# Apocalypse Now: Who was the civilian? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 20, 2013, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449 "2013-06-20T10:02:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Lungfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d78d45/32.png) [@Lungfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lungfish)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/21 "2013-06-20T20:03:15Z")
Personally I think he looks like Teller from “Penn and Teller” but with gray hair. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/22 "2013-06-20T20:08:22Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Why would someone from the Culinary Institute of America want Kurtz dead? Did he diss somebody’s roux? Now, now. It could’ve been the Cleveland Institute of Art: [http://www.cia.edu/](http://www.cia.edu/) Since the guy is Asian in appearance, I always thought he might be with the South Vietnamese military or intelligence service. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/23 "2013-06-20T21:37:10Z")
The guy’s not Asian in appearance, nor would it make sense for capt. Willard to be taking orders to terminate a US officer with extreme prejudice from South Vietnamese intelligence or military, in the presence of other US troops. Honestly, I think he might be CIA. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/24 "2013-06-20T21:58:54Z")
> [@Svejk\_1](#): > > The guy’s not Asian in appearance… I meant SOUTH Asian – that is, that certain kind of north Indian or maybe Pakistani who looks quite “Caucasian” – but you are right, I was wrong. Turns out he’s half Dutch, half Wisconsin (German, I presume). But with a good Philippine tan in 1977 or 1978. ---
**Author:** ![Airmobile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a87d85/32.png) [@Airmobile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airmobile)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/25 "2019-07-07T12:23:57Z")
I know this post is nearly 7 years old but after a long time studying the vietnam war I’m pretty sure he was working for the south vietnamese government considering Kurtz killed a “vietnamese intelligence agent” that he "suspected of being a double agent"😁 I’m watching it right now, and wondered what the people of the www thought about it. So I google searched and found this forum, signed up and replied to this here thread. Much love guys thanks for having me. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/26 "2019-07-07T14:18:51Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Why would someone from the Culinary Institute of America want Kurtz dead? Did he diss somebody’s roux? Because Kurtz was undercutting meat prices. 7 cents a pound for top sirloin! Whole sides of beef for .99! Porlips 7 cents a pound! His methods had become…unsound. The Meatcutters Protective Association in concert with the CIA, got Dullard to…you know…take him out. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/27 "2019-07-07T16:37:09Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Because Kurtz was undercutting meat prices. 7 cents a pound for top sirloin! Whole sides of beef for .99! Porlips 7 cents a pound! His methods had become…unsound. The Meatcutters Protective Association in concert with the CIA, got Dullard to…you know…take him out. Hence his wariness about errand boys, sent by grocery clerks, to collect a bill. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/28 "2019-07-07T16:51:08Z")
> [@Airmobile](#): > > Much love guys thanks for having me. Welcome aboard. I personally maintain it’s more likely that “Jerry” was intended to represent the CIA, but the world is full of “men in black” types who, even if not literally wearing black, are dressed in civilian clothes and giving orders to military officers, with a mysterious governmental authority the officers know to respect. ---
**Author:** ![Sefton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Sefton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sefton)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/29 "2019-07-07T19:10:06Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Because Kurtz was undercutting meat prices. 7 cents a pound for top sirloin! Whole sides of beef for .99! Porlips 7 cents a pound! His methods had become…unsound. The Meatcutters Protective Association in concert with the CIA, got Dullard to…you know…take him out. The horror! The horror! ---
**Author:** ![Tinker\_Grey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tinker_grey/32/8136_2.png) [@Tinker\_Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tinker_Grey)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/30 "2019-07-07T19:46:34Z")
> [@Sefton](#): > > The horror! The horror! You misheard. It was “The hors d’oeuvres; the hors d’oeuvres.” ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/31 "2019-07-07T21:11:49Z")
> [@Tinker\_Grey](#): > > You misheard. It was “The hors d’oeuvres; the hors d’oeuvres.” Thank you. I needed a good laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/32 "2019-07-07T21:13:27Z")
He was … Harrison Ford. Really though, I always took it as a given that he was CIA. ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/33 "2019-07-07T21:15:50Z")
> [@Airmobile](#): > > I know this post is nearly 7 years old but after a long time studying the vietnam war I’m pretty sure he was working for the south vietnamese government considering Kurtz killed a “vietnamese intelligence agent” that he "suspected of being a double agent"😁 I’m watching it right now, and wondered what the people of the www thought about it. So I google searched and found this forum, signed up and replied to this here thread. > > Much love guys thanks for having me. Welcome! Are you watcing the original or Redux? The original is one of my all time favorites. If you search, there is a long thread about the film. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/34 "2019-07-07T21:16:59Z")
I watched the Redux and thought it was terrible. The original version had it just right. ---
**Author:** ![Tinker\_Grey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tinker_grey/32/8136_2.png) [@Tinker\_Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tinker_Grey)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/35 "2019-07-07T23:12:38Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > I watched the Redux and thought it was terrible. The original version had it just right. “Terrible” is a bit much. Suffered from a lack of editing … Hence, the brilliant original. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/36 "2019-07-07T23:20:29Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Why would someone from the Culinary Institute of America want Kurtz dead? Did he diss somebody’s roux? Worse. He ate it before the guy got a chance to use it, and his bechamel was ruined. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2019, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/37 "2019-07-07T23:32:23Z")
> [@Tinker\_Grey](#): > > “Terrible” is a bit much. Suffered from a lack of editing … Hence, the brilliant original. “Terrible” is being kind. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2019, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/38 "2019-07-08T12:27:23Z")
Re-dux is a good example of why you have to cut stuff even if it’s good material on it’s own. You have to stick to your main story and let other things fall to the side. Scenes like stealing the surfboard, chillin’ with the bunnies and dinner at the plantation are good on their own and fill in details but they don’t help further the story. They really should only be included as a “Deleted Scenes” feature. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2019, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449/39 "2019-07-08T13:11:13Z")
What do you expect? The original cut was made by Hollywood’s most talented director at the top of his game; Redux was edited by a has-been. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apocalypse-now-who-was-the-civilian/661449.md?page=1)