# Apparent nuclear fusion power breakthrough -- net energy gain (breaking news 11 Dec 22) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** breaking-news, science-math\ **Created:** [December 11, 2022, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349 "2022-12-11T22:43:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/121 "2023-01-16T11:03:29Z")
> [@Morgyn](#): > > I was under the impression that a fusion reaction was self-sustaining once it got started, but the Livermore scientist said they’d need hundreds of ignitions every day to keep it going. This is inertial confinement. Each “shot” is a separate ignition and power-generating (not that harvesting energy from this is easy) event, as opposed to magnetic confinement (tokamak), which is intended to keep running, assuming you can get more fuel in. There are other methods too. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/122 "2023-01-16T12:29:17Z")
Ah! Thank you. I think they said there were others working on magnetic confinement. That sounds more promising. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/123 "2023-01-16T12:58:03Z")
So far, gravity confinement seems the most promising. ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/124 "2023-01-16T13:49:36Z")
On the other hand the stellar-mass is constantly beaming power to us and we know how to catch and use it. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/125 "2023-01-16T17:45:02Z")
> [@Frodo](#): > > we know how to catch and use it. We have actually been doing that for a few alautuns now. ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/126 "2023-01-16T18:26:14Z")
“And with strange alautuns even death can die” (what’s an alautun?) ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/127 "2023-01-16T18:46:13Z")
> [@Frodo](#): > > what’s an alautun? It is the sixth extended order of the Mayan long count calendar. Each order is 20 of the subsequent order: a _katun_ is 20 _tun_, or just under 2 decades; a _baktun_ is 20 _katun_ (close to 4 centuries), etc. The _alautun_ is the highest named order, a bit under 64 million years. ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/128 "2023-01-16T18:47:47Z")
> [@Frodo](#): > > alautun Thanks! Ignorance fought. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/129 "2023-01-16T22:58:45Z")
> [@Morgyn](#): > > This does not sound self-sustaining. They were referring to government funding. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/130 "2023-01-16T23:56:10Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > They were referring to government funding. Thread win. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/131 "2023-02-28T06:19:13Z")
[This Article on BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/business-64553796) describes inertial confinement fuel pellet manufacture. It is a very exacting artificial diamond process that yields as many as 40 pellets every 2 months. Each pellet represents about a millisecond of fusion reaction, so, if this is the way to go, they had best be improving the efficiency at this end. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2023, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/132 "2023-12-21T11:09:29Z")
Does this have anything to do with anything? [https://edition.cnn.com/2023/12/20/climate/nuclear-fusion-energy-breakthrough-replicate-climate/index.html](https://edition.cnn.com/2023/12/20/climate/nuclear-fusion-energy-breakthrough-replicate-climate/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2023, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/133 "2023-12-21T11:43:57Z")
Aside from being a sloppily written article with little substance, it is just saying that LLNL did again the thing they did before; produced slightly over-unity fusion power (compared to the power that went directly into heating the plasma via an enormously inefficient laser ignition system) with no way to extract the output energy or convert it into electricity, nor is this a method which can be ‘scaled up’ to provide continuous power or operated at some marginal cost even if it could generate usable energy. The article finishes off with mentions of COP28, climate change, and quotes from John Kerry and Secretary of Energy Jennifer Granholm to give the impression that viable electrical power production by nuclear fusion is virtually around the corner even though this is as far from the case as ever. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/134 "2023-12-22T01:58:13Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > The article finishes off with mentions of COP28, climate change, and quotes from John Kerry and Secretary of Energy Jennifer Granholm to give the impression that viable electrical power production by nuclear fusion is virtually around the corner even though this is as far from the case as ever. The article failed to mention the secondary energy generated by the hot air of politicians. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/135 "2023-12-22T05:48:53Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > … a sloppily written article with little substance … Which differentiates it from _every fucking other_ article on the subject – how? Where can you find well written, substantive, realistic articles on fusion power, outside of _maybe_ the likes of Sci-Am? And who even reads Sci-Am?        Practical nuclear physics is difficult and expensive, so the researchers have a tendency to feed us pies taken directly from the ionosphere, heavily seasoned with BS so that we will fund their work. They are not _per se_ scam artistes, but they kind of are, by necessity. We need to convince the press to keep away from these stories. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/136 "2023-12-22T06:07:15Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > We need to convince the press to keep away from these stories. Wait, what? We need good science press. Apparently this wasn’t that, but not reporting at all is stupid. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/137 "2023-12-22T06:11:06Z")
Not reporting at all sounds more sensible to me than reporting ignorant bullshit. Good science press is all well and good, but this material needs to be kept away from NYT, CNN, _et al_, because they end up distorting the hell out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/138 "2023-12-22T14:23:47Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > the researchers have a tendency to That would be the communications teams that the researchers’ bosses hire. I try not to interact with them. ---
**Author:** ![HoneyBadgerDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honeybadgerdc/32/1033_2.png) [@HoneyBadgerDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HoneyBadgerDC)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/139 "2023-12-22T14:34:26Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Nah, it just tells us that the research funding is never sustained for as long as it’d need to be. Exactly too many resources are being thrown at low potential projects just to satiate peoples need to do " Something" ---
**Author:** ![Baal\_Houtham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baal_houtham/32/13604_2.png) [@Baal\_Houtham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baal_Houtham)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349/140 "2023-12-22T14:36:47Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > That would be the communications teams that the researchers’ bosses hire. I try not to interact with them. Yepper. Isn’t it frustrating to have a technical question and get routed to a sales rep, PR person, or account exec, rather than the person who really knows the answer? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apparent-nuclear-fusion-power-breakthrough-net-energy-gain-breaking-news-11-dec-22/976349.md?page=8)