# Apple Computer: You're kidding, right? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 23, 2001, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145 "2001-10-23T19:11:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/41 "2001-10-24T22:48:04Z")
The iPod’s “digital rights management” system isn’t a big deal, as explained in [this CNET article](http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1006-200-7627927.html): > [@](#): > > The device does not use a digital-rights management scheme. > > **When it auto-syncs to iTunes, the iPod can only connect to one copy of the software on one Mac. But a manual mode allows the device to share songs between any number of Macs.** > > However, Jobs said Apple does not condone stealing music. In fact, he said, the company spent $50,000 on CDs to go along with review copies of the unit so that Apple would not be promoting piracy. > > The iPod does come wrapped in plastic with a warning in English, French, German and Japanese that states, “Don’t steal music.” > > “Piracy is not a technological issue. It’s a behavior issue,” Jobs said, adding that all the encryption schemes that have been developed can also be broken. > > He added that Apple tried to go out of its way to show its concern for artists’ copyrights, despite the relatively open nature of its hardware. > > “We own a lot of intellectual property ourselves. We’re one of the few companies in the industry that does,” he said. ---
**Author:** ![Chas.E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e99b99/32.png) [@Chas.E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chas.E)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/42 "2001-10-25T00:26:13Z")
Yeah, it looks like the DRM is more of a token gesture. It appears that Apple will store music in a hidden directory which will take all of 10 seconds to get around. But we shall see how all this is handled when iTunes2 ships. Anyway, I just heard a report that the miniature 5Mb drive used in the iPod retails for $400 just by itself, so now we know where most of the expense came from. Other hard disk based mp3 players use a cheaper, larger drive. ---
**Author:** ![ElwoodCuse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/edb3f5/32.png) [@ElwoodCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElwoodCuse)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/43 "2001-10-25T00:57:17Z")
[Simpsons] _What_ Computers? [/Simpsons] ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/44 "2001-10-25T01:18:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\*To clarify: > > > [@](#): > > > > The largest disk I’ve seen before this was the 1-gig IBM microdrive… > > I meant, of course, the largest _miniature_ (i.e.- Compactflash/Smartmedia card sized) disk. I just know that some shmuck (like Fenris :D) would’ve come along and point out the existence of 100-gig drives… \*\* Oh, please. Buncha fuckin’ pikers. I shot a job once that allowed me to be next to a TerraByte jukebox. It snatched TerraByte Disks from their individual clips using a high-speed robot arm, dropped down, rotated them 180\* and inserted them into the equally kick-ass high speed reader. **TERRA BYTE**. You do the math. Fucking BIG amount of data. Tough to walk around with in your pocket, but it does beat the pants off of a 100-gig drive. Cartooniverse, to whome size means nothing 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/45 "2001-10-25T01:19:50Z")
Well, we played around with one last week at Apple’s ADR lab, and I thought it was pretty cool, especially the UI. I’m a little worried that the pricepoint is too high, much like the Cube. I see no one has posted a link to [this](http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/39/22429.html) - apparently Intel already has a product on the market called “iPOD” - gotta love that Mac marketing department. My favorite Jobs quote from the CNET article: “We own a lot of intellectual property ourselves. We’re one of the few companies in the industry that does.” Huh? ---
**Author:** ![Tyklfe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3e96dc/32.png) [@Tyklfe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tyklfe)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/46 "2001-10-25T01:33:02Z")
Hmm… Well, I’ve got ~10GB of MP3s on just _one_ of my machines, but I just don’t think I could find a use for this thing that something else dosn’t already do… Oh yeah, I gotta do the angry geek thing… Apple Blows! MS rocks! Thank you for your time ---
**Author:** ![Tyklfe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3e96dc/32.png) [@Tyklfe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tyklfe)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/47 "2001-10-25T01:43:23Z")
\*\* > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > > > [@](#): > > > > The largest disk I’ve seen before this was the 1-gig IBM microdrive… > > I meant, of course, the largest _miniature_ (i.e.- Compactflash/Smartmedia card sized) disk. I just know that some shmuck (like Fenris :D) would’ve come along and point out the existence of 100-gig drives… \*\* Suposedly in 2003 IBM is releasing a 125GB _ **Holographic Memory Cube** _ which they say will one day be able to hold up to a terabyte of data. You can read about it [Here](http://www.howstuffworks.com/holographic-memory.htm/printable). ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/48 "2001-10-25T05:23:18Z")
