# Arafat's dead. Now what? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 11, 2004, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153 "2004-11-11T04:27:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/41 "2004-11-11T14:14:59Z")
> [@Rashak Mani](#): > > … Now what ? Now Bush has an opening to try and fix the palestinian situation… and I doubt he will take it or if he does try… he will fail miserably. Despite Blair’s visit and tenacity in bringing the subject to the White House. What opening does Bush have right now that wasn’t available when Arafat was alive? With Arafat you had someone to negotiate with though he was either unwilling or unable to stop attacking Israel. There’s only so much the United States can do until both Israel and the Palestinians decide they want peace. Marc ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/42 "2004-11-11T14:24:28Z")
> [@Rashak Mani](#): > > I could have sworn a lot of people were pissed at palestinians that comemorated 9/11… and alas… now we see once again people comemorating other people’s suffering. Things never change it seems… sad. **Rashak Mani** , Do you honestly mean to tell me that you cannot see any difference between the murder of 3000+ innocent people and the death of someone who murdered (directly and indirectly) thousands of people? You can honestly equivicate the deaths of 3000+ people who died premature and horrific deaths and the death of one man, peacefully in his bed, at a respectable age, who denied that same fate to so many others? I’m sorry, but there are some people who are, (admittedly) IMHO so evil, that the removal of them from further interference in human affairs is far more a cause to have optimism and hope (and yes, even to celebrate) than to mourn. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![MMI](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/53a042/32.png) [@MMI](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MMI)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/43 "2004-11-11T14:47:09Z")
wrt the OP. Ideally everyone pretends that Arafat was the entirety of the problem (while perhaps publicly lauding him as a fallen peacemaker), declare a mulligan, and uses the opportunity to work out some sort of modus vivendi. Realistically, it depends on how things go inside the Palestinian camp. If some sort of internal Palestinian power sharing arrangement can be worked out peacefull, the we are a little better off then before. All of the same issues exist between Israel and the Palestinians, but now with a less objectionable/polarizing face on the Palestinian side than has been the case previously (although I would guess that most of the Palestinian Authorities leadership could be tagged with a label associating them with terrorism, so YMMV). If a non-peaceful Palestianian power struggle occurs than it’s pretty much all bad - how can a Palestinian leader maintain his intifada bonafides while killing other Palestinians other than by simultaneously killing (or encouraging resistance to) Israelis? ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/44 "2004-11-11T15:44:33Z")
Arafat was an obstacle to any real peace. Not the only obstacle but a significant one. On that I think most here agree. While he was in place there was no chance for a real peace settlement and no chance for a Palestinian state. Only continuation of Arafat’s feifdom. I also celebrate that now there is a slim chance of an alternative. Will what emerges be less or more of an obstacle than Arafat? Without Arafat chopping him off at the knees will Abbas be able to develop and excercise real power? Will someone or something else emerge? If what emerges can deliver the goods … if what emerges can realize that water rights, tax sharing, co-development of tourism and other industries, etc. means more for the success of a future Palestine than a few square miles here or there … if what emerges can sell that to _enough_ of the populus … then this slim chance will be realized. If not it is no worse than it is now. A slim chance is better than none and is cause to celebrate. Rejoice? Maybe not. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/45 "2004-11-11T22:34:08Z")
> [@zev\_steinhardt](#): > > Celebrate and rejoice. > > Zev Steinhardt I’m shocked. There’s a Jewish folktale about the crossing of the Red Sea. The Jews have finished crossing. G-d closes the waters on the pursuing Egyptians. The angels begin dancing and singing. G-d shouts at them “How can you rejoice? My children are drowning!” On Purim, we are taught not to celebrate that Haman died, but that Esther, Mordechai and the other Jews survived. Yassir Arafat was a bastard who cared only about getting money and power for himself and his cronies. I rejoice that the Palestinians will have a new leader, one who (G-d willing) will really care about them and about gaining a lasting peace. I do not rejoice that a man has died. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/46 "2004-11-11T22:38:52Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > A rigorous, incisive reading of my posts in this thread will probably convince you I think of Pinochet as I thought of Arafat. I believe **SentientMeat** was referring to you implying that Pinochet was Argentinian ;). - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/47 "2004-11-11T22:51:26Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > I’m shocked. OK, OK, I’m willing to admit that I was a bit over the top. However, God is far more merciful than I am. I won’t be crying over Arafat’s grave going “A man has died, woe is us!” Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/48 "2004-11-11T23:17:51Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > I believe **SentientMeat** was referring to you implying that Pinochet was Argentinian Yeah. Yeah. Argentine, Chile. Hob, Bob. I got the continent right, did’n I? Ok, lost the temper there for a moment. Back to default ironic – suits the 21 century so much better. But you know what, I’m still pretty miffed with having been forced to pay for Arafat’s wife’s luxurious upkeep in Paris. And absolutely morally outraged that I’ve been forced by my taxes to further terrorism and line the pockets of a corrupt non-leader. I suppose, staying in Argentine\*, it can be compared to how some Americans feel being forced to fund CIA’s work re. Pinochet. Dirty. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/49 "2004-11-11T23:45:30Z")
