least got over 40% in each state. Mississippi is clearly a special, special place, even within the Deep South. > Then there’s Trent Lott, who had to resign his Majority Leader position because he harkened fondly back to segregation; but Mississippians kept voting him back in. > In Virginia, a “Macaca” crack was enough to torpedo a rising star’s career. In Mississippi, Haley Barbour can say all kinds of [fucked up racist shit](http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2010/12/20/haley-barbours-praise-of-citizen-councils-stirs-debate-about-racism.html)and keep getting reelected. And here are some other various posts showing my Democratic bonafides: > [@The Nancy Pelosi appreciation thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nancy-pelosi-appreciation-thread/827907/110): > > Pelosi is awesome, and I’ve long been mystified, and frustrated, that she hasn’t gotten more credit as a trailblazer (and extremely effective Speaker). We still haven’t had a woman president, and that’s not right; but we’ve had a female Speaker and now have one again, and that’s a HUGE deal. > [@Feel the #extortion Bernie has planned](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feel-the-extortion-bernie-has-planned/750443/477): > > Bernheads who won’t support Hillary in the fall are like the husband who expects his wife to be faithful to him, but has no sense of reciprocity about his own behavior. > [@Inner city schools are not failing their students](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inner-city-schools-are-not-failing-their-students/672758/1): > > I believe teachers unions are a good thing, and that the vast majority of teachers do a good job for moderate pay.attention. > [@What would you consider a "big win" for Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-consider-a-big-win-for-obama/638785/14): > > This is bunk. A lot of people, especially conservatives, believe this; but it is almost certainly factually wrong and thus a huge insult to Obama. > [@What would you consider a "big win" for Obama](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-consider-a-big-win-for-obama/638785/14): > > I love Obama (and my fondness has not lessened one bit over the past four years BTW) > [@Profits are a tax on labor](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/profits-are-a-tax-on-labor/663283/118): > > I dispute whether 100% would result in zero revenues; but the real point on Laffer is whether there is or was any government in existence that had income rates at such a level that lowering them would result in greater revenue for the government. And it is my belief that in the real world, that has never been the case. > [@Profits are a tax on labor](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/profits-are-a-tax-on-labor/663283/112): > > No. Try to imagine a much smaller number of people on a desert island like Gilligans Island or something. Can Mr. and Mrs. Howell just sit back and have everyone else feed and clothe and house them while they do nothing to feed, clothe, and house anyone else, just because they have a chest full of money that their parents gave them? > [@Fuck You, Vote Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-vote-democrat/824019/99): > > I You need to vote Democratic this time and in 2020 to censure the president and make it clear it’s not acceptable to have a lying, low information, conspiracy-mongering buffoon in the Oval Office. > [@Why do liberals hate suburbs?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-liberals-hate-suburbs/664965/12): > > You can’t say all liberals march in lockstep on anything, but this is as solid a correlation as any. > Suburbs kill the environment; they are individualistic yet obliterate regional culture at the same time; they are traditionally less ethnically diverse (and created in many cases by “white flight”); they are not friendly to bicycling and walking; they are unsophisticated and crassly commercial in their architecture; they lack most of the cultural amenities found in a core city. What’s not to dislike? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2019, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/159 "2019-02-14T00:32:49Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > GIGO, there’s no conspiracy here despite your dark intimations. I honestly don’t know where exactly I heard about Lomborg, but it was in the mainstream media. Not from whatever dark corners you are implying. The usual place I notice him popping up is in The WSJ and Fox news. Yep, still dark. [https://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2015/02/03/bjorn-lomborg-did-not-get-facts-straight](https://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2015/02/03/bjorn-lomborg-did-not-get-facts-straight) [https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/2011/07/12/fox-misidentifies-bjorn-lomborg-as-a-scientist/181319](https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/2011/07/12/fox-misidentifies-bjorn-lomborg-as-a-scientist/181319) No, in reality you still have to come clean, and not for the silly reason of “purity”, the teachable moment here is that you fell hook line and sinker for misleader. And it is very important for you and others to realize how propaganda has worked and continues to work to prop up guys that even fool mainstream media (although the big ones seem to fall less for people like him nowadays), of course for some media from the right it is clear that they love to hear the lies and let it percolate to a lot of people. The point here is that, like 538 did on their way of being one of the more accurate poll checkers, one has to also clean up one’s sources. Right now you are like a guy that has a garden in trouble and thinks that the Potato Beetles passing by are helping making things better. [https://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2015/02/03/bjorn-lomborg-did-not-get-facts-straight](https://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2015/02/03/bjorn-lomborg-did-not-get-facts-straight) > [@](#): > > Bjorn Lomborg > > “On average, global warming is not going to harm the developing world.” > > A self-styled “skeptical environmentalist” who brandishes a Greenpeace T-shirt as evidence of his unassailable environmental bona fides, Lomborg represents an insidious form of climate change denial. He doesn’t dismiss the scientific evidence outright; he denies the seriousness of the threat and the monumental nature of the effort required to avert it. His arguments often have a veneer of credibility, but he lowballs climate projections and underestimates the potential damage and cost. In one op-ed, he stated that “a 20-foot rise in sea levels . . . would inundate about 16,000 square miles of coastline, where more than 400 million people live. That’s a lot of people, to be sure, but hardly all of mankind.” What’s 400 million people among friends? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2019, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160/160 "2019-02-14T00:33:47Z")
Crap, missed the edit window–but the quote that talks about teachers unions and ends with “pay.attention” was an error in cutting and pasting that I missed. Mea culpa, my apologies. The quote should properly end with “pay.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/aocs-green-new-deal-pipe-dream/829160.md?page=9)