> [@](#): > > TERRA BYTE. You do the math. Fucking BIG amount of data. Tough to walk around with in your pocket, but it does beat the pants off of a 100-gig drive. I guess I should have clarified even further and used the word “affordable to your average Joe”. > [@](#): > > Suposedly in 2003 IBM is releasing a 125GB Holographic Memory Cube which they say will one day be able to hold up to a terabyte of data. Please state the nature of the medical emergency… ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2001, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/49 "2001-10-25T20:08:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dooku \* > I’m a little worried that the pricepoint is too high, much like the Cube. I think once they start mass-producing them, economies of scale will allow Apple to knock $50-$100 off the price. A $100 price drop would make it much more reasonable, IMO. > [@](#): > > I see no one has posted a link to [this](http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/39/22429.html) - apparently Intel already has a product on the market called “iPOD” - gotta love that Mac marketing department. If the products are sufficiently different, there’s no conflict in using the same name for two different items. That’s why you can use “Rio” for an MP3 player and a Las Vegas hotel, for instance. > [@](#): > > My favorite Jobs quote from the CNET article: “We own a lot of intellectual property ourselves. We’re one of the few companies in the industry that does.” Not the clearest statement in the world, but probably true – Apple used to spend _years_ on R&D that went nowhere, and even now they have some patents that haven’t come to light yet. Heck, they’re still sitting on the handwriting recognition software from the Newton, aren’t they? ---
**Author:** ![beergeek279](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@beergeek279](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beergeek279)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2001, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/50 "2001-10-26T04:47:59Z")
> [@](#): > > Consider: As an MP3 player, it’s certainly not an obvious winner. But how many MP3 players give gigabites of storage, fit in a hip pocket, and runs for ten hours on one battery charge? The iPod is the only MP3 player to offer all of these advantages, and they’re not superficial. Sure, you can carry around several dozen minidiscs with your MP3 library, but you’ll have to juggle discs to switch tunes, while the iPod has it all at your fingertips. And the Nomad Jukebox is twice the size of the iPod and only runs for 3.5 hours on its batteries, IIRC. Plus the iPod is the only mp3 player that you can get with supermarket receipts ;). ---
**Author:** ![JonScribe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3be4f8/32.png) [@JonScribe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JonScribe)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2001, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/51 "2001-10-26T05:58:30Z")
Coming next from Apple: iZod Polo shirts in five colors with a little Mac on the breast pocket. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2001, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/52 "2001-10-26T16:35:36Z")
Well apparently Apple has responded to the concerns about the [price point](http://homepage.mac.com/toasters/humor/ipodlc/index.html) of the iPod. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Gazoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/67e7ee/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Gazoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Gazoo)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2001, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/53 "2001-10-26T17:42:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bernse \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by The Great Gazoo \* > > \*\* > > This thing is great. 1000 songs x 3 minutes per song = 3000 minutes = 50 hours of music. That’s 50 hours. I think it’s more of a hard drive than an MP3 player which uses memory chips to store the data, so that may not be perfect. Is it susceptible to skipping is my question. > > > > A lot of people (me!) would like to be able to carry 50 hours of music or books on tape around with us. And it doubles as a 5 gig hard drive. Seems like a pretty fast hard drive too. > > \*\* > > Or, you could buy a MP3 capable CD player for a couple hundred bucks (or something like that) and buy 700MB blank CDs for about 40 cents each that can hold about 150 or so songs. \*\* Ah, but you are missing the point. With this, I don’t have to carry around anything. No CDs, no Mini-Discs, nothing. Just the iPod. Which, to me, is a big bonus. Also, to access the songs, you go to a menu. No searching around in your pockets for the correct disc. Another big bonus. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2001, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/54 "2001-10-26T22:53:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Ah, but you are missing the point. With this, I don’t have to carry around anything. No CDs, no Mini-Discs, nothing. Just the iPod. Which, to me, is a big bonus. Also, to access the songs, you go to a menu. No searching around in your pockets for the correct disc. Another big bonus. Ah, but you are missing the counterpoint. My argument (and, I’m assuming, the argument of others) is that the extra convenience of the iPod is not worth the extra $200-$300 that you need to spend. ---