wow Sam, I’m going to have to dig up your reaction when Reagan died, or more importantly your reaction to other people’s reaction. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/50 "2004-11-12T00:03:55Z")
Well, from a personal perspective I’m not too worked up about Arafat’s demise one way or the other. I saw him as basically a jumped up terrorist to be honest…someone who tried (and failed) to make himself a ‘statesman’. I’m shedding no tears, but I’m not jumping for joy either…he just wasn’t worth that much reguard either way. As to what now…I’d say more of the same. Obviously there will be a power struggle for the top leadership. Reguardless of how it falls out I seriously doubt there will be any significant changes there…just more of the same with a new face. I HOPE I’m pleasantly surprised, and that whoever comes to power is willing (and able) to negotiate in good faith and is willing to meet the Israelis half way…AND work with the US at the same time. But I’m not holding my breath. -XT ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/51 "2004-11-12T00:53:11Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > In fairness, the Palestinians were celebrating the deaths of thousands of innocents. Not quite the same as celebrating the death of a man who was an obstacle to peace. Don’t forget either that Arafat died peacefully, of natural causes, in a clean bed, after a long life. It was more than he deserved. That option was denied an awful lot of people whose deaths the Palestinians celebrated. I say, join me in a drink, a toast, and the hope that he really IS dead this time. Good riddance to bad rubbish. If he comes back again, I will supply a nice sharp wooden stake. Any slayers here? ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/52 "2004-11-12T01:10:22Z")
Damn, I was hoping he’d take Sharon with him. Guess we’ll just have a power struggle and more shooting. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/53 "2004-11-12T20:53:12Z")
Look, can we stop arguing about whether Arafat was a hero or a monster or both? The important thing is he’s now **dead,** therefore no longer a factor. But the Palestinians remain, and the Israelis remain, and all the troubles of their relationships remain. Without Arafat, who’s going to lead the Palestinians? Will the leadership of the Palestinian Authority henceforth be separate from that of the PLO? And what does that mean for the prospects of Palestinian independence? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/54 "2004-11-12T21:15:15Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Will the leadership of the Palestinian Authority henceforth be separate from that of the PLO? Yeah, they’ve already announced it. Abbas is taking over the PLO, and Qureia the PA. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/55 "2004-11-12T21:26:49Z")
The band that gave us Mamma Mia and Dancing Queen will lead the PLO? Have you got a cite for that? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/56 "2004-11-12T21:34:38Z")
The death of Arafat was the PLO’s Waterloo. 🙂 No, I’m talking about abu Mazen, Mahmood Abbas. > **[Yahoo News - Latest News & Headlines](https://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=%2Fap%2F20041111%2Fap_on_re_mi_ea%2Fpalestinians_succession_14)** > > The latest news and headlines from Yahoo! News. Get breaking news stories and in-depth coverage with videos and photos. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/57 "2004-11-12T21:35:10Z")
Suha Arafat (widow of Yasir) will get $22 million/year, for life! What a sweet deal! Death, where is thy sting? This is sick-Palestinian children live in squalid poverty=and the goat-man’swidow laughs all the way to the bank! ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/58 "2004-11-12T21:44:15Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Suha Arafat (widow of Yasir) will get $22 million/year, for life! What a sweet deal! > Death, where is thy sting? > This is sick-Palestinian children live in squalid poverty=and the goat-man’swidow laughs all the way to the bank! I recommend that my $100,000 cap wealth redistribution plan be put into action immediately. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/59 "2004-11-12T21:48:00Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > I recommend that my $100,000 cap wealth redistribution plan be put into action immediately. Bummer you aren’t in charge, ehe? 🙂 BTW, I agree with SELECTIVELY enforcing your arbitrary $100k cap on Arafat’s widow. Go for it! 😉 -XT ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2004, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153/60 "2004-11-12T22:16:52Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Suha Arafat (widow of Yasir) will get $22 million/year, for life! What a sweet deal! > Death, where is thy sting? > This is sick-Palestinian children live in squalid poverty=and the goat-man’swidow laughs all the way to the bank! Strange that you pick this instance to be outraged at unequal distribution of wealth. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arafats-dead-now-what/274153.md?page=4)