**Author:** ![bernse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@bernse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bernse)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2001, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/55 "2001-10-27T04:17:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Great Gazoo \* > \*\* > Ah, but you are missing the point. With this, I don’t have to carry around anything. No CDs, no Mini-Discs, nothing. Just the iPod. Which, to me, is a big bonus. Also, to access the songs, you go to a menu. No searching around in your pockets for the correct disc. Another big bonus. \*\* No, my friend, you are! 🙂 Carrying iPOD = Carrying CD player. Disk with 150 songs already in player. Hence, nothing else to carry. For the $250 your saving, you can hire someone to carry your extra CDs if you want to bring them with you (just in case 150 songs isn’t enough for your jog). ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2001, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/56 "2001-10-29T02:32:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bernse \* > **Carrying iPOD = Carrying CD player.** Ah, sorry, but thanks for playing. The correct answer is “Carrying iPod = Carrying a deck of cards.” Check the [specs from Apple’s site.](http://www.apple.com/ipod/) Vanna has consolation prizes in the back… ---
**Author:** ![red\_dragon60](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ce73a5/32.png) [@red\_dragon60](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/red_dragon60)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2001, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/57 "2001-10-29T02:42:48Z")
C’mon linux geeks, sexy smooth windows is just a partition away… I read too much of Joy of Linux. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Gazoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/67e7ee/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Gazoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Gazoo)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2001, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/58 "2001-10-29T23:22:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > Ah, but you are missing the point. With this, I don’t have to carry around anything. No CDs, no Mini-Discs, nothing. Just the iPod. Which, to me, is a big bonus. Also, to access the songs, you go to a menu. No searching around in your pockets for the correct disc. Another big bonus. > > Ah, but you are missing the counterpoint. My argument (and, I’m assuming, the argument of others) is that the extra convenience of the iPod is not worth the extra $200-$300 that you need to spend. \*\* You can’t buy an MP3 player that holds 1,000 songs for $100-$200. My Intel ($299) which has 128Megs, can put about 100 songs on it, in the lower quality range. If you can somehow find one that can put 1,000 songs on it for that cheap, you should jump all over it and post where you found it here. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Gazoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/67e7ee/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Gazoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Gazoo)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2001, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/59 "2001-10-29T23:29:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bernse \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by The Great Gazoo \* > > \*\* > > Ah, but you are missing the point. With this, I don’t have to carry around anything. No CDs, no Mini-Discs, nothing. Just the iPod. Which, to me, is a big bonus. Also, to access the songs, you go to a menu. No searching around in your pockets for the correct disc. Another big bonus. \*\* > > No, my friend, you are! 🙂 > > Carrying iPOD = Carrying CD player. Disk with 150 songs already in player. Hence, nothing else to carry. > > For the $250 your saving, you can hire someone to carry your extra CDs if you want to bring them with you (just in case 150 songs isn’t enough for your jog). \*\* Sorry, you still are. You should go to the Apple site. It’s not a CD player, it’s not large. And 150 songs is not enough! It’s not even close. Does your CD collection hold only 150 songs? This can be your whole music system in the palm of your hand. The convenience of having any song you want 2 menu clicks away. That’s definitely worth the price. For some of us, the convenience of MP3s (and especially Books On Tape uploaded to MP3s) is well worth the money. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2001, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145/60 "2001-10-30T00:54:12Z")
This just in: a [comparison chart](http://ipod.kentidwell.com/) listing respective features of the iPod, the Nomad Jukebox, the Personal Jukebox PJB-100, and the Archos Jukebox. I loved this quote from the PJB-100 site: “I have about 900 mp3 files on my hardrive - It took me barely 4 hours to copy them all down onto the PJB.” Four HOURS?! Christ. There’s an argument for Firewire if ever there was one… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/apple-computer-youre-kidding-right/89145.md?page=